Building a New D&D Setting

Lord Raine

Well-Known Member
#76
In that case, you shouldn't call the power "alternate form" as that has a specific meaning for what it is and can do - specifically, that you take the form of an existing creature(s). I recommend calling what the delfah can do something along the lines of "bear form."
Any ideas on something I could base it on? Like a race that already has a similar power?

I figure I could use some of the stats of a Werebear as a guideline, like the strength of the claw attacks, but it's the specific wording that matters the most, and I'd much rather have something to work off of than make something up from scratch.

Dude, I know guys who'd so totally take your head off for that.
Good for them. I just find Gnomes to be incredibly shallow and two-dimensional, and have noticed that Halflings have also become incredibly stereotypical as well (ALWAYS fast-talking thieves and con-artists. ALWAYS. Does no one remember shit-all from The Hobbit and The Lord of The Rings? WTF).

If there are people trying to make them less so, then more power to them. But until they succeed, I'll continue to question the validity of having both. After all, I'd much rather have a single 3d race than two 2d races.

I think Pathfinder is doing a good job of it so far.

They made Gnomes glow-in-the-dark? :huh:

Well, they definitely get points for originality.

Well, for one thing if he's in bear form, those tattoos are probably going to be hidden by his fur.
They weren't in the other picture, with the woman and the bear. That's part of what gave me the idea, actually.

And I'm sorry, but I have a hard time seeing the guy in the above picture being a bard...bards were never that cool.
Then you've obviously never played one of our campaigns.

Really, making your designated instrument 'voice' is all the difference. It's almost impossible to be hardcore with a lute in your hand. Voice, though, makes it possible to cast spells through chants, marches, and battle hymns. And it frees up both your hands.
 

Vexarian

Well-Known Member
#77
Lord Raine said:
And I'm sorry, but I have a hard time seeing the guy in the above picture being a bard...bards were never that cool.
Then you've obviously never played one of our campaigns.

Really, making your designated instrument 'voice' is all the difference. It's almost impossible to be hardcore with a lute in your hand. Voice, though, makes it possible to cast spells through chants, marches, and battle hymns. And it frees up both your hands.
You could also specialize in specialized Instrument/Weapons.

Like a Songblade, a sword specifically designed and enchanted with magic, to produce beats in response to being used in combat.
 

Lord Raine

Well-Known Member
#78
VexTheWarlord said:
Lord Raine said:
And I'm sorry, but I have a hard time seeing the guy in the above picture being a bard...bards were never that cool.
Then you've obviously never played one of our campaigns.

Really, making your designated instrument 'voice' is all the difference. It's almost impossible to be hardcore with a lute in your hand. Voice, though, makes it possible to cast spells through chants, marches, and battle hymns. And it frees up both your hands.
You could also specialize in specialized Instrument/Weapons.

Like a Songblade, a sword specifically designed and enchanted with magic, to produce beats in response to being used in combat.
I believe there is a specific weapon called a Songblade. It has a face on the crossbar that can sing while the user fights, allowing Bards to cast their powers and fight at the same time.

It's only really useful to Bards, though. It'll still sing when you fight others, but when not in the hands of a Bard, the singing doesn't do anything. So it's basically a pointless ability that serves no purpose besides letting everyone nearby know exactly where you are. But it's a handy tool for a Bard, definately.
 

Alzrius

Well-Known Member
#79
Lord Raine said:
Any ideas on something I could base it on? Like a race that already has a similar power?

I figure I could use some of the stats of a Werebear as a guideline, like the strength of the claw attacks, but it's the specific wording that matters the most, and I'd much rather have something to work off of than make something up from scratch.
Not off the top of my head. Most races with a shape-shifting power have either alternate form or change shape, both are based around the idea of turning into the form of another particular creature and gaining a specific and particular set of its abilities. The best example of a creature that has a power similar to the delfah's is the quasilycanthrope (scroll down to the bottom of the page).

What the delfah can do is different from most shape-shifters, and really I think your power is mostly okay as-is. It just needs a different name and some exposition about a few of the details - the current zeitgeist being to differentiate it from an existing spell.

Lord Raine said:
Good for them. I just find Gnomes to be incredibly shallow and two-dimensional, and have noticed that Halflings have also become incredibly stereotypical as well (ALWAYS fast-talking thieves and con-artists. ALWAYS. Does no one remember shit-all from The Hobbit and The Lord of The Rings? WTF).

If there are people trying to make them less so, then more power to them. But until they succeed, I'll continue to question the validity of having both. After all, I'd much rather have a single 3d race than two 2d races.
This is just a shade of the problem to almost all demihuman races. Gnomes, at least in D&D, lack any sort of cohesive identity. Halflings have a vague identity somewhere between being thieves and lazy little gluttons. Dwarves are irascible, boisterous, and often speak in a Scottish accent. And elves are a regal race that's good at swordplay, archery, and magic while being living in a word where they've been largely supplanted by humans.

Most races exist largely as single-view stereotypes; the gnome is just the worst off, as it's so poorly-developed that it has almost no features to even stereotype it.

Lord Raine said:
They made Gnomes glow-in-the-dark? :huh:

Well, they definitely get points for originality.
And here I was sure a TFFer would approve of a girl with anime-blue hair. ;)

But seriously, the different appearance is the first attempt to reinvigorate and change the gnome's flavor into being something distinctive, instead of just being "the other halflings."

And they can glow in the dark, since they can use dancing lights 1/day. :lol:

Lord Raine said:
They weren't in the other picture, with the woman and the bear. That's part of what gave me the idea, actually.
That's a tattoo? I thought it was some sort of loose mesh holding up the armor on its arm.

Lord Raine said:
Then you've obviously never played one of our campaigns.
Well yeah...you'd know if I had.

...Or would you? :ph43r:

Lord Raine said:
Really, making your designated instrument 'voice' is all the difference. It's almost impossible to be hardcore with a lute in your hand. Voice, though, makes it possible to cast spells through chants, marches, and battle hymns. And it frees up both your hands.
It's not about a "designated instrument," it's about that you need ranks in Perform, choosing which category it applies to - namely, Perform (sing).

And while it does free up your hands, it doesn't make you any more able to cast spells than any other method of using bardic music:

Even while using bardic music that doesnÆt require concentration, a bard cannot cast spells, activate magic items by spell completion (such as scrolls), spell trigger (such as wands), or command word.
 

Vexarian

Well-Known Member
#80
*Blinks* And I was just making stuff up.

But still, I think it could be a potentially badass weapon for some sort of Bard-barian type of character.
 

parker

Well-Known Member
#81
Those tattoos look Scottish/Irish in origin, am I jumping at shadows or does that have some bearing on their culture?
 

Lord Raine

Well-Known Member
#82
Right, try this on for size.


Delfah
  • +2 Strength, +2 Constitution, -2 Charisma: The Delfah are physically strong and tough, but their society places more merit on intelligence and physical prowess than being well-spoken.
  • Movement: A Delfah's base land speed is 30ft. However, Delfah can move at this speed even when wearing medium or heavy armor or when carrying a medium or heavy load (unlike other creatures, whose speed is reduced in such conditions).
  • Medium: As Medium creatures, Delfah have no special bonuses or penalties due to their size. However, see the Powerful Build ability description below for more details.
  • Low-Light Vision: A Delfah can see twice as far as a human in starlight, moonlight, torchlight, and similar conditions of poor illumination. They retain the ability to distinguish color and detail under such conditions.
  • Powerful Build: The physical stature of a Delfah lets them function in many ways as if they were one size category larger. Whenever a Delfah is subject to a size modifier or special size modifier for an opposed check (such as during grapple, bull rush attempts, and trip attempts), the Delfah is treated as one size larger if doing so is advantageous to them. A Delfah is also considered to be one size larger when determining whether a creature's special attacks based on size (such as improved grab or swallow whole) can affect them. A Delfah can use weapons designed for a creature one size larger without penalty. However, it's space and reach remain those of a creature of their actual size. The benefits of this racial trait stack with the effects of powers, abilities, and spells that change the subject's size category.
  • Bearform: Delfah possess the ability to transform into the form of a humanoid bear. Doing so takes a full-round action, and results in the following:
    * A Delfah gains the following racial modifications to their stats. These modifications stack with any preexisting racial modifications. +4 Strength, -2 Dexterity
    * A Delfah gains claw attacks suitable for a Large animal.
    * Due to the expansion and change in body-shape, nonmagical armor worn by a Delfah during their transformation must make a DC 10 Fortitude save. If successful, the armor comes undone and falls to the ground. If unsuccessful, the armor breaks, and must be repaired with an appropriate Craft check before it can be used again.
    * The Delfah's Bearform is capable of both quadrupedal and bipedal locomotion, and possesses four fingers on each hand and opposable thumbs. Traveling on all fours is considered Running, and carries the appropriate benefits and penalties. A Delfah in Bearform retains their ability to pick up and manipulate objects, and can make use of any devices or weapons they could in humanoid form. A Bearform Delfah can speak any languages it could in it's prior form.
  • +1 Concentration, -1 Spot, -1 Listen: The Delfah as a species possess a somewhat one-track mind, which helps improve their concentration, though at the cost of making them slightly oblivious.
  • +2 Craft (Any 1): The Delfah are skillful workers and machinists, and precious few lack training in some crafting or art. At first level, the PC must designate a Craft skill (such as Craft (Alchemy) or Craft (Armor)). This bonus applies to that Craft skill, and only that skill, and cannot be changed at a later date.
  • Automatic Languages: Common and Dwarven. Bonus Languages: Elven, Giant, Gnomish, Goblin, Ork. Delfah take care to learn the languages of trade and craftsmanship, along with the languages most frequently used in the northern lands.
  • Favored Classes: Rouge, Paladin. Mechanically-minded, skilled with their hands, and possessing a deep cultural appreciation for the concepts of honor and valor, both on the battlefield and off, the Delfah naturally fit into the roles of both skilled mechanics and handymen, and honorable, just warriors. A multiclass Delfah's Rouge and Paladin class does not count when determining whether they take an experience point penalty.
  • Level Adjustment: +2
Do let me know if this is worth the +2 or not. I get the vague feeling that it's a tad underpowered for a +2 race, so I might knock it down to a +1. Or I might chop up the traits of Cold Adapted and hand them out individually (same boosts, but not the same name. SUCK IT, CLOSED CONTENT : D)


I'd like to point out, just for the record, that these are the following racial Favored Classes:

Elves = Wizard Ranger
Dwarves = Fighter Sorcerer
Humans = Any
Little Folk (i.e. Halflings)* = Bard Rouge

These are the four core races, in that they are the most common, non-hybrid species, and the ones most directly intended for PC use. No primary race will ever possess a level adjustment higher than +0.

These are the 'secondary' races, which are slightly less common than the four core races. Some secondary races possess a level adjustment of some sort, though others do not. Intended primarily to be used by more experienced players, or for players interested in a flavor and style not found in the four primary races, secondary races tend to possess unique or unusual skills, odd powers, or special abilities that are outside the norm. No secondary race will ever possess a level adjustment higher than +2.

Delfah = Rouge Paladin (+2)
Beringi = Barbarian Monk (+2)
Sylvani (Half-Elves) = Any (+0)
Aasimar = Paladin Sorcerer (+0)
Tiefling = Rouge Sorcerer (+0)
Half-Orks = Barbarian Fighter (+0)


* Halflings in this setting are, mechanically speaking, a combination of Gnomes and Halflings. Just thought I'd point that out, as it might lead to some confusion. I'll probably post a concept of their race and stats next, as that's really one of the bigger projects I'm doing.

As an aside, combining two races into one is, in terms of stats, a pain in the ass. I can already tell there's no way I can do it straight, as they would just have too much stuff. Too much for a primary race, anyway, as they'd need at least a +1 level adjustment, probably a +2.

But seriously, the different appearance is the first attempt to reinvigorate and change the gnome's flavor into being something distinctive, instead of just being "the other halflings."
Good for them, and I'm glad to hear it. It's nice to see someone is finally taking the time to flesh them out into a race worth playing, as opposed to the bland, characterless filler they've been up until now.

Those tattoos look Scottish/Irish in origin, am I jumping at shadows or does that have some bearing on their culture?
It does. Culturally, they're a mix of vikings and celts, with some mechanist, craftsmen, and roving merchants thrown in for good measure.
 

Lord Raine

Well-Known Member
#83
Bumping for relevancy, as I suspect it may have gotten bogged down.
 

trevelyan1983

Well-Known Member
#84
What is this? Werebear bronze-age bard viking druid architect race? With celtic knot tattoos?

I can't even articulate how incredibly frigging awesome that is!
 

Lord Raine

Well-Known Member
#85
trevelyan1983 said:
What is this? Werebear bronze-age bard viking druid architect race? With celtic knot tattoos?
In essence, yes. And depending on the balance, they may also be able to stand in the middle of a blizzard in a loincloth and ask their companions why they're shivering so much.

I can't even articulate how incredibly frigging awesome that is!
Thank you. That means a lot, coming from you.


Also, I was looking at the Werebear's hybrid-form stats (which is what the Delfah's Bearform is loosely based off of), and I noticed that the Werebear's subtype is Shapeshifter. I had actually forgotten all about that. Should the Delfah be classified as a Shapeshifters as well? Because I'm pretty sure they should be.

Thoughts?
 

trevelyan1983

Well-Known Member
#86
Lord Raine said:
In essence, yes. And depending on the balance, they may also be able to stand in the middle of a blizzard in a loincloth and ask their companions why they're shivering so much.
Bad. Ass.

I can't even articulate how incredibly frigging awesome that is!
Thank you. That means a lot, coming from you.


Also, I was looking at the Werebear's hybrid-form stats (which is what the Delfah's Bearform is loosely based off of), and I noticed that the Werebear's subtype is Shapeshifter. I had actually forgotten all about that. Should the Delfah be classified as a Shapeshifters as well? Because I'm pretty sure they should be.

Thoughts?
Oh, come off it. I don't disagree that harshly - or that often - with your worldbuilding. :p

Anyway, to answer your question - in the literal sense, yes, they are definitely shapeshifters. In the context of D&D rules, though, they could probably fit under a number of titles, depending on the rules and the specifics. I know just enough about D&D to know that I don't know enough to answer that question properly.
 

Garahs

Well-Known Member
#87
Yes, they're shapeshifters. I can't remember the name of the book, but in the one where it breaks down monster races into character classes is a short chapter on combining monster templates and how creature types and subtypes line up. (Outsider trumps Undead, etc.)
 

Alzrius

Well-Known Member
#88
Looking the new delfah stats over, I think your thoughts that it's a tad underpowered for a +2 level adjustment are correct. I do think that it could be boosted up a little more to really be worth that level adjustment.

Beyond that, I have a few minor critiques. You should indicate outright what their claw damage will be (probably 1d6), rather than just noting what it'd be in line with.

Also, the bit about their nonmagical armor needing a save for when they change forms seems unnecessary - they aren't changing size, and their basic body shape remains roughly humanoid, so that seems like an unnecessary complication, and one that slows down play. Further, the Bearform power should probably be tagged as (Su).

Finally, the note that traveling on all fours constitutes running is confusing, and seems to generate more problems than it solves. Can they run while just on two legs? Can they travel on all fours without having it be a run action? And such. I'd recommend cutting that line.

As a minor nitpick, the skill bonuses should be noted as being racial skill bonuses, but that's technical in the extreme.

Lord Raine said:
* Halflings in this setting are, mechanically speaking, a combination of Gnomes and Halflings. Just thought I'd point that out, as it might lead to some confusion. I'll probably post a concept of their race and stats next, as that's really one of the bigger projects I'm doing.

As an aside, combining two races into one is, in terms of stats, a pain in the ass. I can already tell there's no way I can do it straight, as they would just have too much stuff. Too much for a primary race, anyway, as they'd need at least a +1 level adjustment, probably a +2.
There are a few books out there that have stats for half-breeds between the existing core races. The kabouter is one from The Completist's Guide to Humanoid Characters by Fifth Element Games and legally reposted over on The Grand OGL Wiki. Just lift those, if they suit you.

Lord Raine said:
Also, I was looking at the Werebear's hybrid-form stats (which is what the Delfah's Bearform is loosely based off of), and I noticed that the Werebear's subtype is Shapeshifter. I had actually forgotten all about that. Should the Delfah be classified as a Shapeshifters as well? Because I'm pretty sure they should be.

Thoughts?
Technically, they would fall under that subtype, so I don't see why not. The only major mechanical impact that subtype grants is that it lets you shake off the effects of a baleful polymorph spell in 1 round.
 

Lord Raine

Well-Known Member
#89
trevelyan1983 said:
Lord Raine said:
In essence, yes. And depending on the balance, they may also be able to stand in the middle of a blizzard in a loincloth and ask their companions why they're shivering so much.
Bad. Ass.
It gets better (at least in my opinion).

You see, in D&D, all weapons, objects, and creatures have a size. From smallest to largest, these sizes are Fine, Diminutive, Tiny, Small, Medium, Large, Huge, Gargantuan, and Colossal.

The default size for an adventurer is Medium (i.e. human sized), and the majority of weapons tend to be automatically fitted for you, which means they're Medium as well. The thing is, though, this isn't always the case. After all, if you kill a Giant that happens to be Huge, all of their possessions are likely to be Huge as well. Huge armor, Huge weapons, a Huge fint and tender, ect. (This is also, BTW, why the Dungeon Master's Guide states that it's a good idea to assume that anything magical automatically resizes to fit the wearer/user. That way, not all the loot you get off a Storm Giant is useless. The important/valuable things (i.e. the magical things) automatically resize once you touch them.)

So, take a look back at Powerful Build. Having it means that you are treated as being one size category larger than you actually are for any purpose that is beneficial to you (like resisting grapple, bull rush, and trip attempts, or avoiding being eaten by something like a Tyrannosaurus).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dinosaur_(Dungeons_&_Dragons)' target='_blank'>Yes, this is an actual picture of a T-Rex in D&D.</a> Mine is a more primal world, so expect them to be as common as any mundane animal species.)
([url=http://i731.photobucket.com/albums/ww319/Lord_Rain/Scans/4b71746c.jpg[/img]

This includes wielding weapons.

To give you an idea of what I'm getting at, take a look at some pictures of a canonical D&D race (Goliaths, Medium size) that happens to have Powerful Build, along with a human that has the ability to use Large Weapons without penalty due to being a Scion of Strength:

[img]http://i731.photobucket.com/albums/ww319/Lord_Rain/Scans/bf1e9d04.jpg










So yeah. We aren't just talking a werebear bronze-age bard viking druid architect race with celtic knot tattoos and extreme cold tolerance. We're talking a werebear bronze-age bard viking druid architect race with celtic knot tattoos and extreme cold tolerance that use really big weapons.

Oh, come off it.? I don't disagree that harshly - or that often - with your worldbuilding.? :p
Well, yeah, but you're still a pretty discriminating person, so I know that when you praise something, you really mean it. It's not just shallow OMG THS IZ AWESOMES.

Anyway, to answer your question - in the literal sense, yes, they are definitely shapeshifters.? In the context of D&D rules, though, they could probably fit under a number of titles, depending on the rules and the specifics.? I know just enough about D&D to know that I don't know enough to answer that question properly.
Well, it does kind of matter, because Shapeshifter is a specific subtype that is given to beings that possess the innate ability to change their shape.

Beyond that, I have a few minor critiques. You should indicate outright what their claw damage will be (probably 1d6), rather than just noting what it'd be in line with.
Fair enough.

Also, the bit about their nonmagical armor needing a save for when they change forms seems unnecessary - they aren't changing size, and their basic body shape remains roughly humanoid, so that seems like an unnecessary complication, and one that slows down play.
Well, in theory, they are changing size. It's just not enough of a size change to make them go up a category.

I was actually thinking about making it so the Powerful Build only comes into effect while Delfah are in Bearform, but I thought that it would be too annoying for them to have to lug around weapons too big for them to use until a fight starts.

Further, the Bearform power should probably be tagged as (Su).
There's actually a reason I didn't. In a sentence, an Antimagic field shuts down all spell, spell-like, and supernatural abilities, and I don't want their transformations to be dispellable by Antimagic. If the Delfah's Bearform was (Su) or (Sp), then they would immediately revert back to human form the instant they cross into an Antimagic area.

I also wanted to underline the fact that what the Delfah are doing is not normal shapeshifting, so that's also a part of it.

If you think that's too strong, though, I'll make it a (Su) ability.

Finally, the note that traveling on all fours constitutes running is confusing, and seems to generate more problems than it solves. Can they run while just on two legs? Can they travel on all fours without having it be a run action? And such. I'd recommend cutting that line.
Mm, fair enough. Looking back, it was a weird thing to put in anyway.

There are a few books out there that have stats for half-breeds between the existing core races. Just lift those, if they suit you.
Yeah, but do any of them have a stable, if faint, Fey bloodline running through their race?

I'm taking a leaf out of Tolkien's book in this one. Remember why the Hobbits of the Took lineage sometimes displayed a "terribly un-Hobbit-like" perchance for adventure? Because one of the original Tooks allegedly took a Fairy wife.

I thought that was a very interesting little tidbit of information, one that Tolkien canon never really went anywhere with (at least not that I'm aware of). So when I decided to try and combine the Hobbits and Gnomes into a single race of "little folk," I resolved to work Tolkien's concept of the Tookish bloodline into the race as a whole.

So in this setting, the Hobbits (because I can't really think of a better name for them, tbh) all have a faint, but consistent, fey bloodline. This accounts both for their dualistic nature*, and the fact that they have a small array of supernatural and spell-like abilities.


* This is a major selling point for the race. As I'm sure you know, one of the major turn-offs for D&D Halflings and Gnomes is the flavor for the race. D&D Halflings have become immensely sterotyped as fast-talking theives and hucksters, and D&D Gnomes have next to no coherent racial identity, though not for a lack of everyone and their mother trying to give them one.

So, when I decided to do this racial fusion, I thought long and hard about what I wanted the race to have that would make them stand out. This is what I came up with.

The race's core is it's dualistic nature. Everything from their attitudes, their personalities, and their lifestyles, even to their gods, is dualistic in nature. Exactly why this is is unknown, but the most common theory is that the fey blood in their veins has something to do with it.

One the one hand, they enjoy comfort, and frequently settle down in their own little towns, hamlets, and communities, which sometimes boarder settlements of other races. On the other hand, many (let's call them Halflings for now) Halflings experience occasional bouts of wanderlust, which compels them to wander and adventure, sometimes for years, before it wears off seemingly overnight, and they desire to return to their homes.

On the one hand, they feel comforted and at home underground, but on the other, they long to see the sky and the trees, and relish natural sunlight far more than artificial candle or torchlight. Thus, they typically build their homes halfway buried into hills and cliffs, allowing them to be underground and yet still possess windows, balconies, platforms, and doors that exit directly outside, and let fresh air and sunlight come in unhindered. Some have even been known to erect artificial mounds if the land is too flat for their taste.

This also extends to their nature and personality, which seems to drift back and forth between quietly comfortable, laid-back, and non-confrontational, the ideal homebody, to bold, daring, or even reckless, the attitude of a bold warrior, a charismatic speaker, or a clever rogue.

Even their gods exhibit this. Yondalla, their chief goddess, is well known amongst certain circles to possess a dual nature, seemingly being two gods in one. Openly, she is an idealized version of a homemaker and wife (Neutral Good), and yet she possesses a darker, more ruthless side more akin to a rogue and assassin than a mere housewife, which cares only for protecting her people and securing their well-being, no matter what that might entail (Chaotic Neutral).

Their chief god and the on-again-off-again paramour of Yondalla, Garl Glittergold, is little different. Though he himself is singular in nature, being a deity of light, song, and merriment, his archnemeisis Gelf Darkhearth is literally the evil version of himself, being a dark, twisted reflection of everything that Garl Glittergold stands for, a deity of revenge and entropy. Where Garl is witty and mirthful, Gelf is blunt and humorless. Where Garl laughs, Gelf snarls. Where

Indeed, when they first met in ages past, Garl was taken aback, for Gelf appeared to be exactly as Garl, and yet was made of shadows, with glowing red eyes, and played only notes of jarring discord on a beaten and broken lute. They did not even need to speak. They merely looked at each other for a long while, before Garl, normally a paragon of delight and humor, declared that they could never reconcile with each other, and would be doomed to fight unto death.

Even the two gods together, Yondalla and Garl, represent a dualist nature of duality, as Yondalla has reconciled with her conflicting half, while Garl has rejected his to the point of literal division, and is in bitter conflict with Gelf to this day. Individually, they are each dualistic in nature, and taken together, they represent the dual paths their children (and indeed all who possess a dual nature) might walk. A Halfling might choose to embrace their fey blood and the power that comes with it, or they might choose to fight it, and remain conflicted.

It is a deeply personal choice, and it resonates with every aspect of the Halflings as a race. It reflects in their art, their technology, their inclinations and drives, their occupations, and even in their religion. Theirs is a race of tinkerers and dreamers, bards and alchemists, philosophers and wanderers, warriors and homemakers.

They are a playful dichotomy, an oddball enigma. To an outsider who does not understand them, they may seem at times infuriatingly passive and laid-back, while at others almost disturbingly bold, determined, and manic in their passions.


They are what they are. Though as a priest of Yondalla might say with a faint smile, not all that is necessarily meets the eye.

Technically, they would fall under that subtype, so I don't see why not.
I figured as much. Seeing how they can change their shape, they ought to be given the Shapeshifter subtype.

Also, just out of curiosity, where did you get this information?
The only major mechanical impact that subtype grants is that it lets you shake off the effects of a baleful polymorph spell in 1 round.
I've looked in the Monster Manual and the Dungeon Master's Guide, and I can't seem to find a comprehensive list of what benefits and drawbacks specific Types and Subtypes impart.
 

Alzrius

Well-Known Member
#90
Lord Raine said:
Well, it does kind of matter, because Shapeshifter is a specific subtype that is given to beings that possess the innate ability to change their shape.
Actually, it's Shapechanger, not Shapeshifter. :p

Lord Raine said:
Well, in theory, they are changing size. It's just not enough of a size change to make them go up a category.
I know. I'm just saying that I don't think you really need the additional rule that you're implementing - I don't see it as having any positive value except trying to insert a slight dash of greater realism. While that's certainly laudable, it should be balanced by how much it fits in with the existing framework of the rules, and how much it adds to the overall enjoyment of the game, and I don't see it adding anything to either of those.

It's interesting to note that this idea basically harkens back to the old "simulationist vs. gamist" approach to games.

Lord Raine said:
There's actually a reason I didn't. In a sentence, an Antimagic field shuts down all spell, spell-like, and supernatural abilities, and I don't want their transformations to be dispellable by Antimagic. If the Delfah's Bearform was (Su) or (Sp), then they would immediately revert back to human form the instant they cross into an Antimagic area.

I also wanted to underline the fact that what the Delfah are doing is not normal shapeshifting, so that's also a part of it.

If you think that's too strong, though, I'll make it a (Su) ability.
I understand where you're coming from, but I disagree on several levels.

For one thing, changing the ability just to avoid the effects of a single spell that might come up seems a bit too much like creator favoritism to me - in the event that that single spell ever comes into play, they delfah should just have to deal with it; particularly since all they're losing are two claw attacks, and a Strength bonus (heck, their Dexterity would improve because of it, even).

For another thing, it's hard to justify their ability to transform as an Extraordinary ability. This is because of A) rules consistency - the game rules are pretty clear on the fact that all such form-altering abilities are either spells, spell-like abilities, or supernatural abilities, so mucking around with that for no good reason isn't something that seems consistent with the rules (and internal consistency is the path to professionalism), and B ) in-game considerations - how do you have an entire race that can transform from humans into bears and back again, at will, and say that it's not magical in the least?

If there's a good in-game reason for why the delfah can morph like that and have it be an entirely natural process, then that's one thing. But if druids (with their wild shape) and spellcasters with polymorph-related spells all can put up with an antimagic field, I don't see why they can't too.

Lord Raine said:
Yeah, but do any of them have a stable, if faint, Fey bloodline running through their race?
Well, no, but to be fair that's not what you specified before...and also, what exactly having "Fey bloodline running through their race" constitutes in game terms can vary considerably, also.

Lord Raine said:
Even their gods exhibit this. Yondalla, their chief goddess, is well known amongst certain circles to possess a dual nature, seemingly being two gods in one. Openly, she is an idealized version of a homemaker and wife (Neutral Good), and yet she possesses a darker, more ruthless side more akin to a rogue and assassin than a mere housewife, which cares only for protecting her people and securing their well-being, no matter what that might entail (Chaotic Neutral).

Their chief god and the on-again-off-again paramour of Yondalla, Garl Glittergold, is little different. Though he himself is singular in nature, being a deity of light, song, and merriment, his archnemeisis Gelf Darkhearth is literally the evil version of himself, being a dark, twisted reflection of everything that Garl Glittergold stands for, a deity of revenge and entropy. Where Garl is witty and mirthful, Gelf is blunt and humorless. Where Garl laughs, Gelf snarls.
The grognard in me notes that you're using the pantheons as they were presented in, respectively, Races of the Wild and Races of Stone. Those weren't bad, but I don't think they hold a candle to the original Second Edition book, Monster Mythology. While it was admittedly a bit lighter on the gnome and halfling pantheons (it had plenty of gods, but didn't seem to flesh those two pantheons out much in terms of giving them their own feeling - save that the halfling gods had no evil deities, and the gnome gods had no female deities), it rocked on toast for presenting gods from other, oft-ignored races. Still the best, in my mind.

Lord Raine said:
I've looked in the Monster Manual and the Dungeon Master's Guide, and I can't seem to find a comprehensive list of what benefits and drawbacks specific Types and Subtypes impart.
I linked the baleful polymorph spell in my previous post for a reason - the caveat about the Shapechanger subtype defeating it is listed there.
 

Lord Raine

Well-Known Member
#91
I don't see it as having any positive value except trying to insert a slight dash of greater realism.
Yes, but I have a problem with the idea of armor made for a human fitting an eight foot tall anthropomorphic bear.

Magic armor and weapons automatically resize. I'm pretty sure that's in the DMG. So wearing magic armor shouldn't be a problem. But standard armor? A chain shirt? Full plate? Dude. Something's gotta give.

Though, for the sake of thoroughness, I should mention that Delfah actually invented a kind of armor with joints designed to stretch and expand, so a Delfah wearing stretch armor wouldn't have to worry about it.

It's interesting to note that this idea basically harkens back to the old "simulationist vs. gamist" approach to games.
I'm 99% sure I'm a simulationist. Which is probably why 4.0 annoys me, as it's clearly min-maxed strictly for gamists.

For one thing, changing the ability just to avoid the effects of a single spell that might come up seems a bit too much like creator favoritism to me - in the event that that single spell ever comes into play, they delfah should just have to deal with it; particularly since all they're losing are two claw attacks, and a Strength bonus (heck, their Dexterity would improve because of it, even).

For another thing, it's hard to justify their ability to transform as an Extraordinary ability. This is because of A) rules consistency - the game rules are pretty clear on the fact that all such form-altering abilities are either spells, spell-like abilities, or supernatural abilities, so mucking around with that for no good reason isn't something that seems consistent with the rules (and internal consistency is the path to professionalism), and B ) in-game considerations - how do you have an entire race that can transform from humans into bears and back again, at will, and say that it's not magical in the least?

If there's a good in-game reason for why the delfah can morph like that and have it be an entirely natural process, then that's one thing. But if druids (with their wild shape) and spellcasters with polymorph-related spells all can put up with an antimagic field, I don't see why they can't too.
Fair enough. (Su) it is.

and also, what exactly having "Fey bloodline running through their race" constitutes in game terms can vary considerably, also.
It's my explanation for the spell-like abilities, and the explanation for the fluff that is their dualistic nature as a race.

The grognard in me notes that you're using the pantheons as they were presented in, respectively, Races of the Wild and Races of Stone. Those weren't bad, but I don't think they hold a candle to the original Second Edition book, Monster Mythology. While it was admittedly a bit lighter on the gnome and halfling pantheons (it had plenty of gods, but didn't seem to flesh those two pantheons out much in terms of giving them their own feeling - save that the halfling gods had no evil deities, and the gnome gods had no female deities), it rocked on toast for presenting gods from other, oft-ignored races. Still the best, in my mind.
That's awesome. . . but what do you think of the concept? I can't really comment on the content of a book I've never read. I just work with what I've got.

I linked the baleful polymorph spell in my previous post for a reason - the caveat about the Shapechanger subtype defeating it is listed there.
Oh. So it's in the explanation for the spell, then, as opposed to there being some sort of list or index that lists all the traits given by certain types and subtypes.

Is there some sort of list like that? Because it's one of the few things I have trouble keeping straight.
 

Alzrius

Well-Known Member
#92
Lord Raine said:
Yes, but I have a problem with the idea of armor made for a human fitting an eight foot tall anthropomorphic bear.

Magic armor and weapons automatically resize. I'm pretty sure that's in the DMG. So wearing magic armor shouldn't be a problem. But standard armor? A chain shirt? Full plate? Dude. Something's gotta give.

Though, for the sake of thoroughness, I should mention that Delfah actually invented a kind of armor with joints designed to stretch and expand, so a Delfah wearing stretch armor wouldn't have to worry about it.
I guess my main sticking point is that, while the thing about nonmagical armor possibly breaking when a creature shape-shifts but remains the same size is fine as a house rule, it shouldn't be written in as a racial trait specifically for the delfah.

The rule itself isn't necessarily a bad one - though I don't think it's worthwhile - but putting it in as being specific to the delfah seems odd. So they might break their armor, but a werewolf won't? What about when a doppelganger changes from a dwarf to an elf? Having the armor caveat be in the delfah's racial traits makes it their problem alone.

Lord Raine said:
That's awesome. . . but what do you think of the concept? I can't really comment on the content of a book I've never read. I just work with what I've got.
The concept that you presented worked very well, though I notice that there's no explanation for the fey-blooded aspect you mentioned previously. The implication seems to be that they're some sort of demi-fey, or were fey once but aren't (really) anymore. That might warrant some additional fluff.

Lord Raine said:
Oh. So it's in the explanation for the spell, then, as opposed to there being some sort of list or index that lists all the traits given by certain types and subtypes.

Is there some sort of list like that? Because it's one of the few things I have trouble keeping straight.
In the Monster Manual, the types and subtypes are all in the Glossary, along with numerous other things. If you check out www.d20srd.org however, you'll notice that there is a <a href='http://www.d20srd.org/indexes/typesSubtypes.htm]Types & Subtypes Index[/url] there.

Of course, that's just for what's in the SRD. New types and subtypes that WotC never made Open Game Content - such as the Deathless type in the Book of Exalted Deeds and Eberron Campaign Setting, or the Obyrith and Loumara subtypes from Fiendish Codex I: Hordes of the Abyss - won't be found there.
 

Lord Raine

Well-Known Member
#93
The concept that you presented worked very well, though I notice that there's no explanation for the fey-blooded aspect you mentioned previously. The implication seems to be that they're some sort of demi-fey, or were fey once but aren't (really) anymore. That might warrant some additional fluff.
There's no explanation because the Halflings can't agree on how it came about, though I suppose that particular fact itself should have been mentioned. The most prominent idea outside Halfling society is that the race went through a population bottleneck at some point in the distant past, and fey blood got involved with the few Halflings that made it through, which is why all Halflings have traces of it.

In the Halfling community, the debate is split between an ancient Halfling hero marrying a fairy princess, who's blood now runs in all their veins, and an innate gift that was given to them by their creator, Garl Glittergold.

Do you happen to have any suggestions for how I could list or phrase the traits the Bearform possesses? I'm having a terrible time figuring out how to fit in everything that's necessary, such as claw attacks and the like, and make the wording make sense.
 

Alzrius

Well-Known Member
#94
Lord Raine said:
Do you happen to have any suggestions for how I could list or phrase the traits the Bearform possesses? I'm having a terrible time figuring out how to fit in everything that's necessary, such as claw attacks and the like, and make the wording make sense.
I don't think it'd be that difficult, since it's only having a few mechanical changes - the hard part is factoring in things like whether or not their clothes also change with them, if they get a disguise bonus to appearing as a normal bear, etc. I'd make it like so:

Bear Form (Su): A delfah can change its body into that of a bear of the same size category. In this form, the delfah gains two claw attacks for 1d6 damage, and gains +4 Strength and +2 Constitution. They are able to speak intelligently while in bear form, and can still manipulate objects. While in bear form, they also gain a +10 circumstance bonus to Disguise checks to appear as a normal bear.

This doesn't mention worn objects, since there's no change of size or basic body shape involved, so I don't think that needs to be addressed. Similarly, I didn't mention how long it takes to transform, since unless otherwise stated, a supernatural ability is always a standard action that doesn't provoke an attack of opportunity.
 

Steel

Well-Known Member
#95
Raine's 'Delfah' picture is sourced to the new GW race in GW2, the Norns.
 

zedalb

Well-Known Member
#96
Sorry to necro even if it isnt that bad but 1 idea your"fixing" the core races, and adding "animalistic" races that get a +2LA


why dont you just make your core races stronger so they too get a +2LA
drawves get a stronger stat bonus or something
that way you can drop the LA competly?
 

Lord Raine

Well-Known Member
#97
Infernium

Infernium is a material that is manufactured in Hell under the supervision of the Forgemasters of the Deep Pits. In this process, the souls of the damned are transmuted into a metallic substance through the 'crystallization of their pain.' This is the result of tormenting the souls through torture, both physical, mental, and spiritual to well beyond the breaking point while subjecting the soul to specific psionic and arcane environments unique to the Deep Blackfire Forgeworks. The Forgemasters refer to this process as 'ripening' a soul, and it involves not only subjecting the soul to overwhelming torment, but locking the soul in a perpetual loop of anguish and torture by causing their own minds and soulflesh to rebel against them in the manner of their mortal sins, their souls crystallizing in response to the act of being torn apart by their own spiritual bodies.

When a soul is fully ripened, it is then added to the forges and melted down, still conscious, and left to stew with other molten souls in hellish heat. This serves the dual purpose of not only creating a uniform molten mixture than can then be poured and cast, but also adding further refinement to the quality by providing even further torture to the fully conscious souls in the form of diabolical heat.

Infernium itself is quite beautiful in appearance, and superficially identical to gold, the exact same hue as the crystallized souls used to produce it, who after their ripening take on the appearance of solid gold humanoid statues, albeit ones wracked by unspeakable torment, frozen forever in a rictus of agony. Infernium is an important part of the day-to-day functioning of Hell, because coins cast from it constitute the primary brand of currency in Hell. While more powerful fiends might trade amongst themselves in souls directly, Infernium-cast coinage is pressed into use for everything else. It is also used in the manufacture of weapons and armor, the possession of which is considered a mark of wealth and power in fiendish circles. Powerful and influential fiends frequently commission entire suits of armor and sets of weapons crafted from Infernium, and many upscale fiendish clothing possesses spun Infernium wire woven in as decoration.

Infernium weapons are typically seen in the hands of powerful fiends or champions of Evil, and are a rare occurrence outside of Hell. Rarer still, however, is Infernium-cast coinage, due primarily to the fact that Fiends use it almost exclusively amongst themselves, and because they hold it at much higher value than other 'mundane' mortal metals like steel, gold, or iron. A Fiend would part with a wagon full of gold before it gave up a purse of Infernium coins, for the same reason a jeweler would pass up a sack of the finest polished quartz for a snuffbox of rough diamonds.

When brought near auras of Evil of at least Faint strength, Infernium glitters and seems to flicker with an inner light, with the effect increasing as the aura gains in strength. At Overwhelming, Infernium shines so intensely that it appears to be sculpted golden fire.

Infernium is infused with suffering and pain, and is filled with spiritual and psychic anguish. All the souls whose substance was used to create the Infernium are still conscious, frozen in eternal agony but unable to express or convey their suffering in any way. As a result of this, any weapon made of Infernium it is considered Evil-aligned for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.

Non-evil characters and creatures capable of sensing psychic or spiritual phenomena (such as fey, psions, monks, magical beasts, and magic users of at least fourth level) are uneasy when Infernium is nearby, as are any Good-aligned characters or creatures. If shown something crafted from Infernium, no matter how beautiful, they would find something indefinably off-putting about it's appearance. Evil creatures of similar persuasion find the presence of Infernium soothing, and if shown something crafted of Infernium, would find that object particularly striking.

Superficially, Infernium is identical to gold in appearance. An Appraisal DC of 15 reveals that it is not gold, and a DC of 20 (Appraise/Knowledge:The Planes/Knowledge:Religion) correctly deduces what the substance actually is.

Weapons or armors fashioned from Infernium are always masterwork items due to the difficulty in working it properly. The masterwork cost is included in the prices given below.

Infernium has 30 hp per inch of thickness and a hardness of 15.


Light Armor === +1,000
Medium Armor = +4,000
Heavy Armor ===+9,000
Shield ======= +1,000
Other Items === +500



Thoughts?
 

Vexarian

Well-Known Member
#98
:huh:

Hell of an unexpected. Necro.

Any particular reason for it?

Also the Sin-Metal is fine, although I don't know enough about the d20 system to comment on the balance, the fluff is nice.
 

Lord Raine

Well-Known Member
#99
I've been working on the setting some, and have refined it a bit. I'm toying with the idea of inserting a house modification where all playable races are either +0 or +1 level adjustment, and the rest of the racial benefits are in as optional racial feats.

I'm also creating organizations to add flavor to the setting. One organization I'm working on involves a Lawful Good order of paladins, knights, rouges, and other classes that believe that the Lawful Goodness of Heaven supersedes any earthly government or authority. Ergo, you get Lawful Good characters who will openly oppose things like tyrannies and unjust laws, and not bother with due-process when the system is obviously corrupt. Or, to put it into simple terms: they respect the law. Just not mortal law. They are simultaneously loved and hated for this, for obvious reasons. The people see them as true heroes, of the sort that won't be dissuaded by backroom deals or corrupt politics, but many nobles, aristocrats, and kings see them as dangerous meddlers and anarchists who don't show proper respect and just seek to stir up the masses. Some religions also don't like them, which mostly stems from concerned religious elite. Basically, most normal folk belove them, but by the same token, there are quite a few people in power who hate them and fear them, or at the very least don't trust them.

I'm still working on a name for this organization, but I haven't hit upon anything I really like yet. I toyed briefly with 'Fraternity of Olympia," but discarded it as not having the right kind of flavor. I'm currently looking into 'Knights of Arcadia,' with Arcadia being a celestial term that angels use in their own tongue to refer to the Heavens, but I may scrap that in favor of calling an earthly human kingdom I haven't named yet Arcadia, in which case the Knights of Arcadia would be something completely different (the defenders of that human realm).
 

Aarik

Well-Known Member
Knights of Justice?
The Heavenly Wings Beheading?
The Order of The Eight Thunder Gods?
The Gods Right Hand?
The Gods Left Hand?
The Giant Blue God Cock?
 
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