Which is stronger?

sith2886

Well-Known Member
#1
Kolto or Bacta which is a stronger healing fluid?
 

Kibbles

Well-Known Member
#2
sith2886 said:
Kolto or Bacta which is a stronger healing fluid?
Bacta. Kolto is an older, weaker, version that fell out of use with the discovery of Thyferra and the Vratix-produced Bacta (I'm not sure if there's synthetic Bacta and even if there is, it's likely inferior to the genuine stuff).

Kolto retained a niche market as a cheap alternative, mainly used by mining facilities and frontier outposts that simply can't afford the more expensive stuff.

Anyway, there's nothing Kolto can offer that Bacta can't do better and faster.
 

Oni_kawaii

Well-Known Member
#3
Kibbles is indeed correct

<a href='http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Kolto' target='_blank' rel='nofollow'>http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Kolto</a>
 

sith2886

Well-Known Member
#4
New question, What form (if any) was Palpatine using against Windu?
 

Kibbles

Well-Known Member
#5
sith2886 said:
New question, What form (if any) was Palpatine using against Windu?
The closest I could come up with would be Dun Moch, a purely Sith style based on psychological warfare. Insults, taunts, mental attacks, all designed to make the opponent lose his cool and give in to his anger. Especially dangerous against later-era Jedi with their ... rather extreme stances on emotions.

Palpatine had repeatedly demonstrated a preference for Dun Moch (RotJ against Luke is a good example of Dun Moch in action, even though lightsabers don't come out) over more practical and confrontational forms. Words are the weapon of a wielder of Dun Moch, not swords. The battle is waged between ideals, minds and emotions.

Incidentally, Windu is the Jedi best suited to take on that style, given that emotions are a cornerstone of his own personal form. He's able to deal with being angry.
 

Crusader

Well-Known Member
#9
Kibbles said:
sith2886 said:
New question, What form (if any) was Palpatine using against Windu?
The closest I could come up with would be Dun Moch, a purely Sith style based on psychological warfare. Insults, taunts, mental attacks, all designed to make the opponent lose his cool and give in to his anger. Especially dangerous against later-era Jedi with their ... rather extreme stances on emotions.

Palpatine had repeatedly demonstrated a preference for Dun Moch (RotJ against Luke is a good example of Dun Moch in action, even though lightsabers don't come out) over more practical and confrontational forms. Words are the weapon of a wielder of Dun Moch, not swords. The battle is waged between ideals, minds and emotions.

Incidentally, Windu is the Jedi best suited to take on that style, given that emotions are a cornerstone of his own personal form. He's able to deal with being angry.
Why does Dun M?Âch make me think of Insult swordfighting from the Monkey Island games?

Personally I always got the feeling that Palpatine's Dun M?Âch overcame Windu's Vaapad in ROTS and repeated the earlier tragedies of Vaapad in that the form mastered its wielder like it did with Sora Bulq and Depa Billaba when he was forced to fight for his life against a darksider who knew how all of the council members fought due to access to Clone Wars battle footage while they knew practically nothing of how he fought. And if Windu had managed to strike down Palpatine while apparently at his mercy, the Sith would win a moral victory over the Jedi by making Mace Windu commit a dark side act like Anakin did earlier despite the fact that it would have saved the galaxy a lot of grief. Considering that Bulq defected and joined the Dark Acolytes, Sidious and Tyranus did get to know more about it (Vaapad) as well as its weaknesses.
 

Kibbles

Well-Known Member
#10
Crusader said:
Why does Dun M?Âch make me think of Insult swordfighting from the Monkey Island games?
Because that's what it essentially is? A bit more broad, of course ... there's an element of mind rape through telepathy (and illusions) involved, as well as some dubious tactics involving hostages and such, but at it's core it's insult sword fighting.

Personally I always got the feeling that Palpatine's Dun M?Âch overcame Windu's Vaapad in ROTS and repeated the earlier tragedies of Vaapad in that the form mastered its wielder like it did with Sora Bulq and Depa Billaba when he was forced to fight for his life against a darksider who knew how all of the council members fought due to access to Clone Wars battle footage while they knew practically nothing of how he fought. And if Windu had managed to strike down Palpatine while apparently at his mercy, the Sith would win a moral victory over the Jedi by making Mace Windu commit a dark side act like Anakin did earlier despite the fact that it would have saved the galaxy a lot of grief. Considering that Bulq defected and joined the Dark Acolytes, Sidious and Tyranus did get to know more about it (Vaapad) as well as its weaknesses.
Correct to an extent. Windu did more-or-less lost it (I'd really need to get my hands on the novelization to make sure), but IMO Windu was perfectly willing to blast past all rules binding the Jedi to win. If he did strike Palpatine down, ironically, Palpatine would have managed a victory.

And the Jedi would still get wiped out ... since Order 66 (Jedi insurrection against the Republic) would go into effect by default. If anything, it'd be worse. After all, in RotS the Jedi only attempted to kill the Chancellor. If Windu won they'd have killed the Chancellor (an act they wouldn't be able to justify to the public) and then proceed to attempt to disband the Senate and institute martial law. Good luck finding allies, Jedi survivors ...

It's a win-win scenario for the Sith. The Jedi are wiped out and Sith philosophy is proven superior. As for the fact no Sith remain? Well, there are enough holocrons and ruins to teach a new generation, the Sith would be restored in one form or another, even if took a century or two. After all, the core of the Great Schism is a debate on philosophy and the resilience of Sith ideology over the millenia has shown that it has a vastly greater chance of being resurrected than the Jedi one. Especially after they shoot themselves in the foot by trying to coup the Republic they'd sworn to protect.

Palpatine really is a master of the game.
 

foesjoe

Well-Known Member
#11
Kibbles said:
Correct to an extent. Windu did more-or-less lost it (I'd really need to get my hands on the novelization to make sure), but IMO Windu was perfectly willing to blast past all rules binding the Jedi to win. If he did strike Palpatine down, ironically, Palpatine would have managed a victory.
Palpatine was a Sith, and all the Jedi agreed that the Sith needed to be destroyed. There was no blasting "past all rules binding the Jedi". They also had proof that Palpatine was the Sith Lord because he admitted it to Anakin. And I bet they would have found more substantial proof in Palpatine's computers and in his quarters after killing him.

I don't see how destroying Palpatine could be considered a Dark Side act. He was pure evil with no chance at redemption. Killing him was the only solution.

If Windu won they'd have killed the Chancellor (an act they wouldn't be able to justify to the public) and then proceed to attempt to disband the Senate and institute martial law.
I don't remember that ever being the plan of the Jedi. The Jedi stand for democracy.
 

Crusader

Well-Known Member
#12
foesjoe said:
Palpatine was a Sith, and all the Jedi agreed that the Sith needed to be destroyed. There was no blasting "past all rules binding the Jedi". They also had proof that Palpatine was the Sith Lord because he admitted it to Anakin. And I bet they would have found more substantial proof in Palpatine's computers and in his quarters after killing him.

I don't see how destroying Palpatine could be considered a Dark Side act. He was pure evil with no chance at redemption. Killing him was the only solution.
And yet destroying the Sith might lead the Jedi doing the destroying to fall to the Dark Side of the Force and possibly conversion and defection to the Sith.

Strangely enough the Jedi chose not to kill the dark jedi Volfe Karkko but instead incarcerated him in a stasis prison on Kiffex instead of killing him for striking down several Jedi Council members and overdosing on force-sensitive "soup" a thousand years ago. They could always have used a wall of light force technique to sever both Karkko and Sidious from the Force like what happened with Uli Qel-Droma if that hadn't possibly become lost knowledge.

I don't remember that ever being the plan of the Jedi. The Jedi stand for democracy.
They probably wanted to form an interim government until a new government could be elected or chosen and making sure that the Vice Chair wasn't filled with Palpatine's gang of politicians. They probably should have issued Order 65 before Palpatine got the chance to issue Order 66
 

Kibbles

Well-Known Member
#13
foesjoe said:
Palpatine was a Sith, and all the Jedi agreed that the Sith needed to be destroyed. There was no blasting "past all rules binding the Jedi". They also had proof that Palpatine was the Sith Lord because he admitted it to Anakin. And I bet they would have found more substantial proof in Palpatine's computers and in his quarters after killing him.
What proof? Palpatine privately admitting to a Jedi Knight that he was Sith? An allegation that cannot be confirmed or defended. No evidence except the words of one man. No matter how respected that man is, the actions of the Order would make it very hard to defend.

Point me to a court where such a claim would be considered enough to let a murderer go.

As for the rules ... the Jedi are bound by the rules of the Republic. The Republic is their shell, they are a religious order trusted with power because they hadn't abused it in the past. They could be trusted to have carte blanche in all affairs (without even the most minimal supervision by the Senate). Cue the Jedi murdering the Chancellor on the most thin pretext imaginable and declaring a state of emergency. See where that goes.

Win or lose, Windu's actions ensure that only the most rabid of their supporters would stand with them ... everyone else would turn against them. As they, in fact, had in canon.

I don't see how destroying Palpatine could be considered a Dark Side act. He was pure evil with no chance at redemption. Killing him was the only solution.
Oh, it's not a Dark Side act. The purges that would inevitably follow, eliminating Palpatine's influence from the upper echelons of the Republic (a network he'd spent a very long time cultivating), however, would quickly become that. Most of the people involved had no idea of Palpatine's true identity or goals.

If it even got that far. Once the news hits, they'll have to deal with the army. After all, the army is loyal to the Republic, not the Jedi (specifically so it could be turned against the Jedi). The Jedi were trusted to be it's Generals, a trust that's obviously (to the public) gotten to their heads.

I don't remember that ever being the plan of the Jedi. The Jedi stand for democracy.
Oh, maintaining democracy was the plan in the long term. Short-term, however, there was no saying how many Senators had been corrupted by the Sith, how deep the Dark Side's influence went. The Republic needed to be purged of such influence.

Sure, the Jedi might have had good intentions, but that wouldn't make their actions look any better. As far as the public would know ... the Jedi just assassinated the Chancellor claiming that they had every right to do it since he was a Sith.

Evidence? Well, he totally admitted it to Anakin Skywalker, that's evidence enough for immediate murder. Except it isn't really, to the galaxy at large they'd come off as a group trying to pull off a coup and present it as justified. As far as the galactic population knew the Sith had been gone for a thousand years.

They kept their cards too close to their chest. Admitting to the plan after the fact would be viewed with the same distrust as the so-called evidence.

Ultimately, it's a matter of perception. Just as it screwed them over in canon, Windu winning would still screw the Jedi over. They'd have zero public support and no matter how noble their intentions might actually be ... it's easy to lose trust, but very, very hard to regain it.
 

Bill Felix

Well-Known Member
#14
Kibbles said:
Ultimately, it's a matter of perception. Just as it screwed them over in canon, Windu winning would still screw the Jedi over. They'd have zero public support and no matter how noble their intentions might actually be ... it's easy to lose trust, but very, very hard to regain it.
They could just exile Windu from the order under the claim that he went rogue or was a double agent for the Trade Federation or something and completely cover up the situation. Even going so far as to call Palpatine the good guy who 'sacrificed' his life to stop the evil of the Trade Federation (and by extension Sith).

That would be how I would damage control the situation. Seeing as how the Jedi Council was all about the greater good, I wouldn't put it past them to do so.

Hell, Windu would probably agree to be the fall guy if it meant continued peace, stability, and democracy in the Republic.

Also, they could spin it that Anakin Skywalker killed him, since he was the hero with no fear and was apparently endeared to the people, his clout might have even canceled out Palpatine's.
 

Prince Charon

Well-Known Member
#15
Crusader said:
I don't remember that ever being the plan of the Jedi. The Jedi stand for democracy.
They probably wanted to form an interim government until a new government could be elected or chosen and making sure that the Vice Chair wasn't filled with Palpatine's gang of politicians. They probably should have issued Order 65 before Palpatine got the chance to issue Order 66
The thing about Order 65 is, its rather difficult to activate, and the groups that could activate it are most likely to full of Palpatine's cronies. That doesn't mean it can't be done, but either Windu didn't know about it, or he knew that he'd never get it passed.
 

foesjoe

Well-Known Member
#16
Kibbles said:
Oh, maintaining democracy was the plan in the long term. Short-term, however, there was no saying how many Senators had been corrupted by the Sith, how deep the Dark Side's influence went. The Republic needed to be purged of such influence.

Sure, the Jedi might have had good intentions, but that wouldn't make their actions look any better. As far as the public would know ... the Jedi just assassinated the Chancellor claiming that they had every right to do it since he was a Sith.

Evidence? Well, he totally admitted it to Anakin Skywalker, that's evidence enough for immediate murder. Except it isn't really, to the galaxy at large they'd come off as a group trying to pull off a coup and present it as justified. As far as the galactic population knew the Sith had been gone for a thousand years.

They kept their cards too close to their chest. Admitting to the plan after the fact would be viewed with the same distrust as the so-called evidence.

Ultimately, it's a matter of perception. Just as it screwed them over in canon, Windu winning would still screw the Jedi over. They'd have zero public support and no matter how noble their intentions might actually be ... it's easy to lose trust, but very, very hard to regain it.
Palpatine was the Sith Lord pulling the strings behind the war. He was manipulating both sides and he's been in contact with high-ranking officials and generals of the Separatists. I'm pretty sure a tech team would have found evidence of that.

Also, he probably had holocrons and sith texts and other artefacts in his quarters.

I still don't remember the Jedi ever mentioning disbanding the Senate and taking over under martial law in the films.

And I imagine that the public might be more willing to believe the Jedi than you think. They are universally regarded as heroes of justice and keepers of the peace.
 

toraneko

Well-Known Member
#17
Dun Moch is not so much a style unto itself, but rather a goal, supplementary to any form of combat that Sith enter into. It's basically the principle of the Sith in question attempting to dominate the fight psychologically, thus robbing the opposition of their will to fight. Anything that accomplishes this goal is said to help "achieve Dun Moch".

This is consistent with the Sith mindset, that power is everything, and domination is the purpose of power.

The practitioner must make sure to keep the target's mental state in their awareness, or attempting to achieve Dun Moch can backfire.

Examples:
Return of the Jedi, Vader brought up Leia in an attempt to have Luke give in to despair and surrender, but this only resulted in Luke getting angry enough to dominate the fight.

Palpatine, on the other hand, was closer to achieving Dun Moch, as his careful words and insinuations almost succeeded at getting Luke to fall to the Dark Side; note how Luke would have struck an unarmed Palpatine down in cold blood had Vader not interposed his blade.
Later, seeing that Luke would not allow himself to be turned, Palpatine took his sweet time exerting his dominance with Force Lightning, sapping Luke's strength and will.


Back to the original topic, it's strongly implied that Palpatine was thoroughly trained in all seven of the classic lightsaber forms, although he eschewed the dual-wielding sub-forms. He seemed to favor Form IV in his fights against Yoda and Windu, from what I can see.
 

Belgarion213

Well-Known Member
#18
While its been a long time since i saw the third prequel film, but weren't they saying 'we are arresting you' rather than 'we are here to execute you'. They were clearly expecting trouble and a fight, which is what happens when you come to arrest somebody who is a member of a religious order where it is considered holy to manipulate and kill to get your ends across etc, however other than being ready to ignite their light-sabers (or were they already out) I don't think they were threatening to kill him until he attacked.

That being said, I would imagine that they would be banking on being able to get a security image of his confession, though Palpatine probably doctored it or destroyed it long before that.

Not really saying the Jedi are right, but in that particular moment not sure what they are meant to do.
 

foesjoe

Well-Known Member
#19
toraneko said:
Dun Moch is not so much a style unto itself, but rather a goal, supplementary to any form of combat that Sith enter into. It's basically the principle of the Sith in question attempting to dominate the fight psychologically, thus robbing the opposition of their will to fight. Anything that accomplishes this goal is said to help "achieve Dun Moch".

This is consistent with the Sith mindset, that power is everything, and domination is the purpose of power.

The practitioner must make sure to keep the target's mental state in their awareness, or attempting to achieve Dun Moch can backfire.

Examples:
Return of the Jedi, Vader brought up Leia in an attempt to have Luke give in to despair and surrender, but this only resulted in Luke getting angry enough to dominate the fight.

Palpatine, on the other hand, was closer to achieving Dun Moch, as his careful words and insinuations almost succeeded at getting Luke to fall to the Dark Side; note how Luke would have struck an unarmed Palpatine down in cold blood had Vader not interposed his blade.
Later, seeing that Luke would not allow himself to be turned, Palpatine took his sweet time exerting his dominance with Force Lightning, sapping Luke's strength and will.


Back to the original topic, it's strongly implied that Palpatine was thoroughly trained in all seven of the classic lightsaber forms, although he eschewed the dual-wielding sub-forms. He seemed to favor Form IV in his fights against Yoda and Windu, from what I can see.
Hm, I thought D?n Moch wasn't really a Sith discipline, more of a neutral Force thing. You try to influence your opponent by talking.

Luke tried to get to Vader too, only he didn't trash talk him, he tried to bring him back to the light.
 

Bill Felix

Well-Known Member
#20
toraneko said:
Back to the original topic, it's strongly implied that Palpatine was thoroughly trained in all seven of the classic lightsaber forms, although he eschewed the dual-wielding sub-forms. He seemed to favor Form IV in his fights against Yoda and Windu, from what I can see.
Implied where? When they shoehorned him having a lightsaber recklessly into the prequels for all of two minutes?

He didn't even own a lightsaber in the originals. Kinda figured he didn't use them, because he never needed to. Kind of like how Yoda never needed a lightsaber either, but they gave him one because glowing sticks are kewl.
 

Crusader

Well-Known Member
#21
Bill Felix said:
He didn't even own a lightsaber in the originals. Kinda figured he didn't use them, because he never needed to. Kind of like how Yoda never needed a lightsaber either, but they gave him one because glowing sticks are kewl.
"The Sith grew past the use of lightsabers. But we continue to use them, if only to humiliate the Jedi."
Darth Sidious
 

Bill Felix

Well-Known Member
#22
Crusader said:
Bill Felix said:
He didn't even own a lightsaber in the originals. Kinda figured he didn't use them, because he never needed to. Kind of like how Yoda never needed a lightsaber either, but they gave him one because glowing sticks are kewl.
"The Sith grew past the use of lightsabers. But we continue to use them, if only to humiliate the Jedi."
Darth Sidious
Then he obviously wasn't talking about himself, since he didn't have one in the originals.

He had one in the prequels, which was stupid, since he was supposed to be this great puppet-master who no one would be able to discover until it was too late. Nevermind the fact that him having one is bullshit (since there's no way he could have concealed it), one must ask why he would have one?

If Sidious is half of the manipulative master that the universe claims for him to be, why would he risk carrying a weapon he couldn't explain having, with a red blade that signifies him as an enemy to the entire galaxy, that he doesn't even need at all in the first place, due to his godlike powers with the force?

Did the Chancellor of the Republic never go through security checks with Jedi present?

Did he just keep it in his office somewhere, completely confident that no one would ever find it?

Why the hell was it even necessary? It makes the Jedi and the entire galaxy look so stupid that they deserve the Empire.
 

Crusader

Well-Known Member
#23
He had it hidden for years inside a statue of Sistros in his office. He only retrieved it when it was certain that the Jedi were coming to either seize or kill him.

He probably hid his spare in another statue and kept in on him when he was emperor in case one of the surviving upper-tier Jedi like Yoda came after him..
 

Lord Raine

Well-Known Member
#24
foesjoe said:
Kibbles said:
Oh, maintaining democracy was the plan in the long term. Short-term, however, there was no saying how many Senators had been corrupted by the Sith, how deep the Dark Side's influence went. The Republic needed to be purged of such influence.

Sure, the Jedi might have had good intentions, but that wouldn't make their actions look any better. As far as the public would know ... the Jedi just assassinated the Chancellor claiming that they had every right to do it since he was a Sith.

Evidence? Well, he totally admitted it to Anakin Skywalker, that's evidence enough for immediate murder. Except it isn't really, to the galaxy at large they'd come off as a group trying to pull off a coup and present it as justified. As far as the galactic population knew the Sith had been gone for a thousand years.

They kept their cards too close to their chest. Admitting to the plan after the fact would be viewed with the same distrust as the so-called evidence.

Ultimately, it's a matter of perception. Just as it screwed them over in canon, Windu winning would still screw the Jedi over. They'd have zero public support and no matter how noble their intentions might actually be ... it's easy to lose trust, but very, very hard to regain it.
Palpatine was the Sith Lord pulling the strings behind the war. He was manipulating both sides and he's been in contact with high-ranking officials and generals of the Separatists. I'm pretty sure a tech team would have found evidence of that.
In the novels, they did. There was a single thread Palpatine hadn't managed to tie up, which was found out by some information-specialists. They managed to track some signals back to where Palpatine was operating from. Palpatine showed up personally with a retinue of clone commandos loyal to him and killed everyone there. The last thoughts of the clone commando scout leader who discovered the conspiracy before being cut in half with a lightsaber was "holy shit this will never make it back. The galaxy is utterly fucked."

He was right.

There was no blasting "past all rules binding the Jedi".
Except there totally was, because the Old Republic Jedi had very hard line rules on conduct. They actually disallowed certain kinds of attacks, even in life-or-death battles, because they were "too Dark Side-ish." You can chop someone's hands off, no problem, but God help you if you cut someone in half. Presumably, they let Obi-Wan off for Episode I because he wasn't a full Knight and just saw his Master die, but they will canonically fuck you over for that.

Also, he probably had holocrons and sith texts and other artefacts in his quarters.
Right. Because he's smart enough to run that massive galaxy-wide gambit that played both sides, but stupid enough to leave Sith Holocrons in his office drawer.

Oh wait.

I still don't remember the Jedi ever mentioning disbanding the Senate and taking over under martial law in the films.
They didn't, but that's the measure they would have logically been forced to take unless they wanted to take it up the ass and say "yeah, we totally murdered the Senator with Emergency Powers just because." Either they go into a situation they won't come out of intact due to lack of evidence, or they use force against the system to prevent themselves from getting disbanded and/or wiped out.

They were fucked either way. Sidious was that good. The true chessmaster doesn't destroy you. He lets you choose how you destroy yourself.

And I imagine that the public might be more willing to believe the Jedi than you think. They are universally regarded as heroes of justice and keepers of the peace.
The word of one politician turned the entire galaxy against them. They were very well regarded. Not so regarded that Everyone? wasn't willing to believe they would totally attempt to assassinate a major political figure for their own gain, and that Anakin did something that needed to be done by running around murdering all the Younglings.

Koltol vs Bacta
Bacta all the way.

For eons, researchers have pursued the secrets of long life and good health. This has led to an untold number of medical breakthroughs, but few of these have had the far-reaching impact of bacta. An exotic chemical compound, bacta can heal nearly wound. The curative liquid has spawned an entire industry, allowing manufacturers to produce bacta tanks, bacta patches, and many other medical miracles.

The insectoid Vratix, native to the planet Thyferra, created the foundation for modern bacta. Since time immemorial, the Vratix have produced a healing lotion by combining gelatinous read alazhi with chemically created bacterial particles known as kavam. Researchers who discovered the Vratix's curative lotion later added colorless liquid ambori, which acts as a nutrient, disinfectant bath, and preservative. The resulting synthetic chemical, now known as bacta, mimics a body's vital fluids.

Bacta application methods vary depending upon the extent of the patient's wounds. Minor flesh wounds and second-degree burns can be treated using disposable patches coated in thick bacta gel. Patients suffering from multiple wounds, third-degree burns, or cellular damage resulting from things such as frostbite must be submersed in bacta. For these treatments, companies like Zaltin have produced large cylindrical bacta tanks.

Patients treated in bacta tanks are fully immersed in the liquid. A breath mask provides breathable gas, while a number of sensors attached to the subject's skin monitor vital signs. This immersion therapy allows the bacterial particles to saturate wounds and seep into damaged tissue, thus encouraging regeneration in all organic tissues (including nerves, muscles, tendons, and skin) with only minimal scarring. Zaltin's bacta tank also supports several retractable spray hypos designed to inject medicines, stim-shots, adrenaline boosters, and immunity enhancers into the patient or the healing mixture. In most cases, bacta tank patients recover from life-threatening injuries within a week. Patients can also be transported to medical centers in portable "bacta coffins."

Soon after it's creation, bacta production fell under the tight control of two corporations: Zaltin and Xucphra. Both of these companies agreed to control bacta prices, ensuring that the liquid and it's associated devices were always sold for the highest profit. During the Galactic Civil War, the Emperor forged alliances with both Zaltin and Xucphra, and then sent his stormtroopers to violently shut down smaller bacta suppliers, thus depriving the Alliance.

Although bacta was nearly impossible to acquire during the Emperor's reign, the Rebel Alliance did obtain a functional bacta tank and a small supply of the curative liquid for use at Echo Base on Hoth. After being attacked by a wampa and spending a night on the frozen surface of Hoth, Luke Skywalker would have surely died from his injuries if not for Echo Base's bacta tank. After the Battle of Endor, the New Republic initiated the so-called Bacta War in order to liberate the remaining bacta supply and spread it across the galaxy.


tl;dr, Koltol is Magic Healing Sauce, but Bacta is SUPER Magic Healing Sauce. Also, Palpatine is a humongous dick. Especially when you realize that, because Starkiller was behind the Rebels, that means that Palpatine probably gave them that bacta tank.

Then he obviously wasn't talking about himself, since he didn't have one in the originals.
Yeah. Because there are no Jedi left. What's the point of possessing a tool for humiliating Jedi when all the Jedi are dead?
 

toraneko

Well-Known Member
#25
Bill Felix said:
Implied where? When they shoehorned him having a lightsaber recklessly into the prequels for all of two minutes?
Lots of stuff in the Expanded Universe material, such as Dark Empire.

He didn't even own a lightsaber in the originals. Kinda figured he didn't use them, because he never needed to.
Probably true; again, dun moch - it's more intimidating to dominate an enemy with Force power alone than it is to slice them up with a glowy blade of awesome. Also, after his body got all old and rotten, he probably just couldn't use his lightsaber very well; note how, in Ep. VI, his hands were quite shaky, even as he's roasting Luke with evilzaps.

foesjoe said:
Hm, I thought D?n Moch wasn't really a Sith discipline, more of a neutral Force thing. You try to influence your opponent by talking.
Dun Moch is not just talking, actually. Anything you can do to sap your opponent's will to fight and achieve total domination.

Luke tried to get to Vader too, only he didn't trash talk him, he tried to bring him back to the light.
That's considered more or less Luke's own anti-Dun Moch attempt. Notably, he succeeded at the same time as two Dun Moch masters failed.
 
Top