The White Devil of the Moon Prologue
- Thread starter bissek
- Start date
Important points to keep in mind.
Things I like thus far:
- The story's premise thus far is calling on the tradition of Super Robot Wars, or in this case Super Magical Girl Wars.
- BSSM is the Super Robot Magical Girl series.
- MLGN is the Real Robot Magical Girl Series.
- Balancing Super vs Real is going to be one of the real litmus tests, as both series operate under different forms of logic. Heavily favouring one over the other needs to be avoided
Things I like thus far:
- Injured Nanoha, this is going to provide lots of conflict & conversation. I can just see an aghast Minako actually helping Fate tie Nanoha down, especially as the Senshi are supposed to be Nanoha's bodyguards. It's the Senshi's job to fight, and Nanoha's to rule/eventually take out the big bad.
- Fate getting to mother hen Nanoha.
- Play with the whole Nanoha as an Expy of Amuro Ray; Have Mamoru been rewritten as a character played by Usagi's seiyuu, like oh say Misato. Thus continuing on the SRW tradition.
- Shift the Generals to the manga BSSM power levels, which for Kunzite means being able to freeze all of Tokyo.
Might as well throw in Tuxedo Kamen Rider Mamoru in there. Tuxedo Mask Rider Protect in less moonspeak. Without Usagi for her heart-shaped final attacks that can only really finish off a monster, the other Senshi must either a. have their attack power/competence beefed up or b. have some other form of finishing off the enemy with a super attack or combination move.
MGSM is a Super in the vein of early Mazinger series, with Saturn's 'Destroy the World' and Serenity's 'Plot Crystal for the win' ramping up the scale. Most of MLGN's real-robotishness comes from physical or close-range attacks (which traditional magical girls tend not to do), and once up to Divine Buster and above levels of attack it's reaching for Gunbusterness.
In the SRW, there are basically two ways of avoiding damage - tanking it or evading it. In dealing damage, raw power but low accuracy or hoping for a critical hit. Rather than being useless, as like a fanfic I read about Luna finding Mamoru first, being forced to take the role of 'team leader' he could be taking the role of Cybuster or Mospeada PAs.
... man, this simile kinda run away from me. >_> Cut In!
There's such a difference in power levels and approaches that it's like Nanoha being used to beat upon and ridicule its predecessor, without whose tropes and conventions it would not even exist.
MGSM is a Super in the vein of early Mazinger series, with Saturn's 'Destroy the World' and Serenity's 'Plot Crystal for the win' ramping up the scale. Most of MLGN's real-robotishness comes from physical or close-range attacks (which traditional magical girls tend not to do), and once up to Divine Buster and above levels of attack it's reaching for Gunbusterness.
In the SRW, there are basically two ways of avoiding damage - tanking it or evading it. In dealing damage, raw power but low accuracy or hoping for a critical hit. Rather than being useless, as like a fanfic I read about Luna finding Mamoru first, being forced to take the role of 'team leader' he could be taking the role of Cybuster or Mospeada PAs.
... man, this simile kinda run away from me. >_> Cut In!
There's such a difference in power levels and approaches that it's like Nanoha being used to beat upon and ridicule its predecessor, without whose tropes and conventions it would not even exist.
By using her Shiny Rock to rewrite reality so that Metallia DOES NOT EXIST. In fact, she rewrote the universe to wind time back by a year so that the first season and the corresponding manga arc never happened.
That is the real power of the Rock, it's the ultimate GOD MODE CHEAT in that it grants Auto-win when you use it. The only limit to this is that the power requirements for temporarily becoming God are obviously immense, and manipulating, let alone tanking that energy, is fatal. Usage gets around this most times by having huge reserves, incredible luck and the Senshi as her buffers, absorbing some of the shock for her. Except that time in the Dark Kingdom (I refuse to call it the Negaverse and fervently hope that the horrendous NA dub never comes to light again) where she basically rewrote reality to let her live through the experience by recreating herself along with her friends in the aftermath of erasing Metallia. In effect, the Senshi, Usagi included, heck the whole world for that matter, are not the originals after Season 1 or it's manga equivalent, they are creations of the Original Usagi, who destroyed the universe and everyone in it and then recreated them all. Usagi and everyone else after that is essentially a dimensional clone. If that doesn't count as the power of God, I don't know what does.
That's also one reason why I think Wiseman aka Death Phantom is the most competent villain in the OTL. He planned for the fight with the Crystal wielding Usagi with his own equivalent crystal, and his plan was only undone because he ended up fighting 2 crystals, something no one could have foreseen.
That is the real power of the Rock, it's the ultimate GOD MODE CHEAT in that it grants Auto-win when you use it. The only limit to this is that the power requirements for temporarily becoming God are obviously immense, and manipulating, let alone tanking that energy, is fatal. Usage gets around this most times by having huge reserves, incredible luck and the Senshi as her buffers, absorbing some of the shock for her. Except that time in the Dark Kingdom (I refuse to call it the Negaverse and fervently hope that the horrendous NA dub never comes to light again) where she basically rewrote reality to let her live through the experience by recreating herself along with her friends in the aftermath of erasing Metallia. In effect, the Senshi, Usagi included, heck the whole world for that matter, are not the originals after Season 1 or it's manga equivalent, they are creations of the Original Usagi, who destroyed the universe and everyone in it and then recreated them all. Usagi and everyone else after that is essentially a dimensional clone. If that doesn't count as the power of God, I don't know what does.
That's also one reason why I think Wiseman aka Death Phantom is the most competent villain in the OTL. He planned for the fight with the Crystal wielding Usagi with his own equivalent crystal, and his plan was only undone because he ended up fighting 2 crystals, something no one could have foreseen.
Seriously, what IS dimensional energy? Time? Space? Thats not quite energy.
So looking at http://nanoha.wikia.com/wiki/Arc-en-ciel (admittedly not quite the best source but oh well) it does not say exactly how it distorts Time-Space. Or what exactly hapepns when time-space is distorted.
So I guess it depends on how the author interprets this. If it does this by using some sort of energy? (whether its called dimensional energy or what not by the author) then your point is valid.
If however, it destroys the target by other means such as causing a rip in existence such that anything at ground zero is negated then it would work. (Some rubbish theory i threw together in a few moments ;p)
So looking at http://nanoha.wikia.com/wiki/Arc-en-ciel (admittedly not quite the best source but oh well) it does not say exactly how it distorts Time-Space. Or what exactly hapepns when time-space is distorted.
So I guess it depends on how the author interprets this. If it does this by using some sort of energy? (whether its called dimensional energy or what not by the author) then your point is valid.
If however, it destroys the target by other means such as causing a rip in existence such that anything at ground zero is negated then it would work. (Some rubbish theory i threw together in a few moments ;p)
Depends on whether or not you use the anime or manga versions (I haven't really paid that much attention to the anime so I can't really say too much about it). The Sailor Moon manga to use a robot analogy is basically the Gurren Lagann of magic girls. At the start of the series the only things that Usagi can do is throw her tiara at her enemies and the physical capabilities to launch herself into orbit. By the end of the first season, she's with Mamoru help capable of resurrecting the entire planet.
By the Second arc her power has jumped again to the point where she can suddenly Death Star a world. And at the end of the entire series she's powerful enough to block the combined attacks of all her Senshi after Galaxia resurrected as her slaves, go on to fight Galaxia, and resurrect the galaxy.
By the Second arc her power has jumped again to the point where she can suddenly Death Star a world. And at the end of the entire series she's powerful enough to block the combined attacks of all her Senshi after Galaxia resurrected as her slaves, go on to fight Galaxia, and resurrect the galaxy.
The teleporting Metallia is actually the hardest part for TSAB.
The TSAB have a stockpile of Lost Logia with known effects which include causing a dimensional collapse which have destroyed planets. The primary risk is the dimensional collapse hitting neighbouring dimensions causing a domino effect taking out many other worlds.
But I wouldn't write the TSAB off causing a planet extinction event on a populated planet if push-came-to-shove. However, TSAB as a governing body probably wouldn't survive the political fallout.
The TSAB have a stockpile of Lost Logia with known effects which include causing a dimensional collapse which have destroyed planets. The primary risk is the dimensional collapse hitting neighbouring dimensions causing a domino effect taking out many other worlds.
But I wouldn't write the TSAB off causing a planet extinction event on a populated planet if push-came-to-shove. However, TSAB as a governing body probably wouldn't survive the political fallout.
Given the talk about Usagi and Mamoru resurrecting the entire freaking world at the end of the Manga implies that in the manga everybody was already dead meaning that the TSAB probably could get away with CEF-Nuking Metallia and Earth so long as they did manage to keep it from starting a domino effect. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if they actually had doomsday plans that would tell captains exactly what situations they should do such a thing in and how to go about doing it.
Also, I seem to remember something from first season about imaginary number spaces and then the second season implying that the Arc-en-Ciel effectively shunts its targets into those imaginary number space. The common thought being that because magic doesn't work in those areas that anything shoved there will die.
Also, I seem to remember something from first season about imaginary number spaces and then the second season implying that the Arc-en-Ciel effectively shunts its targets into those imaginary number space. The common thought being that because magic doesn't work in those areas that anything shoved there will die.
Waiting until after Metallia drained the life-force of of all of humanity probably would be too dangerous. Even before she had really stirred forth from her prison, her presence was enough to drive everybody outside of the Senshi into a murderous frenzy.
It may or may not be able to reach the ship but it would be able to effect everyone happens to be on Earth, which could be rather bad.
...Which might also help partly explain just how Metallia did so well back during the Silver Millennium. I doubt that the senshi if they're anything like they're modern day counterparts would be willing to simply kill their own citizens (at least off the bat) when they suddenly started frothing at the mouth, which lead to them being caught between their own people and the Dark Kingdom during it's attack.
It may or may not be able to reach the ship but it would be able to effect everyone happens to be on Earth, which could be rather bad.
...Which might also help partly explain just how Metallia did so well back during the Silver Millennium. I doubt that the senshi if they're anything like they're modern day counterparts would be willing to simply kill their own citizens (at least off the bat) when they suddenly started frothing at the mouth, which lead to them being caught between their own people and the Dark Kingdom during it's attack.
D
Actually this is quite fanon. Every senshi has the confirmed ability to kill. It's just Usagi is the only one with the power to turn people back into monsters without hurting them (which 90% of the time was the case) or kill them if they weren't ever human. She's the safest bet and the only one with this ability. As for the senshi manga and anime confirm senshi can change their supposedly short range attacks into massive city range techniques all the way in the first arc. They just don't usually need to considering they're usually only fighting one monster at a time.
When multiple monsters come to play and they're confirmed to have never been human. They get hit with skyscrapers sized towers of water and sweeping beams of death. Once again Everybody has the ability to kill monsters, Usagi is the only one who can heal and resurrect. So the rest have to limit themselves a lot.
One note that's actually quite canon are senshi changing and creating techniques right in the middle of battle in every verse of Sailor Moon. Because they want to protect everyone so badly they can adapt easily. Their powers run on pure will power.
As a notice for physical strength. The senshi have enough physical strength for a slight jump to launch them into space. As Minami also pointed out in the Naruto section, Sailor Moon crippled by the black crystal, barely standing still had enough physical strength to trash Demande's castle with just a punch.
Trying to Teleport Metallia period is the worst idea in the world. At the moment she is really sealed in by the Silver crystal. The attempt would probably give her enough energy to free her pretty early.
She freed herself in the manga by through massive amounts of energy (Everybody who was watching a tv show had their lifeforce stolen by Metallia. Sailor Moon had to use her own energy to revive them,) and got fucking huge swallowing the crystal, Sailor Moon and Tuxedo mask. The anime had crippled her by just using Beryl's last bit of lifeforce to take over her body.
Metallia's weakness of her forehead was unknown by everybody besides Kunzite, and was way too small to attack at the beginning.
Metallia is a creature born from the root of all evil. Her existence is to create as much destruction as possible. Trying to off one planet to get rid of her would probably just make her stronger and probably convince Chaos to reassimilate her when she got big enough which is generally a bad end.
Speaking of which, the TSAB should be really concerned with the Shadow Galactica, enslaving people and destroying planets. Earth shouldn't be on their radar in comparison to her. Canonically that while Usagi was the strongest person in the galaxy with her infinite power of rebirth and her Holy attacks. Galaxia was born with the most destructive crystal.
That's fanon in both cases. Manga Metallia was defeated by Usagi, Mamoru and Luna all combining their power and hitting her weak point with the power of the Ginzuishou, the moon and earth.
Anime, Usagi didn't rewrite reality either. She just revived everyone and sealed their memories with her dying wish.
When multiple monsters come to play and they're confirmed to have never been human. They get hit with skyscrapers sized towers of water and sweeping beams of death. Once again Everybody has the ability to kill monsters, Usagi is the only one who can heal and resurrect. So the rest have to limit themselves a lot.
One note that's actually quite canon are senshi changing and creating techniques right in the middle of battle in every verse of Sailor Moon. Because they want to protect everyone so badly they can adapt easily. Their powers run on pure will power.
As a notice for physical strength. The senshi have enough physical strength for a slight jump to launch them into space. As Minami also pointed out in the Naruto section, Sailor Moon crippled by the black crystal, barely standing still had enough physical strength to trash Demande's castle with just a punch.
Trying to Teleport Metallia period is the worst idea in the world. At the moment she is really sealed in by the Silver crystal. The attempt would probably give her enough energy to free her pretty early.
She freed herself in the manga by through massive amounts of energy (Everybody who was watching a tv show had their lifeforce stolen by Metallia. Sailor Moon had to use her own energy to revive them,) and got fucking huge swallowing the crystal, Sailor Moon and Tuxedo mask. The anime had crippled her by just using Beryl's last bit of lifeforce to take over her body.
Metallia's weakness of her forehead was unknown by everybody besides Kunzite, and was way too small to attack at the beginning.
Metallia is a creature born from the root of all evil. Her existence is to create as much destruction as possible. Trying to off one planet to get rid of her would probably just make her stronger and probably convince Chaos to reassimilate her when she got big enough which is generally a bad end.
Speaking of which, the TSAB should be really concerned with the Shadow Galactica, enslaving people and destroying planets. Earth shouldn't be on their radar in comparison to her. Canonically that while Usagi was the strongest person in the galaxy with her infinite power of rebirth and her Holy attacks. Galaxia was born with the most destructive crystal.
That's fanon in both cases. Manga Metallia was defeated by Usagi, Mamoru and Luna all combining their power and hitting her weak point with the power of the Ginzuishou, the moon and earth.
Anime, Usagi didn't rewrite reality either. She just revived everyone and sealed their memories with her dying wish.
I submit that the best use of this thread is not to speculate on by what chains of reasoning the Nanohaverse can supposedly render everything in the SMverse utterly irrelevant, but instead to brainstorm which interpretations of canon and narrative choices would lead to the most entertaining yet still plausible storyline.
Or, to put it more simply, if there is an interpretation of canon that is 1) not utterly far-fetched and 2) allows Metallia, Galactica, et al, to be a significant enough threat to create valid amounts of dramatic tension even if matched up against the full forces of the TSAB in alliance with the manga-level Inner Senshi, why not just do it that way? It doesn't hurt anything and makes the fic work better, so, shazam.
Or, to put it more simply, if there is an interpretation of canon that is 1) not utterly far-fetched and 2) allows Metallia, Galactica, et al, to be a significant enough threat to create valid amounts of dramatic tension even if matched up against the full forces of the TSAB in alliance with the manga-level Inner Senshi, why not just do it that way? It doesn't hurt anything and makes the fic work better, so, shazam.
I can actually see the see the TSAB being pretty worried about Galaxia given how by the last arc of the manga when she finally arrives the rest of the galaxy is supposed to be dead. Not only are there going to be at least a few of the planets that are a part of TSAB are probably going to exist within the Milky Way galaxy.
But the simple fact that an ENTIRE galaxy is getting wiped clean of life is going to be something that's both noticeable and damn worrisome; even for a group spread across dimensions. It'd the equivalent of somebody steadily wiping all life off of Japan, sure if you live in America or Europe you don't currently have to worry about dying but there's nothing saying that won't change.
But the simple fact that an ENTIRE galaxy is getting wiped clean of life is going to be something that's both noticeable and damn worrisome; even for a group spread across dimensions. It'd the equivalent of somebody steadily wiping all life off of Japan, sure if you live in America or Europe you don't currently have to worry about dying but there's nothing saying that won't change.