Naruto Naruto is living a Video Game

#26
There's still the lingering problem of drama and how to supply it in a world with save-scumming.

What if it's a co-op game? That way you get to switch from a plot or combat focus to a character focus, a la Reload.
 

The Ero-Sennin

The Eyes of Heaven
Staff member
#27
Here I thought that this was Naruto with Scott Pilgrim flavor, with a video game-style universe entirely arbitrary for the sake of humor.
 

Wildfeather

Well-Known Member
#28
I think a lot of the ideas here aren't compatible, or only vaguely so. Some of them are too complicated to show in a reasonable fashion (you want one session of the game to be an entire adventure, and still expect people to want to read session 2?), but here's my take on how to run a Naruto: The Video Game idea.

Start the game off with rolling your character, making it clear that there were a lot more customization options that you didn't pick, but you eventually made the protagonist we know. If you want to be pedantic, use something like he GURPS system to make a statistical analysis of your character, but make sure to poking out the the key characterization points of Naruto to date:Compassionate, Charismatic, Troublemaker, etc. And then have the "jinchukiri" option apply to your character as a random event, with the repercussions thereof (you lose your dad and mom, village dislikes you, hen let he player play through the academy as a tutorial, which if you pass or fail leads to different endings.

Essentially, focus on the story elements first, with the gameplay elements secondary, but still important. Penalize the player for not remaining in character, and give him bonus for remaining in character. Use the actions of the PC to also create random events to bring the game to life and make it more than a cannon rehash with a better or worse version of Naruto.

I think the draw of the video game genre is that it let's you explore a lot of character concepts without needing to write a whole lot of backstory. Puppeteer! Naruto avatar unlocked! Let's do see what that is like. The main strength of this genre is that it lets you play a lot of different Naruto in the same story. So do that! Have one main game, but take some time after you unlock an avatar to explore that one like a real gamer would.

You beat Mizuki but used Kurama's chakra to do it? Unlocked! Weaker Seal Naruto! Then do the same thing you just did on the last avatar, but with this one for a little while. Give the player some personality, not just Naruto.. Maybe he likes weaker seal Naruto better, but it has less unlocking options, so after getting to the chunin exam, he goes back to generic! Naruto. I'm glazing over it very quickly, but really expand the details and try to imagine you're a game designer while writing, so that the PC is doing interesting things all the time, between the scripted events.


Here is what not to do:

Turn the fic into an RPG. The reason we use levels and exp in video games is because we need some way to artificially measure a characters progress. In literary fiction, we expect that our characters grow organically. Use this to your advantage to avoid having to shoehorn in new elements or boring sequences, like grinding on the previously never seen mildly dangerous monster infestation of Konoha.

As mentioned above, don't insert game elements intrusively. If your character is trying to convince someone of something, the reader can figure that out. You don't need to bold and state for the reader "Diplomacy Check!" Which always looks like shit and feels wrong. Same thing for skill checks, we know our character has failed or succeeded pretty much by reading, so if you are going to use obnoxious announcements, make them part of the plot. Say you fail a skill check, (the game tells you) but still get a success result, suddenly there is tension because you know that you failed, but the obvious outcome (failing to succeed) wasn't the result.

Don't treat the reader or player like an idiot. If this is the first playthrough, most of the helpful hints and tooltips for things will be on. While Info Dumps are bad form, in a video game they are necessary. Minimize these and maximize the amount of information shown while playing in order to create a better feel for the story. If Naruto just spent a whole lot of money, show in terms of the story what the upgrades did. Better kunai should be easier to aim and deal more damage, show us this by having Naruto do something he couldn't do before with them (not throwing at a bullseye please) like have him always dodge kunai and shuriken attack pre-kunai buff, and post-kunai buff, let him deflect them or knock them out of the air.

Which leads to improvements. Make the reader and player feel like Naruto is constantly advancing. Try to avoid having him wait for long periods of time between upgrades, which just isn't fun. And make sure he uses these upgrades. It doesn't matter that Naruto has his kunai buffed to level 6 if he is tossing around Rasengan all day. Make sure that whatever improvements you give Naruto are useful current, and potentially useful in the future. See the Diablo 2 synergy tree for an example of this. Really good with shuriken? The Rasenshuriken deals extra damage. All those explosive tag upgrades are great if you can stick em on your opponent, or if your kunai skill is good, you can spam them like laser guided grenades. Keep then relevant and simple, but fun.

Keep It Simple Stupid applies here. This applies to pretty much everything in the whole game, but especially skills and relationships.

More if I think about it. Maybe ill try to make a snippet to show what I mean, but I'm. Pretty terrible writer.

Edit:fucking autocorrect, it should be readable now.

Edit2: Had some more ideas.

If I were to write one of these, i'd frame is as a second run, so that there would already be a number of avatar available. Specifically though, the past run would have been Namikaze! Naruto, raised by his parents. He eventually teams up with his dad to beat Tobi and the Ten tails (which is successfully resurrected in this run through) because those are the only things I can think of that could beat Minato + Minato raised Naruto.

At the end, you do the standard point totals, then Naruto notices he only got 25% of the points he could have, because he was playing on Very Easy. This run (which mirrors cannon) is on normal, so a lot of things could be different. I think I may be able to run with this idea though, so we'll see if I actually put anything to paper.
 

Aarik

Well-Known Member
#29
Hardcore Heathen said:
There's still the lingering problem of drama and how to supply it in a world with save-scumming.

What if it's a co-op game? That way you get to switch from a plot or combat focus to a character focus, a la Reload.
Insert a Lives mechanic.

That is saved in the main menu, so you can't save scum away deaths.

Game Over means either: Literally game over, re roll character, Naruto (really) dies, or Naruto's save is reset and he has to start over.

The game is already full of 'fake difficulty' nonsense that a real game would get screamed at for, let's abuse that aspect to.

Also, make getting new lives HARD.

Like, he has to complete the DLC quests to get lives. (filler arcs, movies)

Or accomplish some herculean achievement during a battle, like a flawless victory against an opponent WAY out of his current league. Or do something like beat all of akatsuki at once, or win the Chunin Exams with a certain tear of avatar, which would require he stop the invasion before it even starts so no one stops the exams.

And don't tell him how to do this till he does it by accident from the in game help file.
 

Leonite

Well-Known Member
#30
One thing I DID like about GOTYE is that they did show a few optional bosses. For those who don't know, at one point, Naruto stumbles into a tree and falls down a hole... and ends up fighting the Ichibi. Unbound. Without Summoning. He dies quickly, and the Kyuubi is freaking the fuck out as he could feel the other Bijuu in the tree. Naruto proceeds to face Shukaku after the Chunin Exams fight with Gaara, only winning due to over use of explosives and Kyuubi Chakra, and even then it got close at certain points (And getting killed there isn't a Game Over, just a kick out of the area).

Maybe we could use a similar concept for much harder "optional boss fight" types?
 

Altered Nova

Well-Known Member
#31
What about a Left 4 Dead style "AI director" that increases the difficulty of the game dynamically whenever the player is doing really well?

Naruto reveals to Sasuke and Sakura that Kakashi is intentionally trying to turn them against each other with the bell test rules and that they need to disregard his directions and work together to pass? Kakashi overhears, suspects that Iruka warned Naruto about him, and changes the rules on the fly to something Naruto's never seen before.

Naruto successfully warns Hiruzen about the specifics of the invasion and they prepare a trap for Orochimaru? Turns out that Naruto didn't fail his graduation exam this time and never dealt with Mizuki, and Mizuki is much better at spying then he is at stealing forbidden scrolls. Orochimaru knows everything about Konoha's modified defenses and alters his plan of attack to compensate, and possibly recruits a few more villages with grievances against Konoha to participate.

Naruto uses his foreknowledge and advanced skills to defeat Haku and Zabuza without killing them on the Wave mission? Turns out something he did different made Gato paranoid enough to hire another pair of missing-nin to finish the job. Instead of an army of mooks, Gato arrives at the bridge with Kakuzu and Hidan escorting him.

Naruto befriends Kurama and gains full control over Kurama's chakra and bijuu mode early? Akatsuki decide he's become too much of a threat and come after him much earlier and in much larger numbers.

I think this would be a pretty good way to retain a sense of tension in the story as well as alleviating any boredom from copying scens straight from the manga with only minor changes.


---


I'm wondering how the Kyuubi would react to this premise. I certainly don't want him to join Naruto in his time-loops or be aware of the game, but as he mentioned once he's watched Naruto all his life and was even aware of the time Naruto kissed Sasuke. Naruto would not be able to hide all his impossible skills and foreknowledge from someone who is basically living in his head. Would the changes prompt him to try to manipulate and tempt Naruto more often? How would Kurama react to a 2 year old Naruto suddenly popping up in the seal, calling him by name and declaring that they're going to be best friends? If Naruto is particularly powerful, could Kurama be convinced that he's the reincarnation of the Sage of Six Paths?
 

Avider

Well-Known Member
#32
Dude....all those really just suck.

I mean, at least if it happens all the time. This is just like a racing game where the AI will always, always, always be just right behind you. It's like your efforts aren't rewarded at all, the world's just an ass.
 

Leonite

Well-Known Member
#33
Avider said:
Dude....all those really just suck.

I mean, at least if it happens all the time. This is just like a racing game where the AI will always, always, always be just right behind you. It's like your efforts aren't rewarded at all, the world's just an ass.
But this isn't a game we are playing, its a game we are forcing Naruto to play.
 

Raye_Terse

Well-Known Member
#34
Wasn't the point of this to make Naruto as genre savvy as possible while making him exploit as many game mechanics as he can get his grubby little hands on?

In which case I guess we should focus less on perfect game mechanics that make for an interesting and entertaining story, and more on realistically imperfect game mechanics that make for interesting and entertaining exploitation.

So, the obvious exploit that I'm sure everyone has thought of is save scumming. An obvious place to do this would be in the Forest of Death, where Naruto can savescum to find out which teams have which scrolls. If he's fast enough, he might even be able to get his team out of the forest before Orochimaru shows up.

Another exploit would be if kage bunshin returned some amount of their skill advancements (e.g. half) to Naruto. Say, for example, that Naruto needs an arbitrary number 1000 to advance to the next skill level in a specific skill. He makes 5 kage bunshin, and each of them advances 200 in that skill. Altogether that makes for 1000 points, of which Naruto recieves half when the kage bunshin dispel. This is just as exploitable as in the manga, the difference being that game!Naruto knows about it earlier, and is genre savvy enough to exploit it ruthlessly.
 

mishie

Well-Known Member
#35
Well, if you want to explain why kage bunshin are suddenly able to give Naruto exp and knowledge, just have it be an upgrade that he can unlock from Kakashi that once Naruto progresses far enough in his Social Link, although you would probably want to nerf the amount of exp that he can get from a clone, simply due to the fact that it would only make things too boring.

As for Naruto being punished for trying to make things easier, like I said before, punish him for taking the easier route, such as telling the Hokage about Akatsuki outright results in them going after him straight away. Coming up with strategies to deal with them better though, even something as simple as sticking with Jiraiya when they go after Tsunade so he doesn't get cornered, meaning that Sasuke doesn't get to try to 1v1 Itachi could have benefits for him.
 
#36
Don't forget that games in this day and age can come with DownLoadContent.

You can have it set up where after acquiring a certain amount of points, that Naruto can unlock DLC

Also, I'm just throwing this out there, but there is an actual game where Naruto crosses over with one piece and dragon ball Z.

I'm not crazy about the idea, but possible Cross over DLC could be use to make more interesting if bored.
After all, the shimmering isle certainly made oblivion more fun.

I also wonder if Naruto the game will be like elder scrolls, where there a main quest, but that you don't need to necessarily progress with it right away.
 

Leonite

Well-Known Member
#37
Luna Tears said:
Don't forget that games in this day and age can come with DownLoadContent.

You can have it set up where after acquiring a certain amount of points, that Naruto can unlock DLC

Also, I'm just throwing this out there, but there is an actual game where Naruto crosses over with one piece and dragon ball Z.

I'm not crazy about the idea, but possible Cross over DLC could be use to make more interesting if bored.
After all, the shimmering isle certainly made oblivion more fun.

I also wonder if Naruto the game will be like elder scrolls, where there a main quest, but that you don't need to necessarily progress with it right away.
Maybe nothing as extreme as crossover DLC... but what about DLC in the form of the plots from the video games? You know, the ones with the hard to put into canon plots? Kizuna Drive, the Dragon Sword one, and so on, make them Downloadable missions, with stuff like the Dragon Sword or the Super Beast Summoning from Kizuna Drive, to give an example for each, being unlocked as tresures or skills upon completion? Stuff that, with justification such as DLC, could be dragged into the game continuity.

I mainly say this because if Crossover DLC is allowed, we might get demands for Batman!Naruto. Or the power level of a Dragon Ball Z crossover would be completely misbalenced, given that they could bust moons before Z and the best we've seen in Naruto is mountain destroyer.
 

Aarik

Well-Known Member
#38
Adding the Naruto games to the DLC list should be fine.

Though this game has a lot of DLC now, the movies, the filler arcs, and now the video games.

At least if we use my lives mechanic Naruto should be fine.

If miserable from all this bullshit dlc.
 

Leonite

Well-Known Member
#39
Aarik said:
Adding the Naruto games to the DLC list should be fine.

Though this game has a lot of DLC now, the movies, the filler arcs, and now the video games.

At least if we use my lives mechanic Naruto should be fine.

If miserable from all this bullshit dlc.
I'd make exceptions to that DLC thing, make some of them optional, non-downloadable missions. The stuff that is either easy to fit into canon (Movie 1, if you take the Anime path and put it after Tsunade is retrieved, but before their filler mission) or is an expansion on canon (The Three Tails arc in Shippuden, which I've heard is widely regarded as high quality)
 

Altered Nova

Well-Known Member
#40
One of the most widely noted inconsistencies in the manga is the almost unique way that Naruto uses the transformation jutsu. Enma and Naruto are the only people that ever use it to turn into inanimate objects, and Naruto once even seemingly turned into pure chakra in the form of a rasenshuriken.

What if that was because Naruto had unknowingly discovered a glitch in the game? Like, normally the tranformation jutsu can only be used to turn into living, humanoid creatures, but if you happen to be wearing a large amount of bright orange it unlocks debug mode and lets you turn into anything.

Likewise, the Kage Bunshin memory transfer training trick practically screams "poorly balanced game mechanic". By using the Kyuubi's chakra to create hundreds or thousands of clones at a time he's using the jutsu in a way the developers clearly didn't intend. Would be hilarious if immediately after he masters Fuuton Rasengan a game master sends him a private message informing him that they've noticed his cheating and patched the exploit out of the game.
 

Solaris

Well-Known Member
#41
Altered Nova said:
One of the most widely noted inconsistencies in the manga is the almost unique way that Naruto uses the transformation jutsu. Enma and Naruto are the only people that ever use it to turn into inanimate objects, and Naruto once even seemingly turned into pure chakra in the form of a rasenshuriken.

What if that was because Naruto had unknowingly discovered a glitch in the game? Like, normally the tranformation jutsu can only be used to turn into living, humanoid creatures, but if you happen to be wearing a large amount of bright orange it unlocks debug mode and lets you turn into anything.

Likewise, the Kage Bunshin memory transfer training trick practically screams "poorly balanced game mechanic". By using the Kyuubi's chakra to create hundreds or thousands of clones at a time he's using the jutsu in a way the developers clearly didn't intend. Would be hilarious if immediately after he masters Fuuton Rasengan a game master sends him a private message informing him that they've noticed his cheating and patched the exploit out of the game.
That'd be actually pretty funny. Naruto's life is like the beta test for a game where he munchkins the hell out of exploits he finds to make his life better. Only to find out like a day later that its' been patched out because it's overpowered.
 
#42
Solaris said:
Altered Nova said:
One of the most widely noted inconsistencies in the manga is the almost unique way that Naruto uses the transformation jutsu. Enma and Naruto are the only people that ever use it to turn into inanimate objects, and Naruto once even seemingly turned into pure chakra in the form of a rasenshuriken.

What if that was because Naruto had unknowingly discovered a glitch in the game? Like, normally the tranformation jutsu can only be used to turn into living, humanoid creatures, but if you happen to be wearing a large amount of bright orange it unlocks debug mode and lets you turn into anything.

Likewise, the Kage Bunshin memory transfer training trick practically screams "poorly balanced game mechanic". By using the Kyuubi's chakra to create hundreds or thousands of clones at a time he's using the jutsu in a way the developers clearly didn't intend. Would be hilarious if immediately after he masters Fuuton Rasengan a game master sends him a private message informing him that they've noticed his cheating and patched the exploit out of the game.
That'd be actually pretty funny. Naruto's life is like the beta test for a game where he munchkins the hell out of exploits he finds to make his life better. Only to find out like a day later that its' been patched out because it's overpowered.
Not a day later. It works until he dies, because that's when they have Scheduled Maintenance.

So you have Naruto figuring out theoretical loopholes and then saving them up until he needs them, instead of just going balls to the wall and hitting every glitch and exploit he can find in each playthrough. This obviously requires some strategery.

And some bugs you just can't fix; they're Working As Intended.
 

daniel_gudman

KING (In Land of Blind)
Staff member
#43
I don't like intending to change the rules of the game from the get-go.

I think it would betray the idea of "Naruto figuring out the game", and more importantly, I think it would make it more confusing for the reader. (Having other people involved is a super-serious issue I'll address in like two paragraphs).

Also, there's no need for something like "optional bosses" or "DLC" when there's a whole entire world being "simulated".

If you want to do something different, take different missions.

If you just want to fight someone without worrying about consequences at all, go tell the Raikage his leadership is bad and he should feel bad.

also

earlier said:
who runs Tiger Dojo?
The idea of Kakashi running it made me realize the perfect candidate... so the "hint corner" after Bad Ends will be called,

"Obito's Graveyard". He'll be a different kind of undead every time, like a ghost, and a zombie, and a mummy, and a vampire... maybe later there will be cameos from other dead folks.

PvP, getting PMs from admins, etc
I think this complicates the premise too much.

Classically, there are three kinds of conflict in literature (complete with a historical artifact of implicitly sexist language):
1) Man vs. Man
2) Man vs. Environment
3) Man vs. Himself

This concept is firmly rooted in the second: Naruto isn't really struggling against other people any more, he's trying to beat a system. Pulling other people into that contradicts that fundamental premise, and pushes it back towards the first (Man vs Man).

Having other people be players, especially having him deal with "admins"; once those come into play, you'll have Naruto calling them out like this:

Naruto: Why the fuck are we all trapped in a suffering simulator!?

Once the "game" stops being some inscrutable vast machine, once it stops being "the laws of reality" and starts being "a constructed place", then Naruto will be in a position to call all the programmers assholes for trapping him (and possibly others) in a simulated reality where there is no apparent reason for anyone to fight and die and suffer.

The "game" has to be a different "physics ruleset" than he's used to; it has to be "the unthinking universe", because otherwise....

Once Naruto is telling the Matrix to eat a dick, we're talking about a much different kind of story.

That's a full Cerberus Shift. I'm not saying that would be a bad story, but the fundamental implications are much darker than I think the people suggesting these things fully realize.

Best case scenario is, he's Tsukasa from the first dothack anime, only he also has amnesia, in addition to being in a cybercoma. The ending is either: he rejects reality and stays in the illusion, which is the opposite of Naruto, or he wakes up and he's just some dumb kid without any special powers and abilities and he's two years behind in school, and he's gonna go live a normal life now. (And he's actually a girl, and Hinata's in a wheelchair).

Worst case...off the top of my head.... The Machine Empire drinks chakra for fuel, and experiments have shown ninja wars produce the most chakra, so the Matrix is designed for unceasing chakra-user violence. Tobi's the hero because he's going to full Kobayashi Maru the crap out of the Matrix by using the Moon-Eye Plan to instantly close the chakra tap overnight and crash the Machines' energy infrastructure.

At any rate, once other people start participating, that effectively ends the "Naruto the Video Game" story and forces it into some kind of cyberpunk. I'm a big fan of scifi but that's not what I want to do here.
 

DrTempo

Well-Known Member
#44
Hmmm...
I'd do with an Action-Rpg style format(ala Kingdom Hearts.)
In fact...IDEA!
Naruto's story is only one of many going on in this game, ala Birth by Sleep. We may see other POVs, like Hinata's, Sasuke's, etc.

Speaking of which, all this alternate stuff reminds me of the upcoming Naruto flick "Road to Ninja", where things are different(for example, flirty Hinata, meganeko/pettanko Tsunade, busty Shizune, hot-blooded Kakashi, depressed Guy, etc.) might be in here.

Or, the "players" decide to have a little fun, and act this way.

Anyway, other characters being "players" is similar to the BBS example; different sides of a story.
 

Aarik

Well-Known Member
#46
DrTempo is like that.

Unfortunately.

Still nowhere near as bad as ZedalB
 

Leonite

Well-Known Member
#47
Maybe there are some glitches that might need more immediate patching? Say, to use an example from GOTYE, Haku and his/her switching gender?
 

DrTempo

Well-Known Member
#48
I did read that post. I just was giving my opinion. Sorry.

Maybe, the players would NOT know the other players are part of "the game."
 

zeebee1

Well-Known Member
#49
There is no such thing as an NPC, but there are people who don't know about the rules.
 

DrTempo

Well-Known Member
#50
zeebee1 said:
There is no such thing as an NPC, but there are people who don't know about the rules.
I concur. The characters I see as "players"(AKA those whom know the rules):
Naruto(duh)
Sasuke
Hinata
....Or at MOST, the Rookie 9.
 
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