Harry Potter Harry Potter Fanfic Updates
- Thread starter Dumbledork
- Start date
For all of your dislike against Raine, you sure keep insisting that your extrapolations are canon just like him without giving sources. Either give a canon source about "threat of retribution being too great" and "werewolves forced to suicide en masse" or admit that you're wrong on this. Unless you can back your claims with evidence, the reason why no werewolves outed themselves could have been because they were murderous dickbags. To me the fact that no one showed up despite insanely lenient terms by 1600's standards would point towards that direction, but neither of us can really claim our inferences as true motive because it isn't mentioned.
I find it disturbing how you're so emotionally attached fictional characters that are portrayed to be committing rather nasty acts barring one freak exception. I guess it boils down to difference in viewpoint between us. You seem to treat werewolves as innocent little children that cannot do no wrong and if something happens it's oppressive society's fault, not their responsibility. I'm more interested in group/society aspect and how organization would realistically deal with problem(s) group such as werewolves would pose.
And conclusion I keep coming to in light of sparse *canon facts* we have is that any organization would insist on regulating group which goes psycho once a month. Especially a state that needs to be part of masquerade and remain secret to survive. You may cry foul, but every state is ultimately built on monopoly of force. Werewolves are essentially giving a finger to state by not complying with that, so it's hardly surprising that state response is to hammer down on them, especially after "nice" approaches have failed.
Rising Dragon: Yet you somehow insists that Murphy's law won't apply to other werewolves when it comes to forgetting their medicine and that they all are some superhuman automatons incapable of making critical mistakes?
shioran toushin: You are once again making up extrapolations and passing them off as canon. Give canon citation for outing being social suicide despite the leniency of it or accept that your interpretation is only one out of multiple ones which are all just as correct. Small sample size doesn't matter for establishing what's canon. I do agree that picture it presents might be different from what could be going on, that's what the fanfiction is for. What I'm criticizing is your attempt to pass of your own personal fanon as canon. Limited as it is, based on canon evidence werewolves in HP-verse by and large deserve the shit they get. Refusing to bite people and taking your meds is apparently too much of a demand for most to accept.
I find it disturbing how you're so emotionally attached fictional characters that are portrayed to be committing rather nasty acts barring one freak exception. I guess it boils down to difference in viewpoint between us. You seem to treat werewolves as innocent little children that cannot do no wrong and if something happens it's oppressive society's fault, not their responsibility. I'm more interested in group/society aspect and how organization would realistically deal with problem(s) group such as werewolves would pose.
And conclusion I keep coming to in light of sparse *canon facts* we have is that any organization would insist on regulating group which goes psycho once a month. Especially a state that needs to be part of masquerade and remain secret to survive. You may cry foul, but every state is ultimately built on monopoly of force. Werewolves are essentially giving a finger to state by not complying with that, so it's hardly surprising that state response is to hammer down on them, especially after "nice" approaches have failed.
Rising Dragon: Yet you somehow insists that Murphy's law won't apply to other werewolves when it comes to forgetting their medicine and that they all are some superhuman automatons incapable of making critical mistakes?
shioran toushin: You are once again making up extrapolations and passing them off as canon. Give canon citation for outing being social suicide despite the leniency of it or accept that your interpretation is only one out of multiple ones which are all just as correct. Small sample size doesn't matter for establishing what's canon. I do agree that picture it presents might be different from what could be going on, that's what the fanfiction is for. What I'm criticizing is your attempt to pass of your own personal fanon as canon. Limited as it is, based on canon evidence werewolves in HP-verse by and large deserve the shit they get. Refusing to bite people and taking your meds is apparently too much of a demand for most to accept.
For christ's sake, Kyle, all I'm saying is the nature of their condition has horrifically worse consequences than normal people with normal ailments should they miss taking critical medication for their condition. Frankly speaking, you can't really compare lycanthropy with real world illnesses because of it.
...Kyle, gtfo out of harry potter debates if you don't even have a goddamn pottermore account.
And stop being a dick to everyone and strawmanning them. I'm sure it sucks to suddenly be confronted with the fact that you're racist, even if against a fictional set of werewolves, but there's no reason to take it out on us.
And stop being a dick to everyone and strawmanning them. I'm sure it sucks to suddenly be confronted with the fact that you're racist, even if against a fictional set of werewolves, but there's no reason to take it out on us.
Insult me all you like, you're just proving that you can't defend your own position. You wouldn't be this angry if points I'm rising weren't hitting home.
Canon facts about werewolves are:
1) No one signed up for insanely good deal by 1600's standards that amounted to "don't bite other people and lock yourself up when you're about to go crazy". Motive isn't mentioned beyond conjecture as far as I know. Further control attempts after that haven't gone any better, werewolf registry was so badly handled that Greyback himself managed to slip off when interrogated during sixties.
2) They carry contagious disease which can't be cured, but can infect any human 2b) Disease in question makes them dangerous to any people around them during full moon unless specific medicine is taken
3) Of all the werewolves canon shows, one is decent, one is ravenous sociopath and rest are mook followers of sociopath in question. 3b) Even the decent one almost killed kids he tried to save because he forgot to take medicine, also almost killed a fellow student as teen.
4) Most werewolves we know (aka Fenrir's group) followed Voldemort long before Umbridge got her anti-werewolf work laws passed through.
Thus *according to canon* most werewolves are evil and all of them are highly dangerous to their surroundings. Fanon would easily give more reasonable picture which is often the case when JKR's writing is concerned. But unless you can give me the citations to back up your claims, sparse canon facts we do have available prove that most werewolves are evil dicks that refuse any control despite the need their disease warrants.
Now put your money where your mouth is and start debating, or is foaming at the mouth the best you can do?
Rising Dragon: So because this specific disease has worse consequences than normal ones for forgetting medication it can't be treated as disease? You do realize how stupid that sounds? By that logic you couldn't compare any disease that has severe symptoms if not treated with others. Try making that argument to actual medical professionals & researchers.
Seems to me that you're just throwing emotional appeals and shrieking "You can't say THAT" with fingers in your ears because you aren't able to offer logical counterarguments to the points I'm raising. Either debunk my points or admit you're wrong about what HP canon has to say about werewolves. We all know that JKR didn't really think many things through, treat this as one of them if it helps.
Canon facts about werewolves are:
1) No one signed up for insanely good deal by 1600's standards that amounted to "don't bite other people and lock yourself up when you're about to go crazy". Motive isn't mentioned beyond conjecture as far as I know. Further control attempts after that haven't gone any better, werewolf registry was so badly handled that Greyback himself managed to slip off when interrogated during sixties.
2) They carry contagious disease which can't be cured, but can infect any human 2b) Disease in question makes them dangerous to any people around them during full moon unless specific medicine is taken
3) Of all the werewolves canon shows, one is decent, one is ravenous sociopath and rest are mook followers of sociopath in question. 3b) Even the decent one almost killed kids he tried to save because he forgot to take medicine, also almost killed a fellow student as teen.
4) Most werewolves we know (aka Fenrir's group) followed Voldemort long before Umbridge got her anti-werewolf work laws passed through.
Thus *according to canon* most werewolves are evil and all of them are highly dangerous to their surroundings. Fanon would easily give more reasonable picture which is often the case when JKR's writing is concerned. But unless you can give me the citations to back up your claims, sparse canon facts we do have available prove that most werewolves are evil dicks that refuse any control despite the need their disease warrants.
Now put your money where your mouth is and start debating, or is foaming at the mouth the best you can do?
Rising Dragon: So because this specific disease has worse consequences than normal ones for forgetting medication it can't be treated as disease? You do realize how stupid that sounds? By that logic you couldn't compare any disease that has severe symptoms if not treated with others. Try making that argument to actual medical professionals & researchers.
Seems to me that you're just throwing emotional appeals and shrieking "You can't say THAT" with fingers in your ears because you aren't able to offer logical counterarguments to the points I'm raising. Either debunk my points or admit you're wrong about what HP canon has to say about werewolves. We all know that JKR didn't really think many things through, treat this as one of them if it helps.
