Sailor Moon Nanoha as Serenity: Take Two!

Comartemis

Well-Known Member
#1
In which Luna found Nanoha first. Because bissek can't write a Sailor Moon crossover to save his life.

Take a look, for a moment, at the ultimate enemy of Sailor Moon: Chaos, a force of death and entropy that comes from outside the universe and is bent on the destruction of everything. Certain other authors may not be willing to think about anything except how to make the Nanoha characters look better at the expense of the Senshi but a moment's thought will tell anyone else that this has very different implications for the setting when a crossover creates a multitude of universes besides the one that Earth happens to be in.

Chaos at one point was a being that ravaged the rest of the multiverse and was fought by Al Hazard. There was a reason they needed all those WMDs they keep lying around and it was because they were fighting a creature that eats universes like Twinkies. They were losing anyways. As the war against Chaos and its innumerable spawn drew to an end, the leaders of Al Hazard placed their hopes in two projects: one was to design the ultimate artificial mages, the Senshi, to do battle with Chaos in the hopes of eliminating it forever. The other was an artificial universe, hand-crafted by the highest of all forms of Al Hazardian science to contain Chaos along with a neutralizing creative force, Cosmos.

Neither of these two projects were ultimately judged to be sufficient to battle Chaos alone. The Senshi would require too long to train and refine their powers to battle Chaos directly and Cosmos would not be able to defend itself against Chaos's children without defenders. The choice was made to combine these two systems, with the Senshi acting as an immune system for Cosmos and guardians against Chaos's spawn. The plan worked and Chaos was contained, but the act of activating Cosmos within close proximity to Al Hazard's home universe annihilated it, erasing the last traces of the god-kings of the multiverse.

An eon or two later, the Takamachi parents decide to settle down in Tokyo instead of Uminari City, as do the parents of Suzuka and Arisa. The three girls attend different schools but meet up together at their shared cram school along with one Mizuno Ami and become friends under similar circumstances as in canon. At age nine, a certain ferret does not fall from the sky chasing Jewel Seeds and Nanoha, still looking for a purpose in life, turns to her older siblings for answers. Kyouya's desire to use his sword to protect people resonates strongly with Nanoha and she decides to take up the family style like her siblings.

When Nanoha is 14 she happens across a certain black cat who turns her into a magical girl and asks her to help defeat the Dark Kingdom. After seeing that they're willing to hurt people to obtain their goals and don't appear to be even vaguely sorry about it, Nanoha signs on with gusto and lots of youma dusting/tiara throwing/sword swinging ensues. Even more of it happens when the cram school attack happens and not only Ami but also Suzuka and Arisa awaken as Sailors Uranus and Neptune. That particular youma has an extraordinarily bad day.

At some point in the middle of the Dark Kingdom storyline, the Jewel Seeds make their belated arrival on Earth followed by Yuuno and Fate. The Dark Kingdom gets their hands on a handful of seeds almost immediately and starts hunting for the rest in order to power up Metallia. The first one they get their hands on is detonated in the Dark Kingdom and cracks open the prison that keeps them from pouring too much power into Earth's dimension. Almost immediately the Generals become able to wield the full extent of their power, jumping up to their manga power levels from their prior anime levels. During a heated battle with a newly-empowered Jadeite, Yuuno throws Raising Heart to Nanoha and the tables are turned again.

Thus does the Dark Kingdom arc turn into a three-way war for the Jewel Seeds, a war which Fate is losing every step of the way. With the Senshi on one side and the Dark Kingdom on the other and the majority of the seeds captured between them, Fate feels Precia's displeasure with increasing frequency. As Nephrite scours the Earth for the Silver Crystal however his scrying magic reveals that Fate has some role to play in uncovering it, and Zoicite moves to make her an offer; power enough to take the Jewel Seeds from the Senshi as mother wishes, if only she'll help them with this one little thing...

***

There are three goals to this fic (or at least this fic idea): to balance the Senshi against the Nanoha characters, as well as the contributions that each series makes to the main characters, to the conflict, and to the story. To tell a more engaging story that involves more than the TSAB coming in to solve someone else's problems (Chaos makes this very much the TSAB's problem). And lastly to reverse the treatment Nanoha gets so often in fanfic, which is to emphasize the sci-fi parts of her series over her magical girl roots.

I offer up this idea in the interest of sparking discussion, not only of this idea but also of Sailor Moon/Nanoha crossovers in general and how we can do a better job than White Devil of the Moon ever did.
 

Tsuki_CB

Well-Known Member
#2
I like it, It a big wibbly wobbly mess of both universes which should prove interesting.
 
#3
Sounds doable but you are going to have to push the jewel seeds and other problems later in time if she is going to be 14. Plus balancing every thing else out.
 

Comartemis

Well-Known Member
#4
wildredlifer said:
Sounds doable but you are going to have to push the jewel seeds and other problems later in time if she is going to be 14. Plus balancing every thing else out.
I specifically said that's what I was doing. The Jewel Seeds hit in the middle of the Dark Kingdom storyline.

As for power balancing... balancing, on reflection, is entirely the wrong word. You see the Senshi, unlike all mages ever in the TSAB, are proper magical girls as opposed to mages with transformation sequences. They're Significant with a capital S, chosen champions selected by Cosmos to protect entire planets from the forces of evil, as opposed to mages who are perfectly common and not special at all, even the powerful ones. In the canon series the Senshi are the only ones on Earth who can use magic, and thus are the only ones who can fight the Dark Kingdom. But in a Nanoha crossover where magic is commonplace everywhere that isn't Earth, that Significance has to either be maintained or discarded.

Bissek chose to discard it by making the Senshi into mere A-rank mages (at best, their actual performance is what I would expect from C- or D-ranks). I've chosen to maintain it by giving them their manga power levels and making them the heirs of Al Hazard so that they're still something really big and significant even in the larger scheme of the multiverse. There is a certain amount of power level restriction in that I don't want the Senshi to be planet-busters in the first arc or anything like that but by the very virtue of being Senshi they're already going to be more powerful and more important than anyone else in the TSAB.

The difference, and what prevents this from being a mirror image of WDotM, is that the bureau can still contribute in other ways besides combat (which they'll be essentially useless at because they only have Chrono and redshirts to offer). Logistics, information, teleportation, device tech and upgrades, that sort of thing. In the first arc for instance there's only one device to go around between Nanoha and the other Senshi but Yuuno can still examine their magic system and help them come up with ways to expand their spell lists.
 

Shiakou

Well-Known Member
#6
This is relevant to my interests.

Do you want help on this project? Editors, proofreaders, troubleshooters and such? Do you have an overall written plan on the plot (always helpful, IMO), or do you need help writing one?

Most importantly, do you want this thread to be a place where you merely post up finished chapters (if you want everyone here to be "readers"), or do want it to be a sounding board/cutting room (if you want people here to be your "staff")?
 

nick012000

Well-Known Member
#7
Personally, I'd be inclined to say that Yuuno did arrive when Nanoha was a child, and that she's in the middle of her downtime-period as she was in Nanoha canon at the time Sailor Moon would start for her.

I'd also use canonical manga power levels for the Sailor Scouts, where they're capable of jumping into orbit and enchanting entire cities. ;)
 

ragnarok1337

Well-Known Member
#8
I think the manga powerlevels are a little bit too high. Don't bring 'em down to anime level, but nerf 'em a bit, otherwise the TSAB will be too outclassed.
 

nick012000

Well-Known Member
#9
ragnarok1337 said:
I think the manga powerlevels are a little bit too high. Don't bring 'em down to anime level, but nerf 'em a bit, otherwise the TSAB will be too outclassed.
Well, the TSAB does have their Arc-en-Ciel weapons. SS-class mages like Hayate might also be able to hold up against one of Senshi (if barely), if they've got better control of their power than a pencil-pushing desk jockey like her. ;)
 

Shiakou

Well-Known Member
#10
There's also the Dark Generals getting killed by the Scouts in the chapters they appear.

Then there's their answer to Pharoah 90 in the manga which boiled down to "Hey Hotaru, use your attack to kill everyone on Earth including the villains, and we'll just have Usagi bring them ALL back." DBZ had to wait until the Super Buu Arc to pull that off. SM did it in the the manga equivalent of it mid-series.

Basically, all Precia has to do is mention "My daughter is DEEEEEAAAD!!!" and manga Usagi goes "No prob!" and voila! Fate suddenly has her loving family . . .

and Venus gets <a href='http://manga.animea.net/sailor-moon-chapter-11.2-page-17.html' target='_blank' rel='nofollow'>a rival</a> <a href='http://manga.animea.net/sailor-moon-chapter-11.2-page-18.html' target='_blank' rel='nofollow'> for the position</a> <a href='http://manga.animea.net/sailor-moon-chapter-11.2-page-19.html' target='_blank' rel='nofollow'>of Usagi's Number One Bodyguard</a>.
 

fitzgerald

Well-Known Member
#11
As much as I hate to do this to Minako....

A far better point of insertion for Nanoha as one of the canon Senshi is Sailor Venus.

The determination to guard her friends, combat ability, and practical leadership is what drives Nanoha as a character forward, qualities found in Sailor V.

Usagi grows into her role as Messiah (Cosmos) with determination and steadfast heart.

Besides I'd much rather see Usagi / Nanoha becoming friends.
 

fitzgerald

Well-Known Member
#12
ragnarok1337 said:
I think the manga powerlevels are a little bit too high. Don't bring 'em down to anime level, but nerf 'em a bit, otherwise the TSAB will be too outclassed.
Heck no.

Keep the manga power levels.

What you do instead to raise tension is play on the fact that there is only so many Senshi to go around.

Swamp them with problems, enemies and targets. A thousand little brush fires that need tending too before they erupt into something bigger.

But the Senshi have only so much time in a day, a void the TSAB steps into with their manpower and institutional advantage.

99/100 the TSAB can likely resolve the crisis with their native resources but when truly heavy fire power is needed the Senshi swing into action.
 

Comartemis

Well-Known Member
#13
Shiakou said:
This is relevant to my interests.

Do you want help on this project? Editors, proofreaders, troubleshooters and such? Do you have an overall written plan on the plot (always helpful, IMO), or do you need help writing one?

Most importantly, do you want this thread to be a place where you merely post up finished chapters (if you want everyone here to be "readers"), or do want it to be a sounding board/cutting room (if you want people here to be your "staff")?
What I need now is discussion to help me iron out some of the details. My attention is focused more on a ZnT idea I have that's actually gotten me to read the novels from start to finish for research purposes; this is an idea I'd definitely like to do but it'll be at some point in the future so I don't really need a team of betas or anything.

Personally, I'd be inclined to say that Yuuno did arrive when Nanoha was a child, and that she's in the middle of her downtime-period as she was in Nanoha canon at the time Sailor Moon would start for her.
Except the whole premise is "Luna found Nanoha first" so that doesn't work. Also the only downtime Nanoha would be taking at 14 would be medical leave to deal with getting speared through the chest, and we already know how that turned out. :sweat2:

I think the manga powerlevels are a little bit too high. Don't bring 'em down to anime level, but nerf 'em a bit, otherwise the TSAB will be too outclassed.
Them being just as outclassed as Earth's military and police forces would be is a large part of the point. Barring WMDs and outstanding individuals like Chrono and Zest the best they can do is throw redshirts at the youma, which is why they're better served by working in a supporting role as the Senshi's infrastructure, transportation, training network, information grid, etc (they're the heirs to Al Hazard. Yuuno and the Infinity Library are going to be worth their weight in Silver Crystals). Compare this to WDotM where it was only Nanoha's injury that prevented the TSAB from doing everything and the Senshi contributed nothing at all.

Well, the TSAB does have their Arc-en-Ciel weapons. SS-class mages like Hayate might also be able to hold up against one of Senshi (if barely), if they've got better control of their power than a pencil-pushing desk jockey like her.
If there's a limiting factor to this setup it's that the Senshi will need time and training to grow into their power. Precia at least at first would be boss fight material just a step or two below Beryl+Metallia except that she's too busy coughing up blood to cast her spells.
 

ragnarok1337

Well-Known Member
#16
fitzgerald said:
Heck no.Keep the manga power levels.?

What you do instead to raise tension is play on the fact that there is only so many Senshi to go around.?

Swamp them with problems, enemies and targets.? A thousand little brush fires that need tending too before they erupt into something bigger.

But the Senshi have only so much time in a day, a void the TSAB steps into with their manpower and institutional advantage.

99/100 the TSAB can likely resolve the crisis with their native resources but when truly heavy fire power is needed the Senshi swing into action.
&
Comartemis said:
Them being just as outclassed as Earth's military and police forces would be is a large part of the point. Barring WMDs and outstanding individuals like Chrono and Zest the best they can do is throw redshirts at the youma, which is why they're better served by working in a supporting role as the Senshi's infrastructure, transportation, training network, information grid, etc (they're the heirs to Al Hazard. Yuuno and the Infinity Library are going to be worth their weight in Silver Crystals). Compare this to WDotM where it was only Nanoha's injury that prevented the TSAB from doing everything and the Senshi contributed nothing at all.
Maaaybe.

If there's a limiting factor to this setup it's that the Senshi will need time and training to grow into their power. Precia at least at first would be boss fight material just a step or two below Beryl+Metallia except that she's too busy coughing up blood to cast her spells.
Come on. Really? Precia being boss fight material?

Shiakou said:
There's also the Dark Generals getting killed by the Scouts in the chapters they appear.

Then there's their answer to Pharoah 90 in the manga which boiled down to "Hey Hotaru, use your attack to kill everyone on Earth including the villains, and we'll just have Usagi bring them ALL back." DBZ had to wait until the Super Buu Arc to pull that off. SM did it in the the manga equivalent of it mid-series.

Basically, all Precia has to do is mention "My daughter is DEEEEEAAAD!!!" and manga Usagi goes "No prob!" and voila! Fate suddenly has her loving family . . .

and Venus gets <a href='http://manga.animea.net/sailor-moon-chapter-11.2-page-17.html' target='_blank' rel='nofollow'>a rival</a> <a href='http://manga.animea.net/sailor-moon-chapter-11.2-page-18.html' target='_blank' rel='nofollow'> for the position</a> <a href='http://manga.animea.net/sailor-moon-chapter-11.2-page-19.html' target='_blank' rel='nofollow'>of Usagi's Number One Bodyguard</a>.
I'm with Shiakou on this one. Keeping the manga powerlevels eliminates most of the tension. Frankly, I'm surprised at how there could be dramatic tension in manga Sailor Moon in the first place.
 

nick012000

Well-Known Member
#17
ragnarok1337 said:
If there's a limiting factor to this setup it's that the Senshi will need time and training to grow into their power. Precia at least at first would be boss fight material just a step or two below Beryl+Metallia except that she's too busy coughing up blood to cast her spells.
Come on. Really? Precia being boss fight material?
According to the wiki, Precia was an <a href='http://nanoha.wikia.com/wiki/Mage_rank' target='_blank' rel='nofollow'>SS-rank</a> mage - the same as Hayate, who can create city-sized explosions.

So, maybe monster-of-the-week or miniboss tier in Sailor Moon.

I'm with Shiakou on this one. Keeping the manga powerlevels eliminates most of the tension. Frankly, I'm surprised at how there could be dramatic tension in manga Sailor Moon in the first place.
Because their enemies were just as ludicrously overpowered as they were.
 

ragnarok1337

Well-Known Member
#18
nick012000 said:
According to the wiki, Precia was an <a href='http://nanoha.wikia.com/wiki/Mage_rank' target='_blank' rel='nofollow'>SS-rank</a> mage - the same as Hayate, who can create city-sized explosions.

So, maybe monster-of-the-week or miniboss tier in Sailor Moon.
Thank you for proving my point. monster-of-the-week is FAR different than boss material. She'd get taken out just as easily as the Dark Generals, who were killed in the very chapters they first appear in. At most, she'd be an Elite Mook.

Because their enemies were just as ludicrously overpowered as they were.
Which means Jack and Shit when you realize that Sailor Moon has RESURRECTION powers.
 

Shiakou

Well-Known Member
#19
Manga canon has the Senshi except Moon all die in practically every arc. They've been stabbed, slashed, shot, strangled, exploded, mind-raped, mind-controlled, and disintegrated before being brought back as magical zombies. Then Moon brings them back. From a strictly ruthless point of view, the Senshi were practically guaranteed a win every time; the tension is in the fact that these are characters not RTS units, and they still felt pain and trauma, both emotional and physical. The inner Senshi in particular, become more and more psychologically dependent on Moon as the series goes on. Near the end, Venus was still talking about boys and hanging out; she was told to drop the act whereupon she seriously confessed that she'd already dedicated her life to someone cough*Usagi*cough.

Mid-Bosses, even when they were rival Senshi, rarely lasted more than a couple of chapters. The body count in the manga is staggering; the Senshi defeated or killed, directly or indirectly, something like forty named villains over seventy chapters.
 

ragnarok1337

Well-Known Member
#20
So Nanoha has an even bigger potential lesbian harem than she does in canon?

I'm up for it.
 

Shiakou

Well-Known Member
#21
ragnarok1337 said:
So Nanoha has an even bigger potential lesbian harem than she does in canon?

I'm up for it.
Being lesbians has nothing to do with it. Usagi once turned a gay (male) villain straight, once made out with her alternate future self, and Galaxia practically worships her now. Her harem transcends the boundaries of space, time, gender, sexuality or species.
 

Seed00

Well-Known Member
#22
Which means Jack and Shit when you realize that Sailor Moon has RESURRECTION powers.
Didn't those particular powers kill her when she used it?
 

Shiakou

Well-Known Member
#23
Seed00 said:
Which means Jack and Shit when you realize that Sailor Moon has RESURRECTION powers.
Didn't those particular powers kill her when she used it?
Depends on arc and medium. Anime Usagi is only able to use her resurrection powers in desperation; manga Usagi is fully able to resurrect the entire Earth by mid-series (as a counterpart to Saturn, who can kill everyone on Earth with one strike).
 

Comartemis

Well-Known Member
#24
zeebee1 said:
So, Fate is useless?
Who do you think has Endymion's star seed? :p

Come on. Really? Precia being boss fight material?
Planet-buster Senshi isn't a thing that happens until at least late in the second or third season and right now I'm focusing on just the Dark Kingdom, so yes. If Precia were at the top of her game she'd be a natural SS-rank mage, and that puts her somewhere around where the Generals are (or at least Kunzite. Giving Jadeite and the rest their manga power levels might actually be a nerf now that I think of it).
 

Garahs

Well-Known Member
#25
I like most of it, but I don't think senshi should be an al hazard creation. Forgotten allies, sure though before or after the senshi wars started might not matter. And most likely wiped off the map by the possessed Galaxia.
 
Top