[Inside Out] Riley Growing Up

#1
Hey folks,

I just started a new fan-fiction over Thanksgiving weekend, and I'm looking for people to read, comment, and critique. I haven't written in a long time, so I'm looking for any feedback I can get.

The premise of the fic follows Riley through some of the more raw and real parts of puberty and growing up. The goal is to do this as she bounces between a progressive city culture she's embraced and her folksy, midwestern upbringing. It's definitely targeted at female audiences, so if you're squeamish around a detailed description of a young woman's traumatic first period, this isn't for you.

http://rileygrowingup.tumblr.com/

I'm 3.5 chapters in, around 10,000 words, and I figured now would be a good time to get some feedback.

Thanks, and I appreciate the reads and feedback!
 

daniel_gudman

KING (In Land of Blind)
Staff member
#2
The emotions of joy and sadness are both regulated by the Dopamine & Serotonin Reuptake pathways; they're two major neurohormones. So when the "characters" of Joy and Sadness left Riley's "control center" and her personality changed like someone turned it off, I assumed it was all a metaphor for Riley developing a brain tumor that interfered in either or both of those hormones, like hypothalamic cancer or a (malignant) pituitary tumor perhaps.

So I spent half the movie wondering if the ending was going to be the doctor (pediatric oncologist) gently explaining that the prognoses was not good. I thought Riley was going to die of brain cancer, basically.

I just thought I'd share.

Anyway,
The story you've got here is okay-to-mediocre. It feels... unambitious?

Like "people change during puberty" is a little too facile to support the story, and some random sexual assault so a hero can sweep in and save the passively distressed damsel was pretty cliche.

So where's this story going? What's the conflict?

Is Riley going to have a cancer relapse? As like a metaphor for whatever's going on.

Anyway there's a lot of interesting research about the connection between sexual arousal and disgust: sexual arousal suppresses disgust, which is why gross stuff is cool when you're turned on, for example, but at the same time disgust dampens sexual arousal when you're stimulated by unacceptable sexual imagery, like when a girl sees her brother naked and her first response is "gross!"

So I guess the thing is, Disgust should be a more important character?

Well that still doesn't solve what appears to be a fundamental lack of plot.
 
#3
Heyo Daniel,

Thanks for reading, appreciate the feedback, and you're right, I honestly have no idea where to go! I keep going back to how I'm going to introduce some large-scale conflict. Maybe I'm just short of a major plot point? Maybe I haven't done enough to be able to write one in?
I can't speak to your thoughts on the movie, I thought the depression metaphor was pretty plain-sight. 

I didn't want to write in any major destructive force like a disease, mental illness, or rape. I'm trying to look at situations that average little girls go through: struggling with emotions, self confidence, puberty, breasts, periods, shaving, makeup, bullying, peer pressure, consent, boys, girls, sexuality, and ever increasing autonomy.

Maybe average little girls aren't so interesting to write about? :p

I year ya' what you're saying with the hero saving her from rape. It's definitely cliche. I think my goal was to introduce Mystie as a female role model, in a way. I want to paint a picture that Riley's tough, I mean, she plays hockey after all, and she was really capable of getting out of that situation at any time, she just doesn't know her own strength. I didn't mean to convey damsel in distress; I think I need to go back and rewrite that whole set of scenes.

I'm aiming for a less puritan, somewhat scarier version of Judy Blume's "Are You There God? It's Me, Margaret." Margaret casually walks into adult situations and leaves with no real lessons; she's always seemingly oblivious to how weird or messed up something was. Having worked with kids around that age, especially today's kids, I think they're more aware than that. 

If you care to, I'd like to pass some plot points by that I've been considering and get your thoughts. Maybe you might connect a few dots I'm missing. Some of this I'm already set up for, some of this I'll need to go back to tweak and add scenes.
  1. I want Riley to go home to Minnesota; somewhat against her will (out of fear of starting over, again) and in large part because her parents are too busy with their jobs to watch her as she gets into more and more grown up situations. There she ends up with more freedom than she bargained for, and even in folksy, backwater Minnesota, she can't avoid modern teenage problems.
  2. She has horrible female role models. Her mother is an oblivious pushover who tries her best, her friends are vacuous and self-centered, and she's one face in a sea of little girls with problems. Instead, she collects an assortment of imperfect female role models, starting with Mystie, her hero in the bathroom, that help build a complete picture of femininity.

    Mystie's tough and weathered with high self confidence despite her own growing pains including a violent rape; most of their relationship would take place as pen pals (over text).

    Maybe another is a party girl who teaches Riley to have fun and let loose, and live care free (often resulting in questionable hijinks and even more adult situations). 

    Maybe another teaches caring for her feminine side; beauty products, shaving, feminine hygiene. Basically, all of them replace the function of her mother in some way. Maybe she comes back home using that knowledge to repair the relationship with her mother?


  3. Romance comes and goes, but at that age, it's quick! I had boyfriends that lasted months, or even weeks! Maybe two or three boys come and go with each one leaving an unfulfilling impression of masculinity that she has to reconcile with her female role models. They, in turn, only offer one part each of the full picture.

    Mystie only knows men through the violent lens of her past. The party girl only concerns herself with sex, and the appearance or social status of men. Maybe the ever-pragmatic third role model tries to show Riley a modern masculinity? 
Through all this spitballing, have I approached anything that seems interesting, rich or, in the very least, something that feels like a plot? I'd like to hear your thoughts and see what connections you might be able to make. 

I keep coming back to this idea of a climax. Where can I fit one in, or do I even need one at all?

Let me know what you think, and thanks again for reading!
 

shioran toushin

Well-Known Member
#4
so Slice-of-Life instead of Adventure? i reccomend that you watch Everything Wrong with: Inside Out to get some ideas for what you could do.
 

daniel_gudman

KING (In Land of Blind)
Staff member
#5
insideoutfan said:
I can't speak to your thoughts on the movie, I thought the depression metaphor was pretty plain-sight.
I've been reading a lot of Scott Adams stuff about his Moist Robot hypothesis so I was primed to look at it in a different direction. 

I mean, the Five Emotions are literally personified, button-pushers in a control room, internal conflict rendered as interpersonal dialogue.




I didn't want to write in any major destructive force like a disease, mental illness, or rape. ...
I year ya' what you're saying with the hero saving her from rape. It's definitely cliche. I think my goal was to introduce Mystie as a female role model, in a way. I want to paint a picture that Riley's tough, I mean, she plays hockey after all, and she was really capable of getting out of that situation at any time, she just doesn't know her own strength. I didn't mean to convey damsel in distress; I think I need to go back and rewrite that whole set of scenes.
You're saying one thing and writing another though.

I think the problem is that the story is kind of... meandering, it's like "oh shit the scene were Riley was passively sitting in a gym getting lectured at was boring, better turn up the Melodrama dial!"

Like, my advice is to recast that scene not as Riley getting molesterated in the bathroom of a club, she never even goes in the bathroom.

My advice is actually to kinda keep the scene, just tone it down.

Rather than making Rodney some random villain, make him a "prospective love interest." Cute and charming, and he flirts with Riley and she's interested back, but she's also hiding that she feels out of her depth and getting increasingly uncomfortable because she wants to put the brakes on it without knowing quite how.

And that's when Mystie shows up, and she's the one that observes that Riley is uncomfortable and gets her acquaintance/buddy/ex-boyfriend/"it's complicated" Rodney to back off without it being a problem or a scene.

That allows you to use Rodney as a crush-figure that she's attracted to for mediocre reasons without actually knowing anything about him, just having hormones dragging her along by the hypothalamus.

I think that would work better. It's more about uncertainly and insecurity about new, unfamiliar relationships, rather than having all the nasty sex stuff being overtly threatening. And it's not establishing this dynamic you're falling into where girls get character development traumatic sexual encounters, like:

Mystie's tough and weathered with high self confidence despite her own growing pains including a violent rape; ... Mystie only knows men through the violent lens of her past. The party girl only concerns herself with sex, and the appearance or social status of men.
Yeah, too much, reel it back in, she's Obi-Won Kenobi not Luke Skywalker; Mystie is the mentor, not the Journeying Hero who's gotta have revelations. Also the rape-as-melodrama thing is back.


Also why did Riley lie to her parents about going to the club? I kinda go the impression it was so you-the-author could head her off from having to call her parents and have her rely on the cool and mysterious Original Character instead.

I think she should just go ahead and have her parent's permission, and you can make it an awkward conversation scene to highlight how even if she's comfortable talking with them, actual communication is hard.

I want Riley to go home to Minnesota; somewhat against her will (out of fear of starting over, again) and in large part because her parents are too busy with their jobs to watch her as she gets into more and more grown up situations. There she ends up with more freedom than she bargained for, and even in folksy, backwater Minnesota, she can't avoid modern teenage problems.
How? Is she going to stay with her grandparents while over summer break or anything? Meet up with Old Best Friend while still texting Mystie?

It could be interesting, but this isn't really enough to support a story arc in itself.

She has horrible female role models. Her mother is an oblivious pushover who tries her best, her friends are vacuous and self-centered, and she's one face in a sea of little girls with problems.
This might be overstating the case, it's too easy to do the "parents don't understand teenagers lol" thing.

Also since her friends are all OCs, they're only vacuous or self-centered if you want them to be.

It sounds like you're better off just making it so that all these girls are taking to each other about what's bothering them but they all give each other bad answers because of mutual ignorance.

Maybe another is a party girl who teaches Riley to have fun and let loose, and live care free (often resulting in questionable hijinks and even more adult situations). 

Maybe another teaches caring for her feminine side; beauty products, shaving, feminine hygiene. Basically, all of them replace the function of her mother in some way. Maybe she comes back home using that knowledge to repair the relationship with her mother?
Isn't Mystie already the "party girl"?

Why even replace mom?

My advice is cut 'em.

Romance comes and goes, but at that age, it's quick! I had boyfriends that lasted months, or even weeks! Maybe two or three boys come and go with each one leaving an unfulfilling impression of masculinity that she has to reconcile with her female role models. They, in turn, only offer one part each of the full picture.
I'm getting that Lesbian Earth Goddess vibe. I think you should just go ahead and introduce one of those, all new-age nonsense and stuff. I mean, the story is already set in San Fransisco, you can introduce all the weirdos you want.

Also Yahtzee Crowshow trots out a question he got asked by a writing professor he had once:

Is this the most interesting time of the protagonist's life, and if not, why aren't you writing about that instead?

Since it's fanfiction coming off a movie, it's pretty tough not to just write a movie rehash.

I feel like the reason you're writing this is just to talk about Riley going through puberty, which needs to have some narrative purpose or you're going to be writing more a series of events rather than a story.
 
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