2015's Top 20 Series in Japan

daniel_gudman

KING (In Land of Blind)
Staff member
#2
I didn't think so?

It was basically a grab-bag of popular shounen titles, with a smattering of seinen.
 

Contrabardus

Well-Known Member
#3
Agreed. None of these is a particular surprise.

It's an interesting list though. Just nothing in particular came to mind really that got me going 'that made it?' or 'OMG this should have been there'. Especially considering it was a sales numbers list based entirely around tankobon popularity and doesn't seem take into account anthology sales like Jump or Shonen Sunday.
 

da_fox2279

California Crackpot
#4
Is there a reason Tokyo Ghoul is on there twice? Did the series end and then start over again, with a new series?
 

Contrabardus

Well-Known Member
#5
da_fox2279 said:
Is there a reason Tokyo Ghoul is on there twice? Did the series end and then start over again, with a new series?
It's not clear, but it's because one is a spinoff , it'sTokyo Ghoul and Tokyo Ghoul: Re, not Tokyo Ghoul being double listed.
 

~NGD OMEGA~

Well-Known Member
#6
Neither Bleach Nor Toriko are on there. All is well.
 

da_fox2279

California Crackpot
#7
Contrabardus said:
da_fox2279 said:
Is there a reason Tokyo Ghoul is on there twice? Did the series end and then start over again, with a new series?
It's not clear, but it's because one is a spinoff , it'sTokyo Ghoul and Tokyo Ghoul: Re, not Tokyo Ghoul being double listed.
Oh. I thought TG: Re was a sequel/continuation, like DBZ. Thanks for clearing that up.
 

~NGD OMEGA~

Well-Known Member
#8
It's pretty much a sequel/continuation. Granted technically it's focusing heavily on the hunter guys moreso than the main cast in the last one, especially since Kaneki broke free from the alt personality bullshit (Maybe, something more complex may be going on because poor loli girl), since more focus has been placed on the squad he raised rather than him, but it's basically continuing on from where the first left off.
 

Contrabardus

Well-Known Member
#9
~NGD OMEGA~ said:
It's pretty much a sequel/continuation. Granted technically it's focusing heavily on the hunter guys moreso than the main cast in the last one, especially since Kaneki broke free from the alt personality bullshit (Maybe, something more complex may be going on because poor loli girl), since more focus has been placed on the squad he raised rather than him, but it's basically continuing on from where the first left off.
The shift in focus to a different group of characters in the same world makes it a spin off. That's what a spin off is. Re is like what AD Police was to BGC. The cast of the other series has a presence, but the plot deliberately shifts away from them as the focus. It's a bit more murky and blurs the line between sequel and continuation and spin off a bit, but it's more spin off than sequel really.

I'd liken it to some of the Bat-Family comics that star characters like Bat-Girl, Robin, or Nigthwing. Batman is usually there in some capacity directly nor indirectly, but it's not really a main series Batman book, but a spin off comic that uses the same characters and world with a main focus on other non-Bruce Wayne characters. Definitely related to Batman as a franchise, but not really about him either.
 

~NGD OMEGA~

Well-Known Member
#10
Uh, no. A continuation literally entails picking up where the last story left of, with the intent of closing off any loose ends but generally just creating a bunch more. A Spinoff quite literally entails taking existing content in the world and going on a side tangent with the story that otherwise couldn't be covered in the main story line. For example, the Fairy Tail side stories covering Gray, the First Master, Gajeel, and Sting and Rogue? All Sidestories, little mini tangents that otherwise the main narrative generally wouldn't have stopped to go over in anything but the briefest overview if necessary. Hell, Tokyo Ghoul also has an actual Spin Off with the story detailing the origin of the badass hunter and his one super mook guy who follows him.

Re: though? It's literally a continuation. Tokyo Ghoul could literally have not ended at all, and the next chapter could have been the first chapter of this one, and baring the whole amnesia thing which even as is with the split is in itself pretty lame even if interesting things were done with it and it didn't last that long, not much would have been off. We're literally covering the same plot threads we didn't clear the last time with One Eye, the gang, and of course whatever the hell the doctor's been doing. Even if we're focusing more heavily on the Hunters, putting the side characters to the side ALREADY happened in the main storyline when Kaneki left the coffee place for good, so the shift in focus of characters is already internally consistent with what already happened. Hell we're even following the same friggin main character (mostly), so you can't even argue that on similar grounds to how you could indeed argue Immortal Regis's Betrayal of a continuation.

This is a continuation. An oddity of one to be sure with maybe some minor elements of a spin off you could definitely twist to support that, but to say this is more spin off than continuation is moronic at best, and willfully ignorant otherwise.
 

Contrabardus

Well-Known Member
#11
~NGD OMEGA~ said:
Uh, no. A continuation literally entails picking up where the last story left of, with the intent of closing off any loose ends but generally just creating a bunch more. A Spinoff quite literally entails taking existing content in the world and going on a side tangent with the story that otherwise couldn't be covered in the main story line. For example, the Fairy Tail side stories covering Gray, the First Master, Gajeel, and Sting and Rogue? All Sidestories, little mini tangents that otherwise the main narrative generally wouldn't have stopped to go over in anything but the briefest overview if necessary. Hell, Tokyo Ghoul also has an actual Spin Off with the story detailing the origin of the badass hunter and his one super mook guy who follows him.

Re: though? It's literally a continuation. Tokyo Ghoul could literally have not ended at all, and the next chapter could have been the first chapter of this one, and baring the whole amnesia thing which even as is with the split is in itself pretty lame even if interesting things were done with it and it didn't last that long, not much would have been off. We're literally covering the same plot threads we didn't clear the last time with One Eye, the gang, and of course whatever the hell the doctor's been doing. Even if we're focusing more heavily on the Hunters, putting the side characters to the side ALREADY happened in the main storyline when Kaneki left the coffee place for good, so the shift in focus of characters is already internally consistent with what already happened. Hell we're even following the same friggin main character (mostly), so you can't even argue that on similar grounds to how you could indeed argue Immortal Regis's Betrayal of a continuation.

This is a continuation. An oddity of one to be sure with maybe some minor elements of a spin off you could definitely twist to support that, but to say this is more spin off than continuation is moronic at best, and willfully ignorant otherwise.
"Moronic and willfully ignorant" are a gross exaggeration.

For starters, this isn't an absolute either or situation. I did say that it's a murky combination of the two, and that's really what it is. Still say it's more spin off than sequel if only because of the shift in focus and tone.

My Bat family analogy covers it pretty well. The spin off comics often directly continue plotlines and stories from the main books, tie up or continue threads from them, and often have almost identical casts of characters, but they are still spin off books.

Tokyo Ghoul Re is a mixture of both spin off and sequel, but at the end of the day it is its own thing and a different story that separates itself from the original at the same time as continuing the threads from it. This is not a black or white thing and there is no reason why it can't be both. I just think it leans more towards spin off than sequel because of the focus shift.
 

seitora

Well-Known Member
#12
Not too surprised that One Piece did so well, from what I understand that series is ginormous over there.

No Bleach though LOL
 

~NGD OMEGA~

Well-Known Member
#13
Still say it's more spin off than sequel if only because of the shift in focus and tone.
What shift in tone? That the world is awful and it sucks to be Kaneki? In case you missed it, he literally was a corpse with both eyes gouged out at the end of the first one going on about how his story was a tragedy, only to have this one start up with him mind wiped and made to follow the hunter side, where things still get worse and it still sucks to be Kaneki. There's no shift in tone whatsoever. There's no shift in narrative whatsoever, the big plot hooks still mirror and reflect the loose ends from the last series. There's a minor shift in focus to the hunter side of things, sure I grant that, but that's consistent with a similar shift in focus from the coffee group to Kaneki's Ghoul Death squad. And at the end of the day, there's no 'real' shift in leads either, baring again the memory wipe thing which again they might have just reverted, maybe.

All of that is consistent. This is a continuation, plain and simple. You have one minor point here you can indeed argue for spin off, but at the end of the day literally everything else is pointing against you. You might have more leeway if we were discussing Immortal Regis's betrayal of a continuation, that changed everything from plot, tone, characters, to even the friggin lead and only later managed to actually properly tie the two together though even then it was too late. Here however you have no leg to stand on.

Edit: Actually neglected to debunk your Batman comparison, because really it's kinda self explanatory by itself given the vast amounts of differences involved in these two cases, much less two mediums, but just to be thorough, Tokyo Ghoul literally went from Concluding and ending one series, to starting up the same story again. Your Batman example not only has multiple writers and books involved, all running at the same time, but also does occasional one offs and what not. Yes you can definitely call those spinoffs, they run concurrent to the story, similar to my Fairy Tail examples earlier. Here however we literally have one thing ending, and another picking up where it left off. This is a continuation. No ifs ands or buts.
 

Contrabardus

Well-Known Member
#14
~NGD OMEGA~ said:
Still say it's more spin off than sequel if only because of the shift in focus and tone.
What shift in tone? That the world is awful and it sucks to be Kaneki? In case you missed it, he literally was a corpse with both eyes gouged out at the end of the first one going on about how his story was a tragedy, only to have this one start up with him mind wiped and made to follow the hunter side, where things still get worse and it still sucks to be Kaneki. There's no shift in tone whatsoever. There's no shift in narrative whatsoever, the big plot hooks still mirror and reflect the loose ends from the last series. There's a minor shift in focus to the hunter side of things, sure I grant that, but that's consistent with a similar shift in focus from the coffee group to Kaneki's Ghoul Death squad. And at the end of the day, there's no 'real' shift in leads either, baring again the memory wipe thing which again they might have just reverted, maybe.

All of that is consistent. This is a continuation, plain and simple. You have one minor point here you can indeed argue for spin off, but at the end of the day literally everything else is pointing against you. You might have more leeway if we were discussing Immortal Regis's betrayal of a continuation, that changed everything from plot, tone, characters, to even the friggin lead and only later managed to actually properly tie the two together though even then it was too late. Here however you have no leg to stand on.

Edit: Actually neglected to debunk your Batman comparison, because really it's kinda self explanatory by itself given the vast amounts of differences involved in these two cases, much less two mediums, but just to be thorough, Tokyo Ghoul literally went from Concluding and ending one series, to starting up the same story again. Your Batman example not only has multiple writers and books involved, all running at the same time, but also does occasional one offs and what not. Yes you can definitely call those spinoffs, they run concurrent to the story, similar to my Fairy Tail examples earlier. Here however we literally have one thing ending, and another picking up where it left off. This is a continuation. No ifs ands or buts.
You've still neglected to 'debunk' anything. The differences aren't enough to make it an apples to oranges comparison in this context, and are largely cultural. You're misusing the term 'debunk' here, and I realize it's intentional because you want to sound as if you've finalized something. You haven't, at best this is a rebuttal and nothing more.

As for the rest, so what? The only thing you've proven here is that we don't see it the same way, not that anything I've said is wrong.

That's kind of my point here. This is all arbitrary and not an 'it is or is not' situation. You're set in your perception and that's fine, but ultimately it broke off from the original story and retitled itself for a reason. TG:Re is what it is, and there's nothing you can prove or disprove here in regard to how someone else sees it. That's kind of how art works.

You'll notice I never said 'you are wrong', only that I don't see it the same way you do and don't agree with your assessment. That's deliberate and I've said from the start that TG:Re lies in the gray area between spin off and sequel. You can't prove that isn't true because it's an arbitrary thing that can't really be nailed down in this case. You've even admitted yourself that it has elements of both.

You have nothing to prove here, this isn't something you get to decide either way for anyone but yourself.
 

raedric

Well-Known Member
#15
Contra says they're pineapples, NGD says they're oranges...I say they're both fruit. So take a bit and enjoy those juices, gentlemen...no matter how citrus-y.
 

daniel_gudman

KING (In Land of Blind)
Staff member
#16
Pretty sure it's Yowamushi Pedal that's getting propped up by the Fujoshi demographic though
 

Contrabardus

Well-Known Member
#17
daniel_gudman said:
Pretty sure it's Yowamushi Pedal that's getting propped up by the Fujoshi demographic though
Isn't there always at least one?

A lot of other manga get a boost from this demo too, but there's usually at least one on lists like this that's pretty blatantly appealing to that set.

Though, for what it's worth, Yowamushi Pedal is pretty formulaic for sports/game manga. Awkward and nerdy otaku protag discovers that they are stupidly good at x sport or game for some mundane reason and gets pressured into joining a team or club because of it, a girl is somehow related that he either has a crush on, or doesn't get along with at first, or both. Hijinks ensue.

I've watched a bit of this in anime form, and it's halfway decent and doesn't lay on the homoeroticism too thickly. I didn't make it through the first season really, but not because there was anything wrong with it in particular. Just didn't hook me because I'm not really into the sports manga scene. I can appreciate a good one and don't mind checking one out if it's getting enough good reviews, but I usually don't stick with them long.

My problem with manga and anime like this is that they usually kind of wear thin after a while and tend to run longer than the premise can support my interest for.

This one does have that quality about it though. It's not really blatant boy's love, but does intentionally give that vibe for those types of readers to read between the lines without too much stretching. At least, it wasn't as far as I made it into it anyway.

EDIT: Decided to have a look at an episode of the second season of this just because of this. Yeah. This is total Fujoshi bait. It's gotten much worse since when it started about that. It started out as a standard sports manga with mild hints of it, but it's not even trying to be slightly subtle about it anymore.
 
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