Ranma ½ Baby Goliath and the Ugly Duckling

[shioran toushin]

well, in Canon Usagi became just and expy for Sailor Moon and then 'Princess Serenity', she accepted that the identity of Serenity was more important than 'Usagi' because most of if not all of the issues from the series were caused or solved thanks to their 'previous incarnations' AKA being the Princess of the Moon Kingdom and Wielder of the SIlver Crystal and Future Ruler of a semi-desolate World and then the thing with cosmos-chaos.
in canon here was a time that Usagi saw herself as Serenity first, Usagi as a 'cover identity'.
IMHO in this Fic she just sees herself as Usagi First and everything else as a past life that is the past (useful, but not life defining personality or identity as in canon).

 

[zane]

Aa man I came in here hoping there was another snippet of goodness. Any eta on the next bit? That cliffhanger is eating away at me.

 

[wyldeakasha]

well, in Canon Usagi became just and expy for Sailor Moon and then 'Princess Serenity', she accepted that the identity of Serenity was more important than 'Usagi' because most of if not all of the issues from the series were caused or solved thanks to their 'previous incarnations' AKA being the Princess of the Moon Kingdom and Wielder of the SIlver Crystal and Future Ruler of a semi-desolate World and then the thing with cosmos-chaos.
in canon here was a time that Usagi saw herself as Serenity first, Usagi as a 'cover identity'.
IMHO in this Fic she just sees herself as Usagi First and everything else as a past life that is the past (useful, but not life defining personality or identity as in canon).

I'm not following you too well with this --- I think you are using 'Expy' wrong.  An Expy is a "a character from one series who is unambiguously and deliberately based on a character in another, older series".  For example, Usagi is an expy of Minako from Codename Sailor V - though this turned out to be a very rare example of an expy meeting the original character when Sailor Venus showed up.  In terms of fandom, an expy is a character who resembles the original canon character in basic characteristics (name, appearance, etc.) but has wildly different personality traits - so much so that it might as well be a different, original character. 

Usagi cannot be an expy of herself, no matter what her perceptions of her identity may be.  That's kinda like saying that if Peter Parker gave up his civilian identity because being Spider-Man full time was more important, then Peter becomes an expy of Spider-Man; it doesn't work that way, Peter is still himself.  Or, for a more real world example; a person (Stephanie) enters a Disassociative Fugue state, she moves across state, forgets her previous identity, and takes on a new identity; this person - let's say Jane - does not become an expy of Stephanie.  Jane *is* Stephanie.  Typically, memories are recovered after a while, as Jane starts to remember more of her past she may experience confusion over her identity - but ultimately, whether she chooses to go home and 'be Stephanie' or remain in her new city and 'be Jane' doesn't change the fact that she's still the same person.

Usagi's situation is a little more complex - reincarnation, cosmic horror enemies, and all - but she's still Usagi throughout the entire series, regardless of what name she chooses to go by.  And she does choose - she chose *not* to 'be Princess Serenity' and not to revive the Moon Kingdom at the end of the first Arc.  That she experienced some confusion over her identity when her memories as Serenity came back doesn't change that she was still Usagi.  That she recognizes that Sailor Moon is needed, is important to the safety of her friends/family/world doesn't make her less Usagi.  If you recall, Sailor Moon didn't exist and wasn't supposed to exist before Usagi transformed for the first time - in fact, Chibi-Usa is said to be the real Sailor Moon (since Usagi was Sailor Cosmos all along).  That she eventually comes to accept the future she's shown doesn't change the fact that she, Usagi, made a choice - she could have rejected it, just like she rejected the Moon Kingdom. 

Also, to address your statement of everything coming from/resolved by previous incarnations -- it doesn't matter who the previous incarnations were; Princess Serenity's problems were also inherited - each of her enemies in that life were there because Chaos had wanted her Star Seed since forever ago.  Same thing with Usagi's enemies - Death Phantom, Pharaoh 90, Sailor Galaxia - all sent by Chaos because he wanted her Star Seed.  Whether she's a princess, middle-class school girl, or magical soldier; Chaos does not care.  Usagi's problem is Chaos and has been ever since her Star Seed/Sailor Crystal was born from the Cauldron and it will continue to be a problem for the rest of her existence, no matter how many times she reincarnates or who those reincarnations are.

The difference between this fic and canon is that her problems (cosmic horror enemies, etc.) haven't shown up yet.  Currently, Usagi has the luxury of living a life-style that she wants, rather than the life-style the world needs.  Once her enemies start turning up, I expect that will change - they aren't going to thoughtfully off themselves or give up their ambitions after all.

 

[shioran toushin]

i was using Exported Chatacter AKA Expy wrong true.
i get your Peter Perker and i Raise you Batman, who is the 'central' persona of Bruce Wayne? Batman, Bruce is just a facade, unlike Peter who Sees himself as Peter then Spider-Man.(but i agree that one can't be an expy of oneself, the problem is that i follow the "i am me and my circumstances" school of tought so the definition of Expy or Exported Character fits well where the Character you are being exported is your 'past' self/incarnation just like in universe Pegasus Seiya was and Expy for Pegasus Tenma (both in Tenma being an actual Exported CHaracter from Seiya and them being Reincarnation) or the Mai-HIME and Mai-Otome Characters being expies of eachother (set in the same universe and speculated to be reincarnations), i would say (and misused Expy tring to 'explain' it) that the relationship of Serenity-Usagi in canon was simmilar to Dark Shinder-Geo Soto Noto.
and i suppose that's the reason for why everyone and their future Daughters recalled her not as Usagi or Princess Usagi but as Neo Princess Serenity or Cosmos.
about the StarSeed, answer me this one little thing, Cosmos Star Seed has been within all previous Incarnations of Usagi since it came from the Cauldron right? no matter where, when or how she died it was the same 'person' having the same star seed right? and for god knows how many ages and incarnations CHaos sent things against her again and again and the only 'important' thing that came from it were the things from the Silver Millenium? that would have so much untapped potential and it was ignored...

and finally for the 'usagi is usagi because sailor moon wasn't an actual senshi the last time around', well wasn't she the wielder of the Silver Crystal (which could do absolutely crazy shit) and wrecked with Guilt because most of her closest companions and lover died protecting her?

EDIT: now that i think it a little more, Usagi and Serenity are so simmilar in their 'core personality' that it really doesn't matter who is the 'main identity' or if they mixed and matched, it's NOT simmilar to Dark Shnider in any way or form and i'm just arguing semantics.

 

[wyldeakasha]

i was using Exported Chatacter AKA Expy wrong true.
i get your Peter Perker and i Raise you Batman, who is the 'central' persona of Bruce Wayne? Batman, Bruce is just a facade, unlike Peter who Sees himself as Peter then Spider-Man.(but i agree that one can't be an expy of oneself, the problem is that i follow the "i am me and my circumstances" school of tought so the definition of Expy or Exported Character fits well where the Character you are being exported is your 'past' self/incarnation just like in universe Pegasus Seiya was and Expy for Pegasus Tenma (both in Tenma being an actual Exported CHaracter from Seiya and them being Reincarnation) or the Mai-HIME and Mai-Otome Characters being expies of eachother (set in the same universe and speculated to be reincarnations), i would say (and misused Expy tring to 'explain' it) that the relationship of Serenity-Usagi in canon was simmilar to Dark Shinder-Geo Soto Noto.
and i suppose that's the reason for why everyone and their future Daughters recalled her not as Usagi or Princess Usagi but as Neo Princess Serenity or Cosmos.
about the StarSeed, answer me this one little thing, Cosmos Star Seed has been within all previous Incarnations of Usagi since it came from the Cauldron right? no matter where, when or how she died it was the same 'person' having the same star seed right? and for god knows how many ages and incarnations CHaos sent things against her again and again and the only 'important' thing that came from it were the things from the Silver Millenium? that would have so much untapped potential and it was ignored...

and finally for the 'usagi is usagi because sailor moon wasn't an actual senshi the last time around', well wasn't she the wielder of the Silver Crystal (which could do absolutely crazy shit) and wrecked with Guilt because most of her closest companions and lover died protecting her?

EDIT: now that i think it a little more, Usagi and Serenity are so simmilar in their 'core personality' that it really doesn't matter who is the 'main identity' or if they mixed and matched, it's NOT simmilar to Dark Shnider in any way or form and i'm just arguing semantics.

I'm sorry, I'm not familiar with those shows, so I can't really draw the comparison too well.  But as to your Batman example, how does Batman's perception of his identity make him any less Bruce Wayne?  They are the same person after all - even if Batman does it a bit backwards by making his civilian identity The Mask.  Basically, Bruce identifies more strongly with being Batman and prefers to think of Batman as his real self (cause Bruce Wayne was a spoiled brat who stood helplessly by as his parents were murdered); he constructs a public persona for 'Bruce Wayne' to keep people from realizing that Bruce and Batman are the same person while allowing Bruce to various connections across society.  I rather liken it to an actor playing a character - Batman and Bruce are the same person, but the public persona of Bruce Wayne that Batman so carefully cultivates is essentially a role he plays (and could win an Oscar for).

Frankly, I don't see the problem with how people from the past/future address Usagi; in the Silver Millennium, they knew her as Princess Serenity and I sincerely doubt her enemies knew or even cared if her name changed when she was reincarnated.  In the present, Usagi never gave them her civilian name (sensible, don't want these loonies following her home to the family) and mostly stuck with her senshi name, Sailor Moon.  She did, however, correct her allies and they addressed her properly after that.  In the future, Usagi chose to be called Serenity when she became Queen - why? Possibly because it seems to have become a Reign Name shared by all the mothers and daughters of the family; Chibi-Usa is also a Serenity, but she is rarely called that.  Whatever Usagi's reasons, she chose to be called Neo Queen Serenity and eventually, that's the only name most people knew her by.

We don't know that Usagi's star seed ever incarnated before it was born as Princess Serenity, only that Chaos had always been seeking it; as for it's untapped potential, it is implied that it takes several millennia (minimum) before Usagi is able to achieve her Sailor Cosmos form.

I'm not too clear on the point you're trying to make with this statement: "well wasn't she the wielder of the Silver Crystal (which could do absolutely crazy shit) and wrecked with Guilt because most of her closest companions and lover died protecting her?"  What does this have to do with Usagi maintaining her identity and what does it have to do with Sailor Moon's creation?  In the manga, we're never told where the brooch Luna gave her came from (who made it, where'd Luna get it?) and the name of Sailor Moon never came up until Usagi introduced herself to the youma at the jewelry store.  And, at that time, Usagi didn't know any of the senshi and had only met Mamoru in passing earlier that day.  If you are referring to Princess Serenity, she died pretty quickly and didn't have the Silver Crystal. 

And yes, Usagi and Princess Serenity are near identical in terms of personality -- most of the differences likely come from how they were raised and the social expectations of their place in society.  (Again this excludes live action Sailor Moon as the writers and directors took Princess Serenity in to bizarro world).

Also, may I refer you to this thread where Seiya answers questions about Sailor Moon canon? http://thefanfictionforum.net/showthread.php?tid=13791