Nasuverse Let's talk about FRO!

daniel_gudman

KING (In Land of Blind)
Staff member
#1
Purpose of this Thread
So why am I creating yet another Thread about my fanfiction? Is it just that I want to spam the whole dang Type Moon section with my egoism? Not exactly.

Let me contrast the existing threads with what I want this one to be:

I want to keep the Preview Thread tightly focused on what I've actually written, so I want to keep hypothetical discussion and tangential questions out of it. (Also it's the thread most sensitive to necroing because it's the one with, like, actual content).

The Idea Thread is where I solicit help brainstorming future content, so by its very nature it's full of stuff that could become humongous spoilers. I guess there are some people that don't want spoilers.

Compared to that, I want this to be a general space to talk about the story, with other readers (and with me; I've been relying pretty heavily on reader responses to iron out problems). To discuss the hypotheticals and ask tangential questions, without having to worry about accidently learning that I'm planning to kill Dumbledore before the climax of book seven.

So really, I guess I'm just trying to organize the discussion of FRO into the same Ideas/Preview/Talk division that the subsection system already has.



Thread Rules
1) Talk about the fanfiction Fate/Revelation Online! It can be questions about the story, questions about the Nasuverse, questions about SAOverse; don't worry too much about staying "on topic" or whatever, even if you're arguing about who could take who in a fight.

2) Use the SPOILER tag if you're mentioning something planned in the Idea Thread that hasn't happened in the Preview Thread (or warn people if hyperlink to spoilers).

3) Please play nice.
 

daniel_gudman

KING (In Land of Blind)
Staff member
#2
Reserved for an index of interesting posts like the Idea Thread has, but cleanly broken out into it's own post for ease-of-linking.
 

SportsDrink

Well-Known Member
#3
There are some interesting info dumps that you wrote out in the idea thread such as the Player's Handbook to Magecraft and the stat builds the players use.

Are you planning on adding them to fanfiction.net or are they gonna be a forum only thing?
 

daniel_gudman

KING (In Land of Blind)
Staff member
#4
Right now I'm thinking to leave them forum-only.

I might have some "Wise Up!" omakes as like an interlude between the SAO arc and what comes after.

I don't remember which post you're referring to with "Player's Handbook to Magecraft" though.
 

SportsDrink

Well-Known Member
#5
daniel_gudman said:
I don't remember which post you're referring to with "Player's Handbook to Magecraft" though.
http://thefanfictionforum.net/showthread.php?tid=19338&pid=1147049#pid1147049

Player's handbook is mentioned in the post when you talked about magecraft in SAO.

Under Magic Rules.
 

Olivebirdy

Well-Known Member
#6
I still don't understand how so many players have circuits. Argo should have been the norm. Kayaba said that everyone, or most people were supposed to have circuits depending on their Origin? Also, how are Elements not Magic Traits?
Just how was Shirou able to use Saber's Mana Burst? Wasn't that based on her extraordinary reserves? Although, Kirito told Argo that 'that skill which Shirou used against the Boss' was his own natural abilities, so that whole scene makes little sense.
F/RO said:
It was like a limiter had been removed along with the [Stupid Helmet] and the other guy had turned on his afterburners. That guy blasted forward in a blur, and his sword was like a streak of light. But it wasn't glowing like a sword skill. The effect was different, like Shirou was wreathed in prana squeezed out of his body.

It rotated around like a moon collapsing into a planet at terminal velocity as Shirou spun in a circle and plunged the edge into Illfang's extended shoulder. The form was perfect, even so the worms tried to grab it, but he simply blasted through the boss and all the worms with raw power.

Illfang staggered, the force of the blow ripping through him dragging him towards the ground. He reared back, curling up and gathering strength to strike—

But it was useless. That sword wasn't like a cannonball blasting into him, but rather, an avalanche that swept into him like a falling wall. Whenever it hit it simply followed through and hit again. If it missed, if it was deflected, it didn't pause or hesitate and simply blasted toward the boss again.

All told, from the instant the sword completely blew that Tulwar out of the way, it only took three seconds.

...
The only sound was the ragged breathing from that guy, standing in an unyielding stance holding that sword in a dangerous manner, with steam rising from his sides like he'd boiled himself in a pot of magic and climbed out of the witches' cauldron.
Can Shirou really increase his strength through UBW? Skills obviously, but strength and mana pool?
 

ice2215

Well-Known Member
#7
Olivebirdy said:
Can Shirou really increase his strength through UBW? Skills obviously, but strength and mana pool?
How else could Shirou lift up Berserker's sword one handed in HF route?
 

Benstar

Well-Known Member
#8
Basically, magic circuit potential is super-recessive, and Kayaba is using magic to bring them forward in people who have them. Argo doesn't have any potential at all.
 

daniel_gudman

KING (In Land of Blind)
Staff member
#9
Olivebirdy said:
I still don't understand how so many players have circuits. Argo should have been the norm. Kayaba said that everyone, or most people were supposed to have circuits depending on their Origin? Also, how are Elements not Magic Traits?
daniel_gudman said:
... Kayaba said.... “Imagine if a soul was a computer program. When the Origin condenses and the soul is formed, that is analogous to the program compiling during fetal development. In that case, during compilation, many subroutines that define the individual human are constructed and then called. Physical things like the shape and functionality of the organs, the physical dimensions of height and length, and other genetic factors would be one type of subroutine that are called upon to define a human’s form during their genesis.”

“In that case, magecraft traits are another subroutine. The number of Circuits, the Elements they can express, even the natural quality are all automatically constructed during the condensation of the Origin. However, in the vast majority of humans, the subroutine is not called and the magical traits are not formed. So the values are defined, but because they aren’t instantiated by the program, when you watch the code execute it’s the same as if they didn’t exist.”

Kayaba nodded. “But in the case of a magus, then the routine is called and the Traits exist.”
Kayaba's unique magecraft is saying "if a muggle was a wizard, what kind of wizard would they be?" and then doing turning them into that.

So the conceit is that most people have unexpressed Circuits (in a genetic sense), and Kayaba can somatically activate them with his magecraft. It's maybe more subtle than it could be, but basically it boils down to this:

Kayaba's best spell is "Transmute Muggle into Magus."


How do Elements relate to Sorcery Traits? We'll let Kayaba monologue about that for a little bit.

daniel_gudman said:
...Elements and Sorcery Traits. They were different kinds of aspects, but that was a difference between similar kinds. They weren't completely unrelated. The distinction between what was an “Element Affinity” and what was a “Sorcery Trait” was essentially the same kind of taxonomic difference as between two species of lizard. They were distinct, but fundamentally similar....
So if it's "Elements and Magical Traits", then it's like the difference between your thumb and your fingers, rather than between your thumb and your eyeball.

Kayaba's being pedantic.



Olivebirdy said:
Just how was Shirou able to use Saber's Mana Burst? ...Can Shirou really increase his strength through UBW? Skills obviously, but strength and mana pool?
Shirou was able to use Prana Burst because Saber used it with both Caliburn and Excalibur so the "skill" for using it with those swords is recorded just like any other sword-swinging technique would be.

daniel_gudman said:
3.3 After Illfang

His body didn’t hurt.

He’d exceeded his limits by wringing too much od out of his body, so the expected sensation like his blood vessels had been twisted around his bones was there. It was the familiar spiritual pain as his soul protested that he’d wrung too much of himself out....

...Right now, his HP bar was in the yellow zone, and from a glance it was only a sliver away from the red zone. In a direct numerical sense that made him approximately three-fourths dead.

If he extrapolated the time they’d swung Caliburn together onto this action, then 75% of [Killing Himself] was about accurate....
So after using it for about ten seconds, Shirou has mostly destroyed himself using it.

So he can reproduce it, but he's fundamentally unsuited for it because he lacks that Dragon-like trait that allowed Saber to gush out Prana. So it's a "poor choice."

As for "Strength", even in Fate route, Shirou was able to parry blows by Berserkules, (although it was pretty hard on his joints), so just as a side-effect from Tracing Caliburn, his strengh was enhanced enough that he could knock aside 200 kilograms of stone being swung at hundreds of kmph.

As for "Mana Pool", it's more like this:
It costs Shirou 5 Prana to Trace a sword.
Caliblast holds a charge of about 100 Prana.
Shirou can spend 5 Prana to create something with 100 Prana.
Remember, it's magic. Since they're already violating conservation of energy like crazy, this doesn't contradict anything else that happens.


Olivebirdy said:
Kirito told Argo that 'that skill which Shirou used against the Boss' was his own natural abilities, so that whole scene makes little sense....
It's the other way arond. "It wasn't an in-game skill, therefore it was something he could do outside the game."

daniel_gudman said:
...“The guy who took down Illfang with some kind of secret super-special move, huh?” Argo mused. “I wonder how he unlocked an [Extra Skill] so early in the game, although based on how constantly he’s been active, I’m not really surprised he of all people found one.”

“It was incredible.” Kirito agreed. “Because it wasn’t an [Extra Skill]. It wasn’t something from the game, even if it exploited game mechanics. That was something based on the player’s Real Life abilities.”...
Keep in mind that Kirito doesn't know anything about the UBW. "Whatever that was, it wasn't part of the game, so logically it's something he brought with him."



Hope that explains what I'm doing.
 

lhklan

Well-Known Member
#10
Okay, I know some people are going to get on my case for this, but...
Are there any pairings - even if it's one sided from the girls - for Shirou later on?
 

Deathwings

Well-Known Member
#11
This the unofficial, mythical Ilya Route. With Fate's Best End (Shirou and Arthuria reuniting within Avalon) a very, very long time later.
 

daniel_gudman

KING (In Land of Blind)
Staff member
#12
Romantic partners for Shirou...?

Well, from my perspective one of the ways the Lion Dojo is useful because it shows he's still carrying a torch for Saber.

Ilya is trying to represent herself as the SAO Route Heroine, but I doubt Shirou could see her as a romantic partner.

Sakura isn't in the running right now, but won't that change after the SAO arc ends? Well, since Kayaba is associated with the Matou, that's something to think about.

...All that being said, I guess hints of Lind/Shirou have crept in? Well, she might be in for a nasty surprise if she assumed Shirou was closer to 30 than 20, though.

Well... Saber getting summoned somehow might be considered the most likely scenario for Shirou to get a romance subplot. The knowledge and capacity is there if Ilya decided to pick Shirou's happiness over monopolizing his attention, maybe?
 

Olivebirdy

Well-Known Member
#13
Daniel G. said:
...if Ilya decided to pick Shirou's happiness over monopolizing his attention, maybe?
Pffft. Bahahaha, I don't really see this happening.
Illya: "Onii-chan is happiest with me!"

Thank you for the detailed explanation.

As for shipping...Oblivious!ShirouxDiabel all the way!
That scene with Diabel playing with Liz's projection was hysterical.


(Why am I a [Purist Lurker]?)
 

wakshazi

Well-Known Member
#14
I am surprised that no one has even tried Argo as a heroine. Admittedly she is out there about as much as lind, but she does spend time with shirou.........

At the very least the very untalented magus will get a very untalented apprentice.
*Rin facepalms after learning shirou has an apprentice*
 

Ravraxas

Well-Known Member
#16
I'm actually hopping for more Rin in this fic. And given she is my one of my favorite character's form FSN and my personal headcanon is that Shirou and her eventually hook up after Saber's Route you can guess which pairing I'm rooting for.
 

wakshazi

Well-Known Member
#17
The only way we will see Rin anytime soon from my perspective is if she meets Zeltrech.

Zeltrech: I hear you want to be with your friend that was trapped in a game.

Rin: Um, yes? (A bit confused)

Zeltrech: (Hands her Ruby) Rejoice your wish shall be granted. (Activates second magic) BWAHAHAHAH!

Rin: Where am I? (now in SAO)

Shirou: How did you get here?

Rin; Shirou?! An old man gave me this stick.....

Illya: Was he like so.... (Describes Zletrech)

Rin: Yes...

Illya: That was Zeltrech.
 

trevelyan1983

Well-Known Member
#18
That ridiculous meme hasn't died out yet?

I'm really sad now, guys. :(
 

lhklan

Well-Known Member
#19
wakshazi said:
I am surprised that no one has even tried Argo as a heroine. Admittedly she is out there about as much as lind, but she does spend time with shirou.........

At the very least the very untalented magus will get a very untalented apprentice.
*Rin facepalms after learning shirou has an apprentice*
She's one of my favorite as well.
 

zerohour

Well-Known Member
#20
Olivebirdy said:
Daniel G. said:
...if Ilya decided to pick Shirou's happiness over monopolizing his attention, maybe?
Pffft. Bahahaha, I don't really see this happening.
Illya: "Onii-chan is happiest with me!"
She might do it just to prove that she's a better fit for Shiro than Saber. In the game, Saber may or may not be an unstoppable force, depending on if Kayaba treats her s another player or a separate experiment inside the game. Either way, Ilya is now one of (if not the) strongest players in the game, beyond what most people are capable of, and originally based off Berzerker.

Hm... the reversal of power could be interesting. Saber being deprived of most of her power and being completely unfamiliar with the system could greatly underestimate

Ilya: The loser of this match must give up all romantic pursuit of Shiro.
Saber: Very well.
*Saber gets PWNed because she's level one*
Ilya: Hahaha! Now Onii-chan will be mine FOREVER!!!

Cue Shiro training Saber up in how the game system works, and probably advising her to actually learn magic. A rematch is inevitable, though I doubt Ilya would be willing to give up her position so easily.

"Ilya: If you defeat me, you can be his second wife!


Actually, that would be a humorous side story/omake. Heroic Spirits are integrated into the game towards the end, but are so ridiculously under leveled they're next to useless.
 

Ravraxas

Well-Known Member
#21
zerohour said:
Olivebirdy said:
Daniel G. said:
...if Ilya decided to pick Shirou's happiness over monopolizing his attention, maybe?
Pffft. Bahahaha, I don't really see this happening.
Illya: "Onii-chan is happiest with me!"
She might do it just to prove that she's a better fit for Shiro than Saber. In the game, Saber may or may not be an unstoppable force, depending on if Kayaba treats her s another player or a separate experiment inside the game. Either way, Ilya is now one of (if not the) strongest players in the game, beyond what most people are capable of, and originally based off Berzerker.

Hm... the reversal of power could be interesting. Saber being deprived of most of her power and being completely unfamiliar with the system could greatly underestimate

Ilya: The loser of this match must give up all romantic pursuit of Shiro.
Saber: Very well.
*Saber gets PWNed because she's level one*
Ilya: Hahaha! Now Onii-chan will be mine FOREVER!!!

Cue Shiro training Saber up in how the game system works, and probably advising her to actually learn magic. A rematch is inevitable, though I doubt Ilya would be willing to give up her position so easily.

"Ilya: If you defeat me, you can be his second wife!


Actually, that would be a humorous side story/omake. Heroic Spirits are integrated into the game towards the end, but are so ridiculously under leveled they're next to useless.
Taking into account how absolutely OP Shirou is just by copying badly(by his own admission) Saber's Skills I highly doubt this is even a remote possibility.
 

lhklan

Well-Known Member
#22
Ravraxas said:
zerohour said:
Olivebirdy said:
Daniel G. said:
...if Ilya decided to pick Shirou's happiness over monopolizing his attention, maybe?
Pffft. Bahahaha, I don't really see this happening.
Illya: "Onii-chan is happiest with me!"
She might do it just to prove that she's a better fit for Shiro than Saber. In the game, Saber may or may not be an unstoppable force, depending on if Kayaba treats her s another player or a separate experiment inside the game. Either way, Ilya is now one of (if not the) strongest players in the game, beyond what most people are capable of, and originally based off Berzerker.

Hm... the reversal of power could be interesting. Saber being deprived of most of her power and being completely unfamiliar with the system could greatly underestimate

Ilya: The loser of this match must give up all romantic pursuit of Shiro.
Saber: Very well.
*Saber gets PWNed because she's level one*
Ilya: Hahaha! Now Onii-chan will be mine FOREVER!!!

Cue Shiro training Saber up in how the game system works, and probably advising her to actually learn magic. A rematch is inevitable, though I doubt Ilya would be willing to give up her position so easily.

"Ilya: If you defeat me, you can be his second wife!


Actually, that would be a humorous side story/omake. Heroic Spirits are integrated into the game towards the end, but are so ridiculously under leveled they're next to useless.
Taking into account how absolutely OP Shirou is just by copying badly(by his own admission) Saber's Skills I highly doubt this is even a remote possibility.
And that's not counting Archer, who is literaly a Shirou with shit ton of experiences.
 

Olivebirdy

Well-Known Member
#25
No, in FR/O Lind is a girl, I was pointing out that I had not known that she was a guy in canon.
...
Maybe he's a trap in FR/O.
 
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