DC Revamp

~NGD OMEGA~

Well-Known Member
#26
Oh that's why? I heard about that. There was some kind of court case regarding the technical creator of the concept selling it or something with no idea how popular and money making he would become, and the family or something sued for the rights back or whatever. I didn't follow it that closely though so I'm probably getting the details wrong.

Explains why the new Superman hasn't been seen at least...
 

cgobyd

Well-Known Member
#27
zeebee1 said:
"There are a lot of Superman fans who are rooting for the Shuster's and Siegals in this Lawsuit."

I don't think they're happy anymore. Besides, the Siegals get nothing but words with this. They've lost all potential to make a profit. Not unless they can make more shows or movies which won't be considered official by the fans.
Here wait does that mean Power Girl and Supergirl will also be gone?

 

Ghostface

Lazy Bastard...
#28
I'll just leave this here...

Can Superman be split in two?

Warner, DC, heirs should work together

By Ted Johnson

Warner Bros. is hoping that Zack Snyder can do for "Superman" what Christopher Nolan did for "Batman." But the studio's real-life tangle over the rights to the Man of Steel risks resembling another Nolan narrative: "Inception."

The way things are going, less than a year after Snyder's "Man of Steel" is released in 2012 the rights to a significant part of the early Superman lore will revert back to the heirs of creators Jerry Siegel and Joe Shuster.

The Siegel and Shuster estates could wind up owning some parts of the Superman story while DC Comics owns others. The estates could get Superman's blue leotard, red cape and boots, plus an ability to leap tall buildings while DC retains villains like Lex Luthor plus Superman's ability to fly.

The question is: Could each party proceed with a subsequent project without the other's involvement?

In theory, come 2013 auds could see two parallel versions of the Man of Steel ramp up. In practice, that looks pretty unworkable.

Setting this potential scenario in motion were a series of rulings in 2008 and 2009 by U.S. District Judge Stephen Larson, who ruled that Siegel's heirs had successfully reclaimed their share of the copyright to Action Comics No. 1, which marked Superman's 1938 debut; Action Comics No. 4; and other early depictions of the character and storyline. (Shuster's heirs are on a separate timeline that begins in 2013). Larson was acting on a provision of the 1976 Copyright Act that allows authors to regain the copyrights to their creations after a certain period of time, subject to a series of intricate conditions.

Among those conditions is that the works can't have been made "for hire," since those are exempt from such "rights termination," and it's a reason underlying Larson's ruling that the Siegel heirs don't own the Man of Steel outright; he found that Siegel's work as an employee of DC from 1938-43, as the character's mythology was still being established, remained under the ownership of the publisher.

While the "Superman" creators' heirs stand to hold important rights to the character, they don't have the trademarks, which would pose a significant limitation on marketing and merchandising. And their reclamation of the copyright applies only to the U.S., so international rights would remain in the hands of DC.

For its part, come 2013, DC could still exploit the Superman projects it's already made, but under the Copyright Act, the company could not create new "derivative" works based on Action Comics No. 1 and other properties held by the heirs. Presumably, more sequels would mean more legal land mines.

This is where things get a bit bizarre.

In a recent article published in the Columbia Journal of the Law & the Arts, Anthony Cheng writes that 7th Circuit Court of Appeals Judge Richard Posner's decision in Neil Gaiman's suit against Todd McFarlane "could provide the rationale for both parties to continue legally exploiting" Superman. Posner determined that Gaiman's "Medieval Spawn" was "sufficiently distinct" to justify a separate character copyright from the original Spawn.

Along this line of reasoning, one way to settle the Superman dispute would be to "split the character in two -- a 1938 Superman and a Modern Superman -- and allow both sides to create new works based on their versions," Cheng writes.

Moreover, because both sides would independently be exploiting their respective versions of the Man of Steel, they wouldn't have to go through the tricky work of accounting for each others' profits. They'd own what they own. One downside, though, Cheng writes, is that DC would have the more valuable version of the character, given the length of time it has been transforming Man of Steel projects into popular culture.

The other, more obvious, option is that all parties come together. But that's no easy feat. The heirs' attorney, Marc Toberoff, is appealing Larson's decision to the 9th Circuit to get a more definitive ruling on who owns what, while DC is proceeding with its suit against Toberoff, charging that he has poisoned their relationship with the Siegels and Shusters.

Amid all the acrimony, it's easy to forget the original intent of the "rights termination" clause of the Copyright Act: to give authors another opportunity to share in the rewards of their creations, not to parcel them out in bits and pieces.

Larson's point wasn't to parcel out the rights but to compel everyone to come to the same table for potentially mutual benefit. As he wrote in one ruling, Superman is an "aggregate whole," not "a red cape here, a particular villain there."

Contact Ted Johnson at ted.johnson@variety.com
 

Prince Charon

Well-Known Member
#29
@Ghostface: Any chance you might post that on Spacebattles.com? They have a thread for it, in the main forum.

From this, it looks like Kon-el, Kara, et al are still viable, even if DC can't come to an agreement with the heirs, as they're not Siegel and Shuster characters. Some elements would need to be changes, like Kara being from, say, the planet <a href='http://dcanimated.wikia.com/wiki/Argo' target='_blank' rel='nofollow'>Argo</a>, with no mention of what system its in - for that matter, the same could be done for the modern-age Superman. Perhaps Argoans are very powerful psychics (primarily short-range or touch-only Psychokinesis, of course - Tactile Telekinesis!), who are able to boost their powers tremendously in the presence of a high-energy-output sun (the 'solar capacitor' thing is a modern convention) - so, this hypothetical Superman would gain an immense enhancement near a blue star, for example.

Mind you, DC may not want to come to an agreement, when they own the potentially more profitable version of the character, but their suit against Toberoff suggests otherwise.
 

Mick

Well-Known Member
#30
This lawyer sounds like fucking vermin.
 
#31


Tim Drake is forced to step out from behind his keyboard when an international organization seeks to capture or kill super-powered teenagers. As Red Robin, he must team up with the mysterious and belligerent powerhouse thief known as Wonder Girl and a hyperactive speedster calling himself Kid Flash in TEEN TITANS #1, by Scott Lobdell and artists Brett Booth and Norm Rapmund.




John Constantine, Deadman, Shade the Changing Man and Madame Xanadu are Justice League Dark, a band of supernatural heroes united to stop the dark things the rest of the DCU does not see in JUSTICE LEAGUE DARK #1, by Peter Milligan and artist Mikel Janin.
Tim Drake and Young Justice is now RUINED FOREVER. But Justice League Dark looks like it has potential.
 

ttestagr

Well-Known Member
#32
Wait. What the fuck are they doing with Wonder Girl!?!?!
 

Ghostface

Lazy Bastard...
#33
Holy mother of god, what have they done to Connor?!?
 
#34
ttestagr said:
Wait. What the fuck are they doing with Wonder Girl!?!?!
Looks like they merged Cassie and Donna due to the latter's overcomplicated backstory and also gave the merger an EXTREEEEME 90's update.
 

cgobyd

Well-Known Member
#35
I think that girl in the background is a Spawn like Shadow, but I have no clue who that crawling girl is.
 

zeebee1

Well-Known Member
#36
Why did the heirs actually think this would make a profit? DC is clearly ignoring them, and you can't make Superman without the whole deal.
 

Vesvius

Well-Known Member
#37
......................

The Green Lanterns. ARE THE GREEN LANTERNS GOING TO BE OKAY?!

They've apparently already fucked Batman, Teen Titans, and Deadman (who I was really hoping for a solo series for after Brightest Day). All they have to do is screw over the Lanterns and Booster and then all my favorites are trashed.

I'd worry they'd screw over Green Arrow too, but Cry for Justice already did that.
 

Lord Raine

Well-Known Member
#38
Upon learning about that Spawn thing, what little respect I had left for Gaiman died.

Insisting that your chronologically displaced copy of somebody else's work is original to you? What the fuckshit. The only thing more wrong than that is the fact that he apparently won his case.
 

DhampyrX2

Well-Known Member
#39
Looks like they're re-tooling Connor to be closer to his Young Justice toon counterpart. Assholes need to learn when to take a step back.

And the Superman thing is funny as hell. I can just picture how the family will react when this really settles in. "Okay, so we own the rights to a poorly drawn strongman with a plain looking red S on a dark blue background on his chest that is strong and can jump really well. With international trademarks and corpyrights we pretty much can't sell anything but a character that was outdated and ready to be retooled by the fifties. The popular one is totally out of out reach and DC could just produce everything somewhere like Japan and import it here to still make a profit. Even if we somehow block them from producing anything with the iconic character that everyone will think is Superman we can't sell the rights to anything either because nobody will want our version. Why did we listen to that lawyer again?"
 
#41
Lord Raine said:
Upon learning about that Spawn thing, what little respect I had left for Gaiman died.

Insisting that your chronologically displaced copy of somebody else's work is original to you? What the fuckshit. The only thing more wrong than that is the fact that he apparently won his case.
Wasn't the real issue that he gave Gaiman credit for co-creating the character and then changed his mind and stopped paying royalties and claimed it was all his?
 

trevelyan1983

Well-Known Member
#42
Christopher Robin said:
Lord Raine said:
Upon learning about that Spawn thing, what little respect I had left for Gaiman died.

Insisting that your chronologically displaced copy of somebody else's work is original to you? What the fuckshit. The only thing more wrong than that is the fact that he apparently won his case.
Wasn't the real issue that he gave Gaiman credit for co-creating the character and then changed his mind and stopped paying royalties and claimed it was all his?
Yes. However, lacking a grasp of the facts has never stopped Raine pontificating before. :p
 

Lord Raine

Well-Known Member
#43
trevelyan1983 said:
Christopher Robin said:
Lord Raine said:
Upon learning about that Spawn thing, what little respect I had left for Gaiman died.

Insisting that your chronologically displaced copy of somebody else's work is original to you? What the fuckshit. The only thing more wrong than that is the fact that he apparently won his case.
Wasn't the real issue that he gave Gaiman credit for co-creating the character and then changed his mind and stopped paying royalties and claimed it was all his?
Yes. However, lacking a grasp of the facts has never stopped Raine pontificating before. :p
Actually I do have a grasp of them. I followed the case some time ago, and heard there was a lawsuit. I was well aware of what the dispute was over, and thought then that Gaiman was in the wrong. I just never knew that he won.

But hey. Assume Lord Raine doesn't know anything, and that your lack of detailed information on the subject is irrelevant. That's what all the cool kids do, amirite?
 

Meinos Kaen

Well-Known Member
#44
Hmmm... I like the new Red Robin costume. Condom-Head has finally disappeared. lol

That said, another book by Lo? I might give it a try, if only for the chances of delicious crossovers with Red Hood and the Outlaws. :D
 

Ordo

Well-Known Member
#45
I can live with Red Robins visual design, same with Kid Flash, Wondergirl and even Superboy. Everyone else, not so much
 
#46
Vesvius said:
......................

The Green Lanterns. ARE THE GREEN LANTERNS GOING TO BE OKAY?!

They've apparently already fucked Batman, Teen Titans, and Deadman (who I was really hoping for a solo series for after Brightest Day). All they have to do is screw over the Lanterns and Booster and then all my favorites are trashed.

I'd worry they'd screw over Green Arrow too, but Cry for Justice already did that.
Booster is leading the new JLI. The Green Lanterns are going to have multiple series. Green Lanter is Hal. Green Lantern Corps is John and Guy. Green Lantern: New Guardians is Kyle. The last one is new, and it involves Kyle leading a team consisting of members of all the color corps. There's also a Red Lantern series coming out.
 

trevelyan1983

Well-Known Member
#47
Lord Raine said:
But hey. Assume Lord Raine doesn't know anything, and that your lack of detailed information on the subject is irrelevant. That's what all the cool kids do, amirite?
Well, I haven't read the legal journals either, but McFarlane trying to weasel out of paying to use stuff that other people made, even where it was under the auspices of his fagship title - and Gaiman refusing to take it like a bitch, don't make Gaiman look bad. Naive for working under a verbal contract, certainly, but not the bad guy.

So, yeah, I think you're passing comment where you lack the knowledge to do so. Sorry if that makes you mad.
 

cgobyd

Well-Known Member
#48
Here wait if Dick is Nightwing, Tim is Red Robin and Babara is Batgirl then does that mean Cassandra and Damian have to duke it out for the spot of Robin?
 

Meinos Kaen

Well-Known Member
#49
cgobyd said:
Here wait if Dick is Nightwing, Tim is Red Robin and Babara is Batgirl then does that mean Cassandra and Damian have to duke it out for the spot of Robin?
The new Dynamic duo is father/son. Damian is the new Robin. Already been announced.

That only leaves in the nothing Stephanie and Cassandra. Well, Stephanie started as Tim's sidekick as Spoiler, but I can't see that happening now that he's Teen Titans only. Cassandra started and died (comically) as Batgirl... Well, they both seem fucked. Maybe they could turn up in Barbara's title or one of the others... Don't know.
 
#50
Welp, after the disaster of yesterday (Titans and Liefeld) DC announced some good ones. OMAC, Grifter, Jonah Hex, Deathstroke, Sgt. Rock, etc...
 
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