Original Fiction Competition

chronodekar

Obsessively signs his posts
Staff member
#51
When @[zerohour] asked me if I was interested in judging for a fiction contest, I said yes without really thinking about it. As things are, I already write reviews for fanfiction (read my blog) and felt that it would be up my alley. Then I came here and actually READ this forum thread last week. Holy Smokes! The level of enthusiasm and prize pot had me stunned. :eek: In fact, I nearly threw in a STEAM game to the pot myself. I say 'nearly' because my internet went out before I could reply and I had a night to sleep over the matter. I'm still interested in chipping something to the prize pot - won't look good to be the only judge who isn't, but I'm going to take a few more days to decide exactly what my donation will be.

Speaking of judge-chat, I'm almost always on skype. Will PM @[zerohour] and @[Meinos Kaen] my username later. We'll need to formalize exactly how this should be done.

Judging aside, I would like to raise some concerns about how this is organized. This would be easier if its all handled by a single person, so until we decide who it will be (more likely zerohour as far as I'm concerned), I'll refer to this individual as the STEWARD.

First off, it looks like we're planning to actually publish an Anthology of all the stories on Amazon - the good ones anyway. Can we have all participants sign over publishing rights for all submitted entries to the STEWARD? The idea being that the STEWARD will be free to re-publish the stories with another publisher (perhaps smashwords?) at a later date without informing anyone and can make a personal profit from the sale? Let us assume that the money made will be re-invested into the next iteration of the contest, but those rights should be handed over to the STEWARD.

Please note, I'm talking about publishing rights and NOT copyright. Simple example - if @[byakuryuu] submitted "Mary Sue adventures:year 1" for the contest, the STEWARD will be free to take his work,possibly edit, publish, make a profit off it without sharing the money with byakuryuu (or TFF). The characters, locations, scenes ...etc are of course the property of byakuryuu and he can write another book if he wants, but in regards to the submitted entry, he can't stop the STEWARD from publishing for a price or even just giving it away for free.

Since the copyright for the work remains with byakuryuu, if he wants to, he can (legally) demand that no-one write fanfiction off his property. Just because we are a fanfiction site, does NOT mean that anyone can (legally) write up fanfiction based on original stories that came from here. That right (to be a jerk) belongs exclusively to the author.

Call me a pain-in-the-ass if you want, but since we're talking about original fiction here, I think it best to clear up the legal air first rather than getting into a messy situation later.

On the matter of prize money, I think it best to transfer the donations to the STEWARD before the contest starts. i.e. before September 1st, so that we actually know its there. Not to accuse anyone, but I've seen strange things happen when money is involved.

Speaking of which, to avoid publishing bias, can we prevent the donors from participating in the contest? I would like to set a reasonably high standard for the 'published' stories and don't want a situation where "he/she donated, so we will put his/her story in the anthology regardless of its quality". Or we could just have all the participants chip in some money as well. My vote is for the former option.

About the anthology - the participants should be clear about what name they want us to use. i.e. their forum handle, their real name or some personal nickname? Speaking of which can I request (for ego reasons) to have the judges names be on the anthology as well? Would give me a reason to buy and show off the book. :) And if the author doesn't mind, can we know their country of origin? To write next to their name on the table of contents like,

Story 1 by authorA (USA)
Story 2 by authorB (UK)
Story 3 by authorC (Russia)
Story 4 by authorD (India)
Story 5 by authorE (USA)
...
etc.

There was some discussion about 'theme' earlier and I strongly feel that we need one - would make the published book better, IMO. To keep things fair, let this be hidden until September 1st. i.e. when the contest starts.

I'll let judging issues be decided by zerohour, but I'm curious - as a participant, what do you folks expect/want? That every chapter be judged, or that everything be judged at the end of the contest?

Am pretty sure I'm forgetting something,
chronodekar
 

byakuryuu

Well-Known Member
#52
chronodekar said:
When @[zerohour] asked me if I was interested in judging for a fiction contest, I said yes without really thinking about it. As things are, I already write reviews for fanfiction (read my blog) and felt that it would be up my alley. Then I came here and actually READ this forum thread last week. Holy Smokes! The level of enthusiasm and prize pot had me stunned. :eek: In fact, I nearly threw in a STEAM game to the pot myself. I say 'nearly' because my internet went out before I could reply and I had a night to sleep over the matter. I'm still interested in chipping something to the prize pot - won't look good to be the only judge who isn't, but I'm going to take a few more days to decide exactly what my donation will be.

Speaking of judge-chat, I'm almost always on skype. Will PM @[zerohour] and @[Meinos Kaen] my username later. We'll need to formalize exactly how this should be done.

Judging aside, I would like to raise some concerns about how this is organized. This would be easier if its all handled by a single person, so until we decide who it will be (more likely zerohour as far as I'm concerned), I'll refer to this individual as the STEWARD.

First off, it looks like we're planning to actually publish an Anthology of all the stories on Amazon - the good ones anyway. Can we have all participants sign over publishing rights for all submitted entries to the STEWARD? The idea being that the STEWARD will be free to re-publish the stories with another publisher (perhaps smashwords?) at a later date without informing anyone and can make a personal profit from the sale? Let us assume that the money made will be re-invested into the next iteration of the contest, but those rights should be handed over to the STEWARD.

Please note, I'm talking about publishing rights and NOT copyright. Simple example - if @[byakuryuu] submitted "Mary Sue adventures:year 1" for the contest, the STEWARD will be free to take his work,possibly edit, publish, make a profit off it without sharing the money with byakuryuu (or TFF). The characters, locations, scenes ...etc are of course the property of byakuryuu and he can write another book if he wants, but in regards to the submitted entry, he can't stop the STEWARD from publishing for a price or even just giving it away for free.

Since the copyright for the work remains with byakuryuu, if he wants to, he can (legally) demand that no-one write fanfiction off his property. Just because we are a fanfiction site, does NOT mean that anyone can (legally) write up fanfiction based on original stories that came from here. That right (to be a jerk) belongs exclusively to the author.

Call me a pain-in-the-ass if you want, but since we're talking about original fiction here, I think it best to clear up the legal air first rather than getting into a messy situation later.

On the matter of prize money, I think it best to transfer the donations to the STEWARD before the contest starts. i.e. before September 1st, so that we actually know its there. Not to accuse anyone, but I've seen strange things happen when money is involved.

Speaking of which, to avoid publishing bias, can we prevent the donors from participating in the contest? I would like to set a reasonably high standard for the 'published' stories and don't want a situation where "he/she donated, so we will put his/her story in the anthology regardless of its quality". Or we could just have all the participants chip in some money as well. My vote is for the former option.

About the anthology - the participants should be clear about what name they want us to use. i.e. their forum handle, their real name or some personal nickname? Speaking of which can I request (for ego reasons) to have the judges names be on the anthology as well? Would give me a reason to buy and show off the book. :) And if the author doesn't mind, can we know their country of origin? To write next to their name on the table of contents like,

Story 1 by authorA (USA)
Story 2 by authorB (UK)
Story 3 by authorC (Russia)
Story 4 by authorD (India)
Story 5 by authorE (USA)
...
etc.

There was some discussion about 'theme' earlier and I strongly feel that we need one - would make the published book better, IMO. To keep things fair, let this be hidden until September 1st. i.e. when the contest starts.

I'll let judging issues be decided by zerohour, but I'm curious - as a participant, what do you folks expect/want? That every chapter be judged, or that everything be judged at the end of the contest?

Am pretty sure I'm forgetting something,
chronodekar
In reference to this, Byakuryuu does not mind his works being published without knowledge so long as his real name is referred and that reviews (Good or Bad) are punted his way.

Also, Mary Sue Adventures: Year One? Pfft.

More like "Self-Insert: The Series" or "So you really think you can survive a magical world with dangers and mystery with street smarts, no martial training and sweet-talking? Be my Guest!" or "Some Dudes Really Just Want To Stay Friends (Even with Attractive Chicks)" or "Lovecraft Goes To Pittsburgh".

Come on, man.
 

chronodekar

Obsessively signs his posts
Staff member
#53
Just picked a random poster from the thread as an example. Didn't mean to accuse you of bad writing or anything. Sorry!

But, after reading those titles, I'm now looking forward to see what you come up with. :)

-chronodekar
 

violinmana

(Hardcore) Gamer
#54
I vote for Meinos Kaen as the STEWARD. He's the most knowledgeable about this stuff anyways, and he has good(?!) judgement concerning publishing.
 
#55
>>prevent donors from participating
If this goes through, I'd like to respectfully withdraw the drawing I offered, as I'd much rather contribute a story. No offense.
 

zerohour

Well-Known Member
#57
We're not going to prevent people from entering and being part of the anthology. Considering that judges are interesting in participating, it would be quite hypocritical to prevent you guys from participating.

We're currently debating if donors can win the prize money. chrono and I are on the fence, so we're waiting to hear what Kaen thinks.

Halibel, since I'm assuming you're drawing the picture/cover either way, you're cool.

Edit: Yes, cash donors are NOT eligible to get the cash prize, but everything else is still on the table.
 

zerohour

Well-Known Member
#58
Alright everyone. The competition starts in about a week, so we ought to post the official rules. These are still subject to change but hopefully not too much. A new thread will be opened when the competition starts, and a legal document will be posted as well, once we get that figured out.


Rules:

-Every week, you are expected to produce a minimum of 2,500 word submission for the contest. I say submission because you can write it as one 2,500 word chapter, two, 1,250 word chapters, or whatever format makes you most comfortable.

-The contest will continue for four weeks, for a total of 10,000 words, or more.

-There is no limit to the amount of submissions you can make. However, only one work from each author will be chosen for the anthology.

-THE STORY MUST BE COMPLETE. Each story is mean to be a complete, self contained work. While you can write stories linked to other original works you have written, it must be self contained, with no "to be continued" tacked onto the end.

-The MAXIMUM word count is 25,000 words per entry. While I don't expect them to reach that size, I would rather avoid any issue that could arise from a large number of massive entries.


Scoring:
Each Judge has elected to score the chapter by what they think is most important. They are as follows:

Meinos Kaen:
Grammar: 15 points
Characters: 15 points
Plot: 15 points
Theme: 5 points

Chronodekar:
Grammar: 20 points
Plot: 25 points
Theme: 5 points

Zerohour:
Grammar: 10
Plot: 15
Characters: 15
Theme: 10


Bonus/Tropes: In an effort to make this a bit more dynamic, as well as stimulate creative juices in our participants, each week, we will select four tropes whose use will earn you points.

-2 points for using one of the tropes.
-5 points for using two or more.

These are in no way a requirement for to story. They are merely intended as something to give some form of guidance for those who need it, and a possible challenge for others. Feel free to pass on them.

Penalties:
-One point lost for every 250 words under the 2,500 minimum.
-One point lost for every day your submission is late.

Final Judging:
One week after the last submissions are posted. The judges will conduct a final round of judging. This is to give the writers a chance to go back, fix mistakes and errors, and clean up their work. The rubric for the FInal Judging Round has not been decided yet, but it will be one hundred points per judge.


STEWARD:
Zerohour. We've agreed that since this was my idea, that I should have stewardship. For those of you concerned about my lack of experience, don't be because....

PUBLISHER:
Meinos Kaen. He has more experience with this sort of thing, so we felt it best that he be put in charge of publishing the Amazon version of this. Hopefully I'll learn a bit from him and be able to shoulder this responsibility in future iterations of the contests, but just as likely, he'll do such a good job that it won't be necessary.

PRINTED COPY:
We are considering making physical copies of the collection after it is done. We are probably going to see how well the online sales do, to see if they would cover the expenses, or perhaps running a Kickstarter. chronodekar is planning to fund this as his donation and will make a separate announcement with details. A primary concern from his end is how expensive it will end up as. But at the very least, the plan is to send 3 printed copies to the top three winners

PRIZES:
Prizes have been donated by a number of TFFers. While we are still waiting to hear from a few people, here is what we have confirmed so far. The first place winner will receive the following:
-$220
-Choosing the Cover Art for the Anthology

All others, assuming their stories are of sufficient quality, will be published in the anthology as well.
 

violinmana

(Hardcore) Gamer
#59
Your earning points for tropes actually looks like subtracting points for tropes. :p

And if a cash donor wins the the contest, will the cash prize filter down to the next available slot?
 

zerohour

Well-Known Member
#60
Nope. I keep it for myself so I can start filling a bathtub with money.


...Actually, I'm not sure. Giving it to the second prize place seems like the logical progression, but if all the cash donors dominate the top slots, it seems a but silly to give the prize to 5th or 6th place...

For now, assume that it moves down to the next slot, but I should probably talk with the other guys about this.
 
#61
If you define a theme for the contest I'd like to give it a try.
Keep me in the loop.
 

AkinaAE86

Well-Known Member
#62
This is a good idea, but I can't participate. Too busy as of late.
Should motivate some more activity.
 

zerohour

Well-Known Member
#63
Theme will be officially announced on September First, though it's pretty much an open secret now. I need to learn to be more discreet.

As for being too busy... You can't spare twenty minutes a day? 2500 words over the course of a week is about 350 words a day, which shouldn't take that long to write.
 

H-Man

Random phantom.
#64
...so, turns out I'm going on a trip tomorrow and can't confirm my writing ability for the next week. Can I still write for the following weeks or should I just quit now?
 

zerohour

Well-Known Member
#65
You can still enter. A mild score penalty, but nothing that would affect the viability of the story going into the anthology.
 

violinmana

(Hardcore) Gamer
#66
Aka, scores don't affect the anthology, but affect the prize money.
 

QE1

Well-Known Member
#68
Just to make sure, is outside help completely forbidden or is it permissible? I'm not planning on using any but editing is not one of my strengths. Am I allowed to get someone else to help me edit my work for the competition phase? I assume any works making the cut for the anthology will be edited by/with the help of the judges.
 

chronodekar

Obsessively signs his posts
Staff member
#69
QE1 said:
Just to make sure, is outside help completely forbidden or is it permissible? I'm not planning on using any but editing is not one of my strengths. Am I allowed to get someone else to help me edit my work for the competition phase? I assume any works making the cut for the anthology will be edited by/with the help of the judges.
Zero has the final say in this; but speaking as a judge, I don't think it matters. Not like we can enforce everyone to write their own story without help. Besides, getting a beta and fine-tuning the words is an important step for any writer. In fact, I encourage it! :)

For politeness sake, it would be a good idea to mention your beta (or betas) along with your submission.

-chronodekar
 

zerohour

Well-Known Member
#70
I'm with chrono on this. If you want to get a beta 9pretty sure fanfiction.net has soem sort of system set up for this.) feel free.
 

byakuryuu

Well-Known Member
#71
One question before I upload in 50 hours: Is the limit 25,000 words per entry meaning 25,000 words limited to a chapter? Or 25,000 for all the chapters combined for the story?
 

chronodekar

Obsessively signs his posts
Staff member
#72
byakuryuu said:
One question before I upload in 50 hours: Is the limit 25,000 words per entry meaning 25,000 words limited to a chapter? Or 25,000 for all the chapters combined for the story?
The 25,000 limit is for your entire story (all chapters included).

Each week you are expected to produce at a minimum 2,500 per chapter. Going for 4 weeks, that means a minimum of 10,000 words per story.

Chances are, the minimum limit (10k) will be exceeded. Since we're planning to publish, the cost increases the more words there are (not to mention print), that upper limit is to prevent people from submitting 50,000 word epics.

-chronodekar
 
Top