Naruto Sasuke Doesn't Leave Konoha
- Thread starter Knyght
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Regarding Sasuke -- the point of discussing how strong the Sound Four are is that someone mentioned Sasuke simply killing the Sound Four outright as a viable divergence point and a couple others supported it. I am calling serious bullshit on that.
Saying Genma and Raido had no chakra to use is not supported by canon. Their conversation explicitly mentions tiredness due to a longer than expected mission. That is NOT the same as chakra exhaustion. Chakra is linked to physical condition, but it is not the same. Although they might not be full power here, they had enough chakra to knowingly engage the enemy. The shocked expression was coming from Sakon and Tayuya on page 17, not Raido. Raido and Genma initiated the attack. That very fact combined with Shizune's expression of shock at their condition says a lot about what kind of threat she would expect them to be able to face. Tired from a mission or not, they are still jounin and their chakra is not so depleted that they cannot fight.
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Start there.
And the Sound Four say "if we tried to conserve our energy we may have been defeated," not "oh shit without CS2 we would die for sure." There's a pretty big difference. Considering the caliber of the opponent, the fact that they can win at all proves they are strong.
Saying Genma and Raido had no chakra to use is not supported by canon. Their conversation explicitly mentions tiredness due to a longer than expected mission. That is NOT the same as chakra exhaustion. Chakra is linked to physical condition, but it is not the same. Although they might not be full power here, they had enough chakra to knowingly engage the enemy. The shocked expression was coming from Sakon and Tayuya on page 17, not Raido. Raido and Genma initiated the attack. That very fact combined with Shizune's expression of shock at their condition says a lot about what kind of threat she would expect them to be able to face. Tired from a mission or not, they are still jounin and their chakra is not so depleted that they cannot fight.
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Start there.
And the Sound Four say "if we tried to conserve our energy we may have been defeated," not "oh shit without CS2 we would die for sure." There's a pretty big difference. Considering the caliber of the opponent, the fact that they can win at all proves they are strong.
and Neko-baa managed to get Matatabi's imprint.
Maybe Yugito gets almost killed by another village and has to perform a fast-sealing on Sasuke(who was passing there by chance while on patrol duty) because Matatabi convinced her an Uchiha is better than those fuckers of the other village.
So Sasuke has now to deal with messed up chakra control and a voice in the head
Maybe Yugito gets almost killed by another village and has to perform a fast-sealing on Sasuke(who was passing there by chance while on patrol duty) because Matatabi convinced her an Uchiha is better than those fuckers of the other village.
So Sasuke has now to deal with messed up chakra control and a voice in the head
If Sasuke sets up a chidori charge, his target is going to die. If he has them all lined up, they will all die. Its pretty much that simple. As we saw in the Kakashi Gaiden, its a move that kills jounin if they aren't prepared for it.
Sasuke lost his fight with them by act of plot.
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As we see here, he wasn't even using his sharingan. And he was still able to land blows pretty much at will. Of course, since he wasn't using his eyes he couldn't actually see what Sakon was doing to block him. When he finally did decide to use them, it was with the cursed seal and a stupid berserk head on charge to punch someone.
Kimimaro has enough skill to deflect the high speed precog with a hand that will cut through multiple people, the others do not.
Sasuke lost his fight with them by act of plot.
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As we see here, he wasn't even using his sharingan. And he was still able to land blows pretty much at will. Of course, since he wasn't using his eyes he couldn't actually see what Sakon was doing to block him. When he finally did decide to use them, it was with the cursed seal and a stupid berserk head on charge to punch someone.
Kimimaro has enough skill to deflect the high speed precog with a hand that will cut through multiple people, the others do not.
What if we combined all of those ideas:
The Sound Four encounter Raido and Genma who, tired but not entirely exhausted, force them into unleashing their Curse Seal Two transformations. This, combined with the Sound Four's teamwork and superior numbers beats them and the Sound Four manage to get away, albeit weary from their fight.
When they encounter Sasuke, Kakashi having sensed their approach a mile away, hides himself and tries to figure out what they want with Sasuke and how it relates to Orochimaru.* Though they're already tired, they underestimate Sasuke and engage him one on one. With this haphazard approach, Sasuke actually manages to kill one of them outright with his chidori and sharingan blazing. Shocked by the way the Uchiha brat took down one of their number, they go Curse Seal Two right then and there and once again use their numbers advantage to start a beat down on Sasuke. Unfortunately for them however, this is where Kakashi decides to step in and proceeds to deliver a no holds barred curbstomp on the transformed Sound Three.
Seeing Kakashi at full strength reinforces Sasuke's belief that yeah, there are some damn powerful Konoha nin out there and he doesn't need to go to Orochimaru because "what can Orochimaru do for me if his four best soldiers got taken out by one of Konoha's finest?"
* - Alternatively, Kakashi is able to hear the Chidori and immediately runs back to check up on Sasuke.
The Sound Four encounter Raido and Genma who, tired but not entirely exhausted, force them into unleashing their Curse Seal Two transformations. This, combined with the Sound Four's teamwork and superior numbers beats them and the Sound Four manage to get away, albeit weary from their fight.
When they encounter Sasuke, Kakashi having sensed their approach a mile away, hides himself and tries to figure out what they want with Sasuke and how it relates to Orochimaru.* Though they're already tired, they underestimate Sasuke and engage him one on one. With this haphazard approach, Sasuke actually manages to kill one of them outright with his chidori and sharingan blazing. Shocked by the way the Uchiha brat took down one of their number, they go Curse Seal Two right then and there and once again use their numbers advantage to start a beat down on Sasuke. Unfortunately for them however, this is where Kakashi decides to step in and proceeds to deliver a no holds barred curbstomp on the transformed Sound Three.
Seeing Kakashi at full strength reinforces Sasuke's belief that yeah, there are some damn powerful Konoha nin out there and he doesn't need to go to Orochimaru because "what can Orochimaru do for me if his four best soldiers got taken out by one of Konoha's finest?"
* - Alternatively, Kakashi is able to hear the Chidori and immediately runs back to check up on Sasuke.
My analysis come from the SJ version. There, the Sound Four flat-out admitted that while going CS2 was counterproductive to their mission, as it forced them to have to stop cold and rest their bodies for a while, without it despite being on a clock, they would have been killed, since their opposition was two jonin-level ninja.
Later in Konoha, Genma and Raido both complained about their loss and one of them specifically cited that they exhausted their chakra on the previous mission as the only reason then went down.
Later in Konoha, Genma and Raido both complained about their loss and one of them specifically cited that they exhausted their chakra on the previous mission as the only reason then went down.
What happens if Sasuke doesn't leave?.....
Well.... Somewhere between a "lot changes" and "nothing much changes". :huh.:
Naruto's motives for training would be different, but... It's not like he's not still going to want to become stronger.
Sasuke's training will be vary different, but... All that's likely to effect is A. his move set, and B. the make up of the team he takes to kill Itachi. All in all, it might make him take the big reveal differently, but.... Then again, it might not....
really, it will effect a lot of "motives", but not nearly as many "results" as one(me at least :snigger: ) might think.
On the other hand, almost everyone involved is way happier..... At least until the big reveal anyway, then everyone get's all sad.... :sweat2:
Hell, if Sasuke is still "part of the team" when everyone finds out what happened to him family, then... Who knows, maybe a few of the others might join him in being royally pissed off.
Well.... Somewhere between a "lot changes" and "nothing much changes". :huh.:
Naruto's motives for training would be different, but... It's not like he's not still going to want to become stronger.
Sasuke's training will be vary different, but... All that's likely to effect is A. his move set, and B. the make up of the team he takes to kill Itachi. All in all, it might make him take the big reveal differently, but.... Then again, it might not....
really, it will effect a lot of "motives", but not nearly as many "results" as one(me at least :snigger: ) might think.
On the other hand, almost everyone involved is way happier..... At least until the big reveal anyway, then everyone get's all sad.... :sweat2:
Hell, if Sasuke is still "part of the team" when everyone finds out what happened to him family, then... Who knows, maybe a few of the others might join him in being royally pissed off.
If Sasuke doesn't earn his vest during the first exam I would be willing to bet that he earns one in the one after that. From there I could see him getting fast-tracked into ANBU, deepening his student/teacher relationship with Kakashi, or maybe getting some real leadership experience as an elite of the village.
With the ANBU route, I can see Kakashi trying to talk him out of it, meeting Yamato, and having to deal with Danzo trying to sink his claws into him. Of course, is Sasuke is in ANBU I would imagine Itachi would be watching the village even more carefully.
Post-time skip, Sasuke would definitely be a jounin though.
With the ANBU route, I can see Kakashi trying to talk him out of it, meeting Yamato, and having to deal with Danzo trying to sink his claws into him. Of course, is Sasuke is in ANBU I would imagine Itachi would be watching the village even more carefully.
Post-time skip, Sasuke would definitely be a jounin though.
To be honest, I'm not sure what Obito actually wanted with Sasuke in the first place. I assume he just wanted a powerful minion and used his knowledge of the massacre to make him dance to his tune. Here it's likely that he'd tell Sasuke about the massacre if only to sow some discord within Konoha.
I can't imagine Naruto turning against Konoha because of this. In canon, he only showed concern over how the truth was used to pull Sasuke further into the dark side, he never showed any interest in the Elders. But if Sasuke's still in Konoha then Naruto wouldn't have the same concerns and would probably be more active about it. I imagine he'd help Sasuke confront the Elders, without any intention of killing them, to verify the truth. Though it's possible they could turn against Danzo given how much shit he got up to; the fact that he's partially to blame for the Pain Invasion felt glossed over.
What happens is also dependent on Sasuke's development over the years in Konoha. He should be a lot better off emotionally and might have even given up on his revenge so he wouldn't have the same build-up of negativity that canon Sasuke had. I'd think that this one would at least be rational enough to know that he shouldn't hold the entire village responsible.
I can't imagine Naruto turning against Konoha because of this. In canon, he only showed concern over how the truth was used to pull Sasuke further into the dark side, he never showed any interest in the Elders. But if Sasuke's still in Konoha then Naruto wouldn't have the same concerns and would probably be more active about it. I imagine he'd help Sasuke confront the Elders, without any intention of killing them, to verify the truth. Though it's possible they could turn against Danzo given how much shit he got up to; the fact that he's partially to blame for the Pain Invasion felt glossed over.
What happens is also dependent on Sasuke's development over the years in Konoha. He should be a lot better off emotionally and might have even given up on his revenge so he wouldn't have the same build-up of negativity that canon Sasuke had. I'd think that this one would at least be rational enough to know that he shouldn't hold the entire village responsible.
Well, to be more specific its going to lead to Naruto learning why Kakashi felt he needed to improve his basics while Sasuke needed an A-rank jutsu. Basically that Naruto already knew one and good usage of it was more than enough to carry him through the exam. That basically in terms of kinjutsu its on the same level as Lee's Ura Renge except Naruto's advantages allow him to use it without worry, quite unlike Lee and his A-rank.
Its a talk that will remind Naruto that Sasuke has a noticeable handicap and no way to alleviate it. He is unarmed, no weapons or tools on him (he had to pickpocket one from Naruto literally a minute earlier, while Naruto has a full stock that replicates itself with each clone.
Basically, why get suckered into using his trump so early in the fight when Sasuke had no real counter to 50 Naruto bunshin throwing shuriken and other bunshin henged into shuriken at him.
Its a talk that will remind Naruto that Sasuke has a noticeable handicap and no way to alleviate it. He is unarmed, no weapons or tools on him (he had to pickpocket one from Naruto literally a minute earlier, while Naruto has a full stock that replicates itself with each clone.
Basically, why get suckered into using his trump so early in the fight when Sasuke had no real counter to 50 Naruto bunshin throwing shuriken and other bunshin henged into shuriken at him.
You know, nobody ever remembers Taju Kage Bunshin is a A-Rank jutsu, just like Chidori. I think there is a story here... or at least a Kakashi repying "Naruto, you know a A-Rank kinjutsu. You don't need new jutsu, you just need to learn how to use it." to Naruto's lamenting him favouring Sasuke.
And as somebody said, any improvement of Naruto's basis would be multiplied by the amount of his bunshin.
And as somebody said, any improvement of Naruto's basis would be multiplied by the amount of his bunshin.