Nasuverse Shinji Switch

[nick012000]

Due to Zelretch experimenting with his Kaleidoscope magic, the minds of Shinji Ikari and Shinji Matou get swapped, immediately prior to the beginnings of their respective series.

I'd imagine the fic would mostly concentrate on Spineless!Nice Guy!Shinji's attempts to finish off the Holy Grail War with a minimum of bloodshed, with the occasional segment of Evil!Rapist!Shinji being put through the Gainax Mindfuck Hell he so justly deserves.

 

[kaiseryuu]

Not much of a premse so far...Though somewhat tempting... :evil2:

 

[digdug]

It would probably be fun to read.

Especially the "Gainax Mindfuck Hell" bits :evil2:

 

[GenocideHeart]

It would probably be fun to read.

Especially the "Gainax Mindfuck Hell" bits :evil2:

Except Shinji Matou would feel right at home in the NGE world. Hell, he'd go along with Gendo's plan just because it lets him be a giant jackass without people getting on his case for being insane. A giant jackass with a super robot, no less.

Until 3I, that is. Where he promptly backstabs Gendo and takes control of the Impact, making his dream world come true.

BAD END.

 

[Muramasa]

I doubt Shinji Matou is even compatible with Unit 01. That would screw EVA world quite a bit I think.

 

[GenocideHeart]

I doubt Shinji Matou is even compatible with Unit 01. That would screw EVA world quite a bit I think.

We aren't ever told exactly HOW the Evangelions work, honestly. If it was a matter of soul, then the presence of Kensuke and Touji in the plug should have basically shut Unit-01 down, yet it didn't. And the dummy plugs are definitely soulless...

So you can make a case for them being keyed on the BODY (and probably DNA or brain pattern) of the user, which also explains why Rei's clones all can pilot 00. The series even makes it a big deal that Rei III isn't the same thing as Rei II and never will, which to me implies their 'soul' is different - about the only thing in common is the Angel factor...

Bottiom line, Matou might well be able to use the Evangelions. Because if he can't, then conversely Shinji will likely be unable to do anything Matou can, which includes basically anything regarding the Grail Wars or a Servant. Double standards are bad, mmm-kay.

 

[Mechatrill]

On the other hand, Shinji Ikari would probably return Rider to Sakura, and the whole thing with forcing Rider to drain people for mana would never happen. At that point, Heaven's Feel would probably be out since Sakura wont get pushed over the edge by the spineless nice guy. Thus, we'd have Rider in Fate/Unlimited Blade Work. That's always a good thing.

 

[nick012000]

It would probably be fun to read.

Especially the "Gainax Mindfuck Hell" bits? :evil2:

Except Shinji Matou would feel right at home in the NGE world. Hell, he'd go along with Gendo's plan just because it lets him be a giant jackass without people getting on his case for being insane. A giant jackass with a super robot, no less.

Until 3I, that is. Where he promptly backstabs Gendo and takes control of the Impact, making his dream world come true.

BAD END.

Heh. You mean other than getting his ass kicked by Asuka when she catches him raping a drunken Misato, and then getting it kicked by Misato when she sobers up and Asuka explains what happened? Not to mention that Gendo will probably be going out of his way to break his son's will, and there'd be no reason for Toji to hold back once Shinji starts fighting back (because unlike Shinji Ikari, Shinji Mato's got too much pride to simply take a few punches).

Not to mention the Angels with the mindfucking powers. Let's see... I think that therer's the one that throws him into an internal world with the Eva when he falls into its "shadow", and the space one with the mindfuck beam. Did I miss any?

 

[GenocideHeart]

Asuka kicking his ass is only going to happen if Matou doesn't fight back at all, because frankly she hasn't shown a shred of ability at actual fighting outside the goddamn Evangelion, and only looks tough because she's compared to a passive doll and a spineless worm.

Also, Shinji tends to do worse than just rape. He pretty much broke Sakura's mind, so he's no stranger to will games. Gendo is in for a nasty surprise if he expects it to be a walk in the park, and on top of that, he better pray Matou doesn't appear during Sachiel's attack, because Matou's answer to him carting rei out will be to not give a damn - which will put a nice, sledgehammer-shaped dent in his carefully laid plans, since he obviously was counting on the guilt trip, and Matou has about as much conscience as the Devil.

You are overestimating the NGE crew and underestimating Matou's ruthlessness and ability to mindfuck. Sakura is a testament to his ability to pull a Gendo on someone - he didn't just manipulate her, he BROKE her, in a million pieces.

(for the record, even assuming Gendo could somehow guilt trip Matou into piloting, there's no way Misato would take him in her house given his attitude - so he'd end up living by himself, which translates into some poor girl getting traumatized, I'd wager. And Section 2 is going to be worthless at preventing it - they are inept to the extreme.)

 

[nick012000]

I don't think Gendo would need to guilt-trip Mato into piloting it.

A gigantic robot would be a massive help in the Holy Grail War, after all.

As for him beating up Asuka... it'd be kind of difficult for him to effectively fight back if he's in the middle of raping Misato. It's not exactly an optimal position to be fighting in.

 

[GenocideHeart]

I don't think Gendo would need to guilt-trip Mato into piloting it.

A gigantic robot would be a massive help in the Holy Grail War, after all.

As for him beating up Asuka... it'd be kind of difficult for him to effectively fight back if he's in the middle of raping Misato. It's not exactly an optimal position to be fighting in.

If he was in the middle of raping Misato, she'd likely be bound and gagged, which means he's free to leave her alone for a bit and go kick Asuka's ass without any trouble.

Assuming he doesn't bind and gag her and rape her as well. Matou wasn't particularly big or strong even in the series, but he also had no qualms about injuring people who annoyed him. The question isn't if he can kick Asuka's ass, it's how badly he'll kick her ass. And whether she'll even be alive afterwards, I suppose - the guy has no qualms about killing, either.

As for the giant robot, you forget that Matou HATES being forced into things. He'd refuse on general principle, just to show Gendo who's boss. You know he would... he's not like Shinji, unfortunately. So what's Gendo gonna do, cram a totally uncooperative pilot in the giant robot? Yeah, that'll work REAL well.

Face it, Gendo is screwed if the switch happens at that point. He's going to either have to cave in to matou's requests or send Rei out to get her ass kicked, and then watch in horror as his carefully planned Instrumentality unravels.

Sometimes, it doesn't pay to be an Ikari. :evil2:

 

[Muramasa]

Bottom line, Matou might well be able to use the Evangelions. Because if he can't, then conversely Shinji will likely be unable to do anything Matou can, which includes basically anything regarding the Grail Wars or a Servant. Double standards are bad, mmm-kay.

It isn't that much of a gap really. Apparently Matou is even more inept at magic than Shirou is. He wasn't capable of summoning a servant. That was all Sakura. Then Zoken interfered and used a book of sorts to put Shinji in control of Rider. If I recall all that nonsense involving the school was Rider's noble phantasm at work.

Then again, Ikari would be clueless about the Grail War, and a *Matou* asking what it is he's supposed to do is cause for much suspicion. And to top it off, being stuck in the body of a rapist is just gonna do wonders for his psyche. :headbanger:

 

[Avider]

From Type-Moon Wiki

Because Shinji is not Rider's true Master, he must use an item created from the command spells of Rider's true Master (Sakura) known as the Book of the False Attendant. The book, which acts as a provisionary command spell, allows Shinji to control Rider and, due to Shinji's incompetence, was made twice by Rider's original Master (Sakura). Because it is not a true command spell, it burns if it is used beyond its limits or if Rider is destroyed.

On the subject of Shinji Matou, please remember that he lost to Shirou quite easily. It's not inconceivable that Asuka can beat him, badly or quite badly. I'd wager that Rin can kick his butt even without resorting to magic, and in terms of physical prowess, I wouldn't figure Asuka to be that much less than Rin.

As for the giant robot, you forget that Matou HATES being forced into things. He'd refuse on general principle, just to show Gendo who's boss. You know he would... he's not like Shinji, unfortunately. So what's Gendo gonna do, cram a totally uncooperative pilot in the giant robot? Yeah, that'll work REAL well.

Matou changed his tune *very* quickly once Shirou threatened to kill him, Gendou can do much worse. I'd figure Matou will find that he "likes" piloting after a staredown with the end barrel of a gun. Both Shinjis have one thing in common, and that is they're wimps. Matou's just an ass also.

Genocide, you're giving Matou too much credit, he's a normal kid with a massive ego, not a super-sadist with godly manipulative powahs. That's Ikari.

*Edit

Just read some additional stuff above, wanted to address them as well.

Also, Shinji tends to do worse than just rape. He pretty much broke Sakura's mind, so he's no stranger to will games...You are overestimating the NGE crew and underestimating Matou's ruthlessness and ability to mindfuck. Sakura is a testament to his ability to pull a Gendo on someone - he didn't just manipulate her, he BROKE her, in a million pieces.

Que? Zoken broke Sakura, not Shinji. Shinji just took advantage of her after the fact , it's not a testament to his ability to pull a Gendo at all. Zoken's the mindfuck, Shinji's the opportunist.

 

[Muramasa]

Oh so that book of false attendant is pretty much a command seal on loan? And as long as Shinji carries one, he has pseudo rights to Rider. That makes sense.

Concerning Sakura, I don't think she's out of the woods even with Shinji Matou out of the picture. As long as Zoken's worms are inside her, her psyche is still gonna be heavily influenced.

As it is I can see her fighting the Grail War just so she could wish Shirou was hers and hers only.

 

[GenocideHeart]

Matou changed his tune *very* quickly once Shirou threatened to kill him, Gendou can do much worse. I'd figure Matou will find that he "likes" piloting after a staredown with the end barrel of a gun. Both Shinjis have one thing in common, and that is they're wimps. Matou's just an ass also.

If it was that simple, why didn't Gendo just do that? The gun thing, I mean.

No, he went out of his way to make sure Shinji VOLUNTEERED. First by asking him, then through guilt tripping him.

Remember, he's following a pretty rigid scenario, andf it's heavily implied that any deviation would be catastrophic. We get beat over the head with the fact all of Shinji's actions were as according to the scenario. Even the smallest deviation would throw a monkey wrench in it.

As for Rin, Shirou and Asuka... Shirou is actually physically pretty fit, and I seem to recall rin knowing martial arts. Asuka... is good at academics and great as a pilot, but not once does she show any sort of hand to hand combat skill, and is thin as a wire to boot.

And frankly, if Matou can OVERPOWER AND RAPE a trained military woman like Misato, he'd twist Asuka like a pretzel. Unless you think Asuka is a fucking better fighter than Misato, in which case I really have to smack you - she's military, actually has training and knows her shit, despite looking like she's an useless bum.

 

[evilplushie]

Considering how Shinji reacts in FSN whenever he has to fight on his own or is without a servant, I don't think he'll do very well in the Eva-verse... He talks big when he has something to back him up, but without that, he's pretty much a worthless guy.

 

[GenocideHeart]

Considering how Shinji reacts in FSN whenever he has to fight on his own or is without a servant, I don't think he'll do very well in the Eva-verse... He talks big when he has something to back him up, but without that, he's pretty much a worthless guy.

It's not like Shinji Ikari himself fares much better... in at least three occasions he was saved by his unit going psychonuts to save his ass, and there were at least two instances when his own teammates had to save him (Volcano, and Rei blowing herself up to protect him).

Quite frankly, most of the time he comes out of his messes in one piece through sheer dumb luck. And if possible, he's more spineless than even Matou, because at least Matou HAS an ego. Shinji doesn't even have that.

 

[Prince Charon]

Considering how Shinji reacts in FSN whenever he has to fight on his own or is without a servant, I don't think he'll do very well in the Eva-verse... He talks big when he has something to back him up, but without that, he's pretty much a worthless guy.

It's not like Shinji Ikari himself fares much better... in at least three occasions he was saved by his unit going psychonuts to save his ass, and there were at least two instances when his own teammates had to save him (Volcano, and Rei blowing herself up to protect him).

Hang on, I thought the volcano thing was Shinji going in to save Asuka?

 

[GenocideHeart]

Considering how Shinji reacts in FSN whenever he has to fight on his own or is without a servant, I don't think he'll do very well in the Eva-verse... He talks big when he has something to back him up, but without that, he's pretty much a worthless guy.

It's not like Shinji Ikari himself fares much better... in at least three occasions he was saved by his unit going psychonuts to save his ass, and there were at least two instances when his own teammates had to save him (Volcano, and Rei blowing herself up to protect him).

Hang on, I thought the volcano thing was Shinji going in to save Asuka?

Ugh, I've been reading and watching so many versions of Evangelion I'm confused, since in some the events play out differently.

Regardless, the only Shinji who wouldn't get utterly raped in FSN is the one from Girlfriend of Steel. The others are either too unstable or too spineless to get anything done before someone murders them in a messy fashion.

Hell, I'd argue Shinji is better off in NGE than in FSN. At least people aren't likely to break him in half a million pieces with obscenely overpowered legendary weapons and whatnot. As a rule, I'd take Third Impact over being in any Grail War. Less lethal. This feels more like a punishment for Ikari than one for matou.

 

[evilplushie]

Considering how Shinji reacts in FSN whenever he has to fight on his own or is without a servant, I don't think he'll do very well in the Eva-verse... He talks big when he has something to back him up, but without that, he's pretty much a worthless guy.

It's not like Shinji Ikari himself fares much better... in at least three occasions he was saved by his unit going psychonuts to save his ass, and there were at least two instances when his own teammates had to save him (Volcano, and Rei blowing herself up to protect him).

Quite frankly, most of the time he comes out of his messes in one piece through sheer dumb luck. And if possible, he's more spineless than even Matou, because at least Matou HAS an ego. Shinji doesn't even have that.

They're both equally spineless. But despite that, Ikari Shinji actually does some pretty brave things some times (jumping into the volcano, going back to fight the ?th angel after rei and asuka were defeated, saving Touji and Keisuke, going back to fight the mass production models, wanting to kill his dad after what happened to Touji) unlike Matou Shinji who basically hasn't done anything brave at all.

Although, I'm not sure which has a higher likelihood of dying. In eva, it seems like almost all of humanity will be dead thanks to TI, or reduced to goop, while in FSN, the threat is a lot more immediate but there's a chance of surviving. Provided he teams up with Shirou/Rin.

 

[Avider]

Matou changed his tune *very* quickly once Shirou threatened to kill him, Gendou can do much worse. I'd figure Matou will find that he "likes" piloting after a staredown with the end barrel of a gun. Both Shinjis have one thing in common, and that is they're wimps. Matou's just an ass also.

If it was that simple, why didn't Gendo just do that? The gun thing, I mean.

No, he went out of his way to make sure Shinji VOLUNTEERED. First by asking him, then through guilt tripping him.

Remember, he's following a pretty rigid scenario, andf it's heavily implied that any deviation would be catastrophic. We get beat over the head with the fact all of Shinji's actions were as according to the scenario. Even the smallest deviation would throw a monkey wrench in it.

As for Rin, Shirou and Asuka... Shirou is actually physically pretty fit, and I seem to recall rin knowing martial arts. Asuka... is good at academics and great as a pilot, but not once does she show any sort of hand to hand combat skill, and is thin as a wire to boot.

And frankly, if Matou can OVERPOWER AND RAPE a trained military woman like Misato, he'd twist Asuka like a pretzel. Unless you think Asuka is a fucking better fighter than Misato, in which case I really have to smack you - she's military, actually has training and knows her shit, despite looking like she's an useless bum.

I don't see in any place where I posted that Shinji Matou can overpower Misato, that's a premise that somebody else posted. Meaning, this whole section here:

And frankly, if Matou can OVERPOWER AND RAPE a trained military woman like Misato, he'd twist Asuka like a pretzel.? Unless you think Asuka is a fucking better fighter than Misato, in which case I really have to smack you - she's military, actually has training and knows her shit, despite looking like she's an useless bum.

was invalid and pointless.


Matou has never been shown to display any sort of hand to hand combat skill either, and he's a coward to boot. The conclusion to their showdown wouldn't be as one-sided or definite as your post would led me to believe. Anything more would just be speculations. I'll rather not continue the whole character fight thing...


Frigid scenario or not, you're already changing things by introducing a new Shinji in. That ain't a monkey wrench? Gendou's gonna be wanting to salvage whatever he can, if forced voluntarism doesn't work, and guilt-tripping doesn't work, why wouldn't Gendou resort to threat to ensure that at least something is going according to plan? The gun's just an example, Gendou could just say, "If you don't pilot this thing, that monster there will crush you. You wanna die? No? Pilot it."


As for survival in NGE...

*cough*

It's not like there's 30 stories tall monsters going around trying to destroy the world. Or that everything gets reset to primordial goo unless you happened to make friends with the creepy albino from down the street.

Right...I'll give Matou a higher chance of surviving in FSN than in NGE. At least in FSN, he had a 1:3 chance of surviving, 100% if it was UBW.

 

[GenocideHeart]

It's not like there's 30 stories tall monsters going around trying to destroy the world. Or that everything gets reset to primordial goo unless you happened to make friends with the creepy albino from down the street.

Right...I'll give Matou a higher chance of surviving in FSN than in NGE. At least in FSN, he had a 1:3 chance of surviving, 100% if it was UBW.

I disagree, mostly because the Angels are incredible jobbers and also because there's really nothing preventing Matou (who isn't stupid) from using reverse-logic on Gendou.

"If you don't pilot this thing, that monster there will crush you. You wanna die? No? Pilot it."

"Make it worth my while. Otherwise, I have no reason to, y'know, not wait until it has killed you all and then kill it."

And yes, Matou is enough of a bastard to know when he is of value to someone. In this case, it's as if Gendo told him "You are the only one who can pilot it and isn't chopped liver, so we can't really afford to kill you.". He's going to exploit the hell out of it, because he's just that kind of opportunistic mongrel.

Because, seriously. Whole base of trained military men, and they call a thin, wiry, spineless kid to pilot their giant robot? Matou would have to be a retard to not realize he's basically their only choice at the moment, and he WILL exploit it for all it's worth, because Gendou's threats are pretty damn immaterial.

He can point a gun at him... to make him go out and get beat to a pulp by an alien monster. Wait, what? It's something that can kill him already, so he might as well bluff his way, since he risks winding up dead either way.

Matou is a coward, yes, but he's hardly stupid. He's the type of cunning snake that only true cowards can be. That's bad for Gendo's scenario, really.

 

[Muramasa]

Overall I don't see Ikari having any chance of surviving FSN if he chooses to fight the war. He's too inept on the magical aspect, doesn't have training in martial arts of any sort, has no spine and retaliates more on sheer panic then anything else.

I don't think Rider would like him much, even if he did reveal that he wasn't Matou. At the very least it would be a barrier that would take some time for shinji to get through.

That said Rider would not be able to handle every threat that comes Shinji's way. She would try, atleast as long as that command seal is still in effect but Ikari is gonna need a way to further defend himself.

Though I won't say It's completely impossible to cross, EVA and FSN is gonna take a lot of planning.


For the sake of pure crack though lets switch someone completely different.

How about Shinji Matou and Genma Saotome?

 

[Avider]

It's not like there's 30 stories tall monsters going around trying to destroy the world. Or that everything gets reset to primordial goo unless you happened to make friends with the creepy albino from down the street.

Right...I'll give Matou a higher chance of surviving in FSN than in NGE. At least in FSN, he had a 1:3 chance of surviving, 100% if it was UBW.

I disagree, mostly because the Angels are incredible jobbers and also because there's really nothing preventing Matou (who isn't stupid) from using reverse-logic on Gendou.

"If you don't pilot this thing, that monster there will crush you. You wanna die? No? Pilot it."

"Make it worth my while. Otherwise, I have no reason to, y'know, not wait until it has killed you all and then kill it."

And yes, Matou is enough of a bastard to know when he is of value to someone. In this case, it's as if Gendo told him "You are the only one who can pilot it and isn't chopped liver, so we can't really afford to kill you.". He's going to exploit the hell out of it, because he's just that kind of opportunistic mongrel.

Because, seriously. Whole base of trained military men, and they call a thin, wiry, spineless kid to pilot their giant robot? Matou would have to be a retard to not realize he's basically their only choice at the moment, and he WILL exploit it for all it's worth, because Gendou's threats are pretty damn immaterial.

He can point a gun at him... to make him go out and get beat to a pulp by an alien monster. Wait, what? It's something that can kill him already, so he might as well bluff his way, since he risks winding up dead either way.

Matou is a coward, yes, but he's hardly stupid. He's the type of cunning snake that only true cowards can be. That's bad for Gendo's scenario, really.

You have a different view of Matou than I do, our discussion won't get anywhere due to that.

In anycase, just to continue the dialogue,

"If you don't pilot this thing, that monster there will crush you. You wanna die? No? Pilot it."

"Make it worth my while. Otherwise, I have no reason to, y'know, not wait until it has killed you all and then kill it."

"...Then we have no use for you. Kill him."

"Wait! Wait! Ah, I was just kidding, see, here, I'll do it! It's ok now, see?"

I find this version of Matou more true to the one that was in FSN, considering this was similar to his reaction when Shirou threatened to kill him unless he took off the Bloodfort, instant compliance as well as groveling for his life.

 

[SMWhat]

Why don't you switch 'em at an earlier point in time? Let them settle into their new roles, with their different personalities.