Naruto Pro-Wrestling and Naruto

[mortalone]

This loose idea is floating around in my skull that I thought I should jot down. I was watching some Japanese pro-wrestling vids when I just started thinking to myself "Man, isn't The Great Sasuke like a real life Tobi?" I mean Tobi back when he was cool, before all this Madara shit got started.

For those of you unfamiliar with Japanese pro-wrestling, it focuses more on athleticism then the promo based shit we do here (I heard one episode of TNA -- a 2 hour show -- featured only 17 minutes of actual wrestling... "wrestling matters"). I like a good promo as much as the next guy, but there's definitely an appeal to what the Japanese do.

Anyhow, The Great Sasuke comes dresses like a ninja while wearing a Luchador mask on his head and does all kinds of crazy in ring antics. Here's a video:

<a href='http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d65jy6XYDlM' target='_blank' rel='nofollow'>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d65jy6XYDlM</a>

But it doesn't stop there. A few years back The Great Sasuke ran for government. While wearing his Luchador mask. And won.

*This image is for real. Seriously.

If Tobi were a real life person couldn't you picture him doing the exact same thing?




So here's the idea. It's not some stupid plot about ninjas and wrestling or whatever. It's an open idea anyone can use if they want. The idea is to model Naruto characters on pro-wrestlers. In particular, since a.) wrestlers behave kind of like Naruto-verse ninjas anyway and b.) since most taijutsu scenes I read are just plain lousy "punch, block, kick," I feel like this idea presents an interesting way to spice things up without betraying canon.

 

[GenocideHeart]

Just for the record, you've got it the other way around - The Great Sasuke's been doing this since before Tobi was a glimmer in Kishimoto's tiny brain, so if anything, Tobi's a fantasy Great Sasuke.

Just saying, being a huge puroresu fan and all.

And if you think The Great Sasuke's over the top, take a look at Keiji Mutoh aka The Great Muta. Guy is positively insane.

 

[mortalone]

Just for the record, you've got it the other way around - The Great Sasuke's been doing this since before Tobi was a glimmer in Kishimoto's tiny brain, so if anything, Tobi's a fantasy Great Sasuke.

Just saying, being a huge puroresu fan and all.

And if you think The Great Sasuke's over the top, take a look at Keiji Mutoh aka The Great Muta. Guy is positively insane.

I'm aware that The Great Sasuke has been around longer. I don't think I ever said otherwise...



MUTA is my absolute favorite. Those absent-minded looks, the costumes and face paint, the Asian mist, the in-ring and around the ring antics. His battles with Sting were positively epic. And nobody that size in the WWE does Moonsaults.

GREATOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO MUUUUUUTTTTTTTTAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

 

[GenocideHeart]

My personal favorites are Keiji Mutoh, Mitsuharu Misawa (may God bless his soul) and Antonio Inoki. WWE wishes it had people with such talent.

I've seen some blasphemers on Youtube suggesting that crap like Wade Barrett should have The Great Muta job to them to 'get them over'. Wait, what? Aside from how it isn't that easy to get people over in Japan (you gotta earn that popularity, they don't simply feed you an estabilished star like they do in the US), Barrett sucks. A lot.

That said, WWE had Yoshihiro Asai (aka Ultimo Dragon), Kenzo Suzuki and Yoshihiro Tajiri, and criminally wasted them with stupid gimmicks and moveset nerfs.

About the only Japanese wrestler who made it big in WWE, back when it still was WWF, is Bull Nakano, who tore up the women's division in the short time she was a WWF athlete. Unsurprising, seeing as how Nakano is legitimately tough instead of glorified T&A.

 

[Lord Raine]

Just for the record, I'm going to try to degrade Naruto in this topic somehow, someway, even if I have to invent things for the OP to have said to do it.

We know. It's not like you can do anything else. Not anymore.

 

[GenocideHeart]

Just for the record, I'm going to try to degrade Naruto in this topic somehow, someway, even if I have to invent things for the OP to have said to do it.

We know. It's not like you can do anything else. Not anymore.

Quoting the OP:

This loose idea is floating around in my skull that I thought I should jot down. I was watching some Japanese pro-wrestling vids when I just started thinking to myself "Man, isn't The Great Sasuke like a real life Tobi?" I mean Tobi back when he was cool, before all this Madara shit got started.

Bolded part. The way it's worded, it essentially implies The Great Sasuke's the one imitating Tobi, when it's, in fact, the opposite if anything else.

Feeling silly yet? Oh wait, it's you - you are physically incapable of such a thing, or of feeling shame for that matter.

Also, where exactly did I degrade Naruto? By saying Kishimoto has a tiny brain, which he *does* seeing how many stereotypes he unimaginatively uses in his manga, and I wasn't the only one who called him out on that? Do note my biggest beef was in how the way the phrase was worded could easily imply that Tobi was the original, when he wasn't.

But I don't expect you to comprehend such a complex concept. Go back to the ABC table, I'll wait until you can clear that one.

 

[GenocideHeart]

More on topic:

Yes, Ultimo Dragon held ALL THOSE BELTS AT ONCE at one point in his life.

 

[Anonguy]

More on topic:

Yes, Ultimo Dragon held ALL THOSE BELTS AT ONCE at one point in his life.

Ah, the J-Crown, that was a good idea that could never be sustained.

Looks boss as hell though.

 

[mortalone]

I definitely did not mean for what I said to imply that Tobi came first. I'm pretty sure The Great Sasuke had already been elected to government before Tobi was introduced in the manga. Or maybe it was about the same time. In any case, point is that Great Sasuke came first by a good decade or more.

Although I'll pick a bone with something you've said. WWE does NOT wish for the talent of one such as Kobashi. There are people in WWE who I think do wish for it (e.g. Triple H -- however you wish to fault the man, he has a real respect for the business of Pro-Wrestling) but a.) there are people in WWE management who realize someone like Kobashi would make Cena look absurdly horrible and don't want that and b.) the WWE doesn't actually want you to get over, they want you to get over with what THEY write, hence the "We want Ryder" chants go unanswered (since he got over on Youtube and not through them).

 

[Hashasheen]

The WWE is a company dealing in sports entertainment. Not puro or lucha libre or rassling or catch-as-a-catch-can. It's just one style of wrestling that is dominant in the West.

As for Japan, I'm also a puro fan, though not knowing what the hell they're saying hurts my enjoyment. Lucha Libre's also great, but again, commentary hurts enjoyment.

@OP's opinion on Naruto battles: Meh. I'm planning on using wrestling moves in my story, since those things can kill a guy if not protected properly.

@Genocide: Wanna start a Wrestling Discussion thread elsewhere?

 

[Bill Felix]

I'm down with it as long as the fic features the Timed Exploding Barbwire Match in some bastardized form.

@Genocide: Wanna start a Wrestling Discussion thread elsewhere?

Please do. I'd start one myself, but I'm shit at making threads.

 

[Lord Raine]

Just for the record, I'm going to try to degrade Naruto in this topic somehow, someway, even if I have to invent things for the OP to have said to do it.

We know. It's not like you can do anything else. Not anymore.

Quoting the OP:

This loose idea is floating around in my skull that I thought I should jot down. I was watching some Japanese pro-wrestling vids when I just started thinking to myself "Man, isn't The Great Sasuke like a real life Tobi?" I mean Tobi back when he was cool, before all this Madara shit got started.

Bolded part. The way it's worded, it essentially implies The Great Sasuke's the one imitating Tobi, when it's, in fact, the opposite if anything else.

Feeling silly yet?

No, because at no point did he ever say which came first, or even imply it. But you'll be damned if you let a little thing like that stop you from making your disparaging remarks.

I don't know what's sadder; that you keep doing shit like this, or that you've convinced yourself that what you're seeing is actually there, and not just a figment of your delusional mind.

 

[mortalone]

Nothing wrong with barbwire at the chuunin exams, but as I said, that's not what I have in mind at all. I'm just thinking about Naruto characters (how they are written, how you can repackage them without raping all aspects of canon) and fighting scenes in fanfics (how they can be made more interesting).

As things are ninjas in Naruverse jump around a lot, using trees and shit, so instead of talking about two men going at it in the squared circle, we have two men going at it in the forest in what amounts to a no holds barred wrestling match. What in wrestling would be a power bomb off the top rope becomes a power bomb off a branch of a tree 30 feet in the air.

In other words, this thread isn't about some crack idea of Naruto characters being pro-wrestlers, but on repackaging how Naruto fanfics are written by borrowing ideas out of wrestling.

(Why wrestling and not MMA? Because the showmanship in pro-wrestling and the "terrain use" are more in keeping with the motifs of the Naruverse.)

 

[Hashasheen]

Just for the record, I'm going to try to degrade Naruto in this topic somehow, someway, even if I have to invent things for the OP to have said to do it.

We know. It's not like you can do anything else. Not anymore.

Quoting the OP:

This loose idea is floating around in my skull that I thought I should jot down. I was watching some Japanese pro-wrestling vids when I just started thinking to myself "Man, isn't The Great Sasuke like a real life Tobi?" I mean Tobi back when he was cool, before all this Madara shit got started.

Bolded part. The way it's worded, it essentially implies The Great Sasuke's the one imitating Tobi, when it's, in fact, the opposite if anything else.

Feeling silly yet?

No, because at no point did he ever say which came first, or even imply it. But you'll be damned if you let a little thing like that stop you from making your disparaging remarks.

I don't know what's sadder; that you keep doing shit like this, or that you've convinced yourself that what you're seeing is actually there, and not just a figment of your delusional mind.

I think what's really sad is you two continually sniping at each other.

 

[GenocideHeart]

Just for the record, I'm going to try to degrade Naruto in this topic somehow, someway, even if I have to invent things for the OP to have said to do it.

We know. It's not like you can do anything else. Not anymore.

Quoting the OP:

This loose idea is floating around in my skull that I thought I should jot down. I was watching some Japanese pro-wrestling vids when I just started thinking to myself "Man, isn't The Great Sasuke like a real life Tobi?" I mean Tobi back when he was cool, before all this Madara shit got started.

Bolded part. The way it's worded, it essentially implies The Great Sasuke's the one imitating Tobi, when it's, in fact, the opposite if anything else.

Feeling silly yet?

No, because at no point did he ever say which came first, or even imply it. But you'll be damned if you let a little thing like that stop you from making your disparaging remarks.

First off, the way it was worded DID imply it. It's not the intention, but the way the phrase comes across - because on the Internet, generally you can only read comments without being able to see the meaning behind them, which is one of the reasons why phrases such as that one can be so easily misunderstood - all you can see is the literal meaning, and the possible implications behind it.

But that concept is clearly too hard for you to grasp, so feel free to disregard it like you always do and go HURR DURR I'M ALWAYS RIGHT.

Secondly, the only disparaging comment I made was on Kishimoto's brainpower, and seeing how he's using every goddamn cliche and trope in the fucking book without an ounce of originality sprinkled in, I'll feel goddamn entitled to say that. At least his brother was more creative, with Masashi you can literally predict what's going to happen next and spoil the plot twists WEEKS AHEAD - as you should well know since you called out a lot of the recent events months ago.

But again, don't let that stop you from being a rampant hypocrite and deny it.

All I did was fanboy over The Great Sasuke and take offense at an implication that he was a copy, when in fact he was the original. But I see you'll grasp at the tiniest straws to attack me lately, so I'm not surprised in the slightest. Pot, kettle, black.

----

Incidentally, I proposed this very same idea years ago, and it gave birth to a short lived fic here on TFF. It was mostly WWE centric though...

----

So... where's the wrestling topic again?

 

[Zimo]

This topic makes me lol.

 

[Anonguy]

Me too Zimo, me too

 

[Samurai Jackson]

So what kind of movesets do you see for the characters? Like for example I can see Kakashi as a cross between Dean Malenko (man of a thousand holds) and Shelton Benjamin (underrated as hell and always came up short against the main eventers despite putting on one hell of a show). But for the others?

Would Oro use Randy Orton's moveset simply because he's the viper or does that better fit Orosuke? And which wrestler out there best fits Naruto?

 

[GiantMonkeyMan]

'Pro'-wrestling is so fucking lame...

 

[roting_CORPSE]

tl;dr

but didnt Vesvius and Mandaloraian Jedi had a thread about this or something?

 

[spooky316]

tl;dr

but didnt Vesvius and Mandaloraian Jedi had a thread about this or something?

Amusingly, I was just going through that thread the other day.

<a href='http://z14.invisionfree.com/The_Fanfiction_Forum/index.php?showtopic=7399&st=0' target='_blank' rel='nofollow'>http://z14.invisionfree.com/The_Fanfiction...topic=7399&st=0</a>

 

[mortalone]

So what kind of movesets do you see for the characters? Like for example I can see Kakashi as a cross between Dean Malenko (man of a thousand holds) and Shelton Benjamin (underrated as hell and always came up short against the main eventers despite putting on one hell of a show). But for the others?

Would Oro use Randy Orton's moveset simply because he's the viper or does that better fit Orosuke? And which wrestler out there best fits Naruto?

I must confess, other than Tobi = The Great Sasuke I haven't thought out that particular aspect very heavily. Use of pro-wrestling moves and pro-wrestling style characterizations has an obvious carry over and that's more what I've been thinking of. One of the first visuals that came to mind when I started thinking of this is Naruto and Sasuke sparring and things getting out of hand with Naruto spearing Sasuke and then wailing on him repeatedly, all the while JR style commentary running through my mind: "my god King, I think Naruto just speared Sasuke in half!"

Personality-wise Randy Orton and Orochimaru are just totally different, but in terms of physical movements Orton would probably be a good model. Randy Orton as a complete package actually is not a bad starting point for a post-Orochimaru-trained Sasuke.

As for Naruto, some kind of fusion of Hulk Hogan's baby face persona + "hulking out" with Macho Man Randy Savage's ring work. Definitely late 80's/early 90's vintage stuff. But you could always take it in a different direction with Naruto. There are a number of popular fanon approaches to Naruto, some of which could easily be fit to characters like Stone Cold or HBK.

 

[Ingenuity]

-Generic comment about how wrestling is fake-

 

[Hashasheen]

... Where would one put a pro-wrestling discussion thread?

 

[mortalone]

... Where would one put a pro-wrestling discussion thread?

Right up your candy ass!