To War Against the Heavens

AbyssalDaemon

Well-Known Member
#1
The basic idea is that Link, Zelda, and Gannon have century after century for uncountable millennia been reborn, to play out the parts the goddesses' have set for them. Not always together, as one or two of them might appear but more often then naught all three of them tend to run into each other whenever they happen to be reincarnated. In that time they have witnessed the birth and death of entire races and seen Hyrule steadily change from the land that it once was.

Of the three only Gannon truly remembers anything of their previous lives and even for him time has steadily swept away the memories of old, leaving only the dimmest of recollections of the past. For the other two only the vaguest hint of knowing has remained throughout their reincarnates.

...At least until something goes wrong a few years after one of their rebirths and the three remember everything. From the day that they first touched the Triforce to the present era in a Hyrule that has become nearly unrecognizable for them.

Now they must discover a way to break their strings and free themselves from the goddesses that have used them as their game pieces for uncountable millennium. And perhaps find away to settle the score with their former puppet masters...

- - - - - - - - - - - - -

The idea comes from those oneshots where (usually) Link and Zelda are reborn and musing about the consent cycle between the three of them. Several of them have them somewhat bitter about being forced to continuessly forced to live which made me wonder what would happen if one of them gave the Goddesses the finger and went off to do their own thing which hatched into this.

Here Link, Zelda, and Gannon are all trying to escape in their own way from the goddesses' with no way of knowing whether or not this just another move in the eternal game that the three play amongst themselves... or even another power.

I figured that while the three would work together when nessicarry that each probably would go about it in a different way. After all while the basic premise for what they want is the same for each of them, the way that they go about it and the end results of what they want probably would't be.

And that doesn't go into how all three of them probably carrying a few grudges against each other from their constant rebirths or just how what they remembered has changed them. Gannon for example might have decided that he just wants to live out his life and finally mange to die of old age while Zelda or even Link might have decide that the Goddesses need to be replaced and what do you know there are three people with all the traits need to take their place...

On another note by 'present' day Hyrule I don't mean our present day (those almost always suck) but by their standers. At most I figure given how Twilight Princess seemed (to me anyway) to have the feel of being around the equivalent of our late medieval to somewhat early renaissance period, that it might be similar to Europe during the late 16th century to early 17th Europe. Swords and such are still around but steadily being replaced by black-powder guns and the world while recognizable to Link, Gannon, and Zelda would still be somewhat alien but really it's up to whoever might want this.
 
#2
Not a bad idea, actually... I posted an idea about Ganondorf playing the good guy and throwing a monkey-wrench into their plans a while back, but it could be interesting to see what the three of them could come up with...

The Trinity idea is interesting... Ganny would go for it, ambitious as he is. Link would see the constant wars as bad, and want to stop them. And Zelda... well, she'd probably be the one that came up with the idea in the first place. Ruling a world is just a step up from ruling a country, and with that sort of power she could certainly manage it.
 

AbyssalDaemon

Well-Known Member
#3
Scygnus Darkhawk said:
Not a bad idea, actually... I posted an idea about Ganondorf playing the good guy and throwing a monkey-wrench into their plans a while back, but it could be interesting to see what the three of them could come up with...

The Trinity idea is interesting... Ganny would go for it, ambitious as he is. Link would see the constant wars as bad, and want to stop them. And Zelda... well, she'd probably be the one that came up with the idea in the first place. Ruling a world is just a step up from ruling a country, and with that sort of power she could certainly manage it.
Thanks. I figured that all three of them would be playing to their strengths which could create some rather odd situations for them whenever they happened to run into each other. Link finds a problem and so he goes off to deal with it, Zelda manipulates somebody to do it for her, and Gannon happens to send a few monsters or goes to deal with it himself.

A major part of the story I could see coming form HOW the three managed to come together and actully work as a team without killing one another... or at least consently stepping on the others toes.

Besides I think that Link god of Courage, Zelda goddess of Wisdom, and Ganondorf god of Power has something of a nice ring to it. :snigger:
 
#4
And now... the first perverted idea rears its ugly head. You just had to put Zelda into the middle of that, didn't you?

As far as how they might work together... it'd be very touchy. Ganny would still be pissed at the other two for taking so long to get with the program. Link might see Zelda in a negative light for manipulating him into her plans every time, and at the very least would distrust her, while he'd be very wary of Ganny as his methods have always been less-than-benevolent.

Come to think of it, Zelda is the most likely to try and bring their strengths together. She wouldn't hold anything against Link, and while she would be wary of Ganondorf, I can see her trying to convince him that he needn't rule with an iron fist. The key there, however, is Ganondorf's true motive. He's always been sort of generically evil, perhaps out of greed if nothing else. Perhaps if she showed him exactly how much of a chore ruling actually is, he'd realize that it was not a boon, but a responsibility and change his ways. He'd still be as ruthless as before, but he'd have no motive against the citizens of Hyrule... just the Goddesses. And once he's up there, there's not really anything he can't have, so there's no real reason to fight any longer. It might still be a little rocky if he can't restrain himself from frying anyone who pisses him off, but I think they could keep him from being as vicious as before.
 

toraneko

Well-Known Member
#5
I think Ganondorf already knew what a chore ruling actually is. Remember, he was King of the Gerudo before he was the King of Evil.
 
#6
I don't think he quite understands the troubles of running a fairly democratic country. As both the King of Evil and the King of the Gerudo, he had absolute loyalty from his subjects, barring a few dissenters like Nabooru. If he were to actually take over Hyrule to rule, rather than the seven year massacre, he'd probably be pissed off and deciding this shit wasn't worth it after a day of complaints from his subjects.

But the point is kind of moot, since he probably has realized it by now. Zelda trying to convince him ruling is a responsibility rather than just having possession of a people might give Ganondorf some insight into her motives at the time, and might lead them down the conversational path that leads them to start trust one-another.
 

toraneko

Well-Known Member
#7
I'm still not so sure. It seems a lot unlike Ganondorf to quit his desire to rule at just that, in any case. He's shown many times that he's crafty and intelligent as well as powerful; I think he'd have thought it through beyond just "Conquer Hyrule = Profit".

Whether he has or he hasn't, even if he was convinced it would be more of a responsibility than a blessing, he'd just find a way to rule in a way that suited him.

The idea has merit, it just needs a little ironing out.
 

Darmani

Well-Known Member
#8
Ganon never really strikes me as a knower so much as a doer, and yeah a coward. IT REALLY helps to view him as giant bully. He values power and splendor over courage and wisdom and that's what dooms him most of all. Even using his own tribe or his wouldbe queen as a puppet.

In the terms of reincarnation I would expect Zelda to figure it out and Link to be told and Ganon to know (because he's been alive through that time) or... well

My theory hasbeen, though not always, that Ganon more or less used the Triforce once he had it to wish him immortal, there have been less Ganon's than Links and Zeldas. The goddesses found a loophole (the Master Sword and other things) and set a bar of qualities and checks against the person to take out a corrupt triforce weilder. The legend doesn't always play out the same but at one point Ganon and the Triforce is sealed. But the Triforce HAS to follow ganon's orders. So if he can't physically leave than he tears off his shadow and then sends it to free him. In the meantime either as an act of lust or planning or a warped combination of the two he sets up a self-perpetuating harem, the Gerudo who always give birth to one male and says that male will be his heir and rule in his stead and he'll be raised as blah and so on.

So yes the spirits of the players are reincarnating or the line of the is perpetuating but it is due to the acts of the people.

Having the characters learn that would be a bit more of a mindscrew than a rage against the heavens plot. But mainly its a matter of examining what makes a spirit. A courageous person with good virtue must defeat the corrupt one who would claim the legendary and infamous desert spawned title King of Evil/Darkness. This person can be from the hero's bloodline or have the hero's spirit, or their qualities and thus ends up being like the hero. The royal line of hyrule has a tradition, sometimes mandated, of naming its daughters Zelda and training them to encompass the virtue of wisdom and protect the often failing lore of their kingdom.
Ganon is the one trying to beat the system but can't, he lacks the bravery or the wisdom. Zelda wouldn't really want to being wise to see its purpose and in fact knowing themselves don't see how it could be fought (since essentially its like asking how do I stop being me). Link isn't always the same person. They however share the same spirit and walk in each other's path. The knowledge of this would not dissuade him from walking it. They are filled with courage to act.

So if they learn their whole legacy? They would try to seal the triforce in one place and keep it safe from human hands again. This has the unfortunate side effect of allowing Ganon a shot at getting the full power of it. But only when that is done can they be sure the cycle is broken, for the time when a proper wielder, one of them or someone else, acts.
 
#9
A necro and you're making me want to write something I thought up.

Bastard.
 

Thorn

Well-Known Member
#10
I had an idea very similar to this one a while back, where the gods had wronged all three of them at some point, and kept bringing them back as their pawns.

Then they remember(well, besides Ganon, who has always remembered) and they are PISSED.

*scurries off to see if he can find his notes*
 

Deathwings

Well-Known Member
#11
It is interesting to note that in every games, Ganondorf never wage war for the purpose of taking over Hyrule. It always was a side effect of his true goal, getting the full Triforce and, by extension, his wish.

And since he actually never manage it, we actually do not know what his wish actually is.

Another thing to note, is that the more time pass, the less human he is.
OoT Ganondorf was clearly human and behaving like one.
Likewise, the 2 game that are suppose to take place just after OoT, TP and WW (which are 2 separated timeline), show him as being fairly human but with an even bigger ego.
After that, he seldom appear as anything else than his giant demon form.

You'll need to take that into account and find a reason for him to behave like a human and not a rampaging demon.

Another point, and here I'm using WW and the official manga of OoT as reference, is that Ganondorf actually genuinely seek the well being of his tribe originally. He express clear homesickness in WW and the original reason he invade Hyrule in OoT was a simple territory conflict. Power then got to his head and the Gerudo, who were beginning to distance themselves from him, were then put under a compulsive spell to obey him (their diadems).
 

Darmani

Well-Known Member
#12
Unlimited power of wishes. Until oot the whole triforce granted any wish. I'm inclined to believe, as he corrupted everything he touched ganon wasn't wishing for his mum to come back and everyone to have chocalate flower singalongs
 

Souffle

Well-Known Member
#13
Can the Triforce wish away the goddesses?
 

toraneko

Well-Known Member
#14
Since the Triforce itself is a manifestation of the Goddesses' power, I would argue that to be a 'no'.
 

Meinos Kaen

Well-Known Member
#15
A really nice idea. I have always thought that Link in particular would have been very pissed off at the goddesses. I mean, at the end of almost every episode Link ends up losing a lot if not everything. Link to the Past, he goes travelling into the sea till he ends on Kokolint island. Another quest? Everything disappears in the end. (I don't know why, but I loved the female protagonist of Link's awakening). After that, stranted in the middle of the sea. And who knows what happened.

Ocarina of time. Everything returns to child-like status, and Navi disappears along with all the sages, that include friends of Link (Am I the only one who liked the damn fairy and felt sad for her?). He goes searching for her, saves an alternat reality, then, who knows what happens again.

Twilight's Princess? Disappears to god knows where.

Basically, the only Zelda I've played where he doesn't end up disappearing alone is Wind's Waker.

My idea was more Link remembering of his past lives and this time refusing whatever mission given to him, but a war is much more interesting. :p

(Link: YOU'LL PAY FOR ALL THE TAIL I COULDN'T GET, GODDESSES!)
 

toraneko

Well-Known Member
#16
I'm not sure that's so fully valid, as circumstancial evidence points to the Twilight Princess timeline being one in which OoT Link ended up with Malon. And in TP, though he didn't get a fair shot with Midna, Ilia clearly wanted him.

And, yes, Link's Awakening was a very good game, and Marin was quite a good female main. (And quite a looker, too, from the manual's art.) Sad that it was just a dream.
 

Meinos Kaen

Well-Known Member
#17
toraneko said:
I'm not sure that's so fully valid, as circumstancial evidence points to the Twilight Princess timeline being one in which OoT Link ended up with Malon. And in TP, though he didn't get a fair shot with Midna, Ilia clearly wanted him.

And, yes, Link's Awakening was a very good game, and Marin was quite a good female main. (And quite a looker, too, from the manual's art.) Sad that it was just a dream.
Eh? really? Circumstancial... O_O Hey, please explain! I never noticed that if it's true! MaLink is my favourite pairing! O.O
 

Darmani

Well-Known Member
#18
It's possible that Link wakes up with Marin by his side in some endings.
 

toraneko

Well-Known Member
#19
Meinos Kaen said:
Eh? really? Circumstancial... O_O Hey, please explain! I never noticed that if it's true! MaLink is my favourite pairing! O.O
Well, the more obvious clues are the positioning of Ordon Ranch, Link's features, and Epona.

The Ranch seems to be in the same position as Lon Lon Ranch used to be, relative to Hyrule Castle and the Lost Woods. (The Woods seem to have overgrown in the 100+ intervening years.) Assuming Lon Lon Ranch's success as a business, it could easily become a small town in its own right over the span of a century.

As for the hair... Think about it for a second. The Link in Twilight Princess has a reddish-brown cast to his hair color, while the Link in Ocarina of Time was a gold-blonde. Malon's the only girl of the OoT cast interested in Link who has such a hair color.

Then, there's also Epona, and Epona's Song being passed down in Ordon. What are the odds they'd name a horse the exact same as another, more than a century before, who looked exactly the same? It seems to point to there being a tradition of naming a horse like that. Also, the Song is likely to have been passed down in Malon's family - she mentions in OoT that her mother taught her the song. Ilia knows it. Chances are good that - as is often the case in small agrarian communities - she and Link are at least distant cousins.
 
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