Naruto What Really Happened on the Training Trip
- Thread starter Shirotsume
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Speaking personally my feeling is, 100% the opposite. Sparring is probably the highest utility use of Kage Bunshin there is....
Because, every weakness and opening you exploit, are your weaknesses and openings.
Combine it with a henge to have someone else's body size, and you could really amass a vast amount of battle training.
Actually, since Kage Bunshin are cheap, you can just fight to the death, so it wouldn't be just training, but live battle experience.
Because, every weakness and opening you exploit, are your weaknesses and openings.
Combine it with a henge to have someone else's body size, and you could really amass a vast amount of battle training.
Actually, since Kage Bunshin are cheap, you can just fight to the death, so it wouldn't be just training, but live battle experience.
Wrong, Pre-time skip Naruto only went ragefox when he was murderously angry or near death. Even then, he manifested only the tailles cloak and slowly worked his way up. Post-time skip Naruto, however, got worse with each rampage, getting the same number of tails he finished the previous one right from the start, his clones were manifesting three tails instantly during the elemental training.
Yes, because going against someone who have a similar fighting style to yours while you can't be hit is stupid. Because training how to fight while outnumbered and/or together with people who share the same mindset (literaly, even) as you is stupid.
Yeah, no.
Yes, because going against someone who have a similar fighting style to yours while you can't be hit is stupid. Because training how to fight while outnumbered and/or together with people who share the same mindset (literaly, even) as you is stupid.
Yeah, no.
You... don't actually know what a wing chun dummy is for, do you? It's so you get the correct involuntary feedback from your strikes, to practice absorbing the third law's force. A Kata is to ingrain certain motions into muscle memory- also other things, like balance, meditation, centering yourself.
Sparring for training is very much unlike sparring in exhibition. In educational sparring, there is a student, and a teacher. Playing both student and teacher would require you to know what needs to be taught- meaning you wouldn't need to learn it.
Minus, if you want to make shit up, then go write your own story.
Moving on, you've all killed any desire I have to write for a good long while, so just let the topic die. Maybe at some point I'll work on my stories and ideas. Probably not here, though.
Sparring for training is very much unlike sparring in exhibition. In educational sparring, there is a student, and a teacher. Playing both student and teacher would require you to know what needs to be taught- meaning you wouldn't need to learn it.
Minus, if you want to make shit up, then go write your own story.
Moving on, you've all killed any desire I have to write for a good long while, so just let the topic die. Maybe at some point I'll work on my stories and ideas. Probably not here, though.
And that's not what they are talking about, you are talking about "learning" ... they are talking about living through it. Simple battle experience. But a shitload of it.
By simple experience you can _correct_ all your flaws. Like ... fill your gaps. Learn to always keep your enemy in front of you, keep your guard up at all times, never jump, block offensively to break bones, use environment and don't forget it but don't overfocus on it. Every little detail like that that a training instructor maybe can say to you, but that you will never really learn unless you fight, and fight, and fight and ...
By simple experience you can _correct_ all your flaws. Like ... fill your gaps. Learn to always keep your enemy in front of you, keep your guard up at all times, never jump, block offensively to break bones, use environment and don't forget it but don't overfocus on it. Every little detail like that that a training instructor maybe can say to you, but that you will never really learn unless you fight, and fight, and fight and ...
So this whole thread boils down to:
Naruto didn't learn shit from any teacher until he was in desperate need of it later on the exact same arc.
We've seen what happened during the training trip. Jiraiya perved. Naruto had to use SnJ to even get his attention while they traveled. Which fits because that is what he had to do to even get Jiraiya's attention in the first place.
In all likelihood, every team 7 had a shitty teacher when it came to outright teaching things. Instead, they taught Konoha philosophy and set their students on a path to 'greatness'. Which makes sense, considering that most of the students don't really use any techniques that their teachers do. The Sannin don't use anything that Sarutobi was shown to use. Minato was only shown to use the same summons as Jiraiya. Naruto doesn't use any of Jiraiya's particular techniques, with the Rasengan being something made by his own father.
The same pattern can be seen with the rookie 9, who generally use their clan abilities. Lee being an exception since Gai is apparently the closest thing to a father he has. As well as Sasuke who's style and signature jutsu was specifically crafted by Kakashi and Uchiha teachings.
Jiraiya in particular was working under the belief of some prophecy which may have also made things worse. He had 3 known periods as a teacher. His first group, he abandoned which indirectly led to the physical destruction of Konoha. His second group died, though one became Hokage. His last student he seemed to have dropped the ball on but gave the key to victory against the first group.
Naruto didn't learn shit from any teacher until he was in desperate need of it later on the exact same arc.
We've seen what happened during the training trip. Jiraiya perved. Naruto had to use SnJ to even get his attention while they traveled. Which fits because that is what he had to do to even get Jiraiya's attention in the first place.
In all likelihood, every team 7 had a shitty teacher when it came to outright teaching things. Instead, they taught Konoha philosophy and set their students on a path to 'greatness'. Which makes sense, considering that most of the students don't really use any techniques that their teachers do. The Sannin don't use anything that Sarutobi was shown to use. Minato was only shown to use the same summons as Jiraiya. Naruto doesn't use any of Jiraiya's particular techniques, with the Rasengan being something made by his own father.
The same pattern can be seen with the rookie 9, who generally use their clan abilities. Lee being an exception since Gai is apparently the closest thing to a father he has. As well as Sasuke who's style and signature jutsu was specifically crafted by Kakashi and Uchiha teachings.
Jiraiya in particular was working under the belief of some prophecy which may have also made things worse. He had 3 known periods as a teacher. His first group, he abandoned which indirectly led to the physical destruction of Konoha. His second group died, though one became Hokage. His last student he seemed to have dropped the ball on but gave the key to victory against the first group.
And he didn't abandon them, he left when they were strong enough to survive on their own.
I mean, what did you expect him to do? They wouldn't go back to Konoha with him, and he couldn't very well stay and help overthrow a foreign government without causing a massive political shitstorm for Konoha.
By all indications, they were good, kind, noble kids who above all wanted to protect their home, save innocent people and fix their broken country, and they had the power and charisma to do it. There's no way Jiraiya could have possibly known Yahiko would be killed and it would scar Nagato and Conan enough to make them abandon all their previous convictions and turn into the very tyranical monster they'd overthrown.
I mean, what did you expect him to do? They wouldn't go back to Konoha with him, and he couldn't very well stay and help overthrow a foreign government without causing a massive political shitstorm for Konoha.
By all indications, they were good, kind, noble kids who above all wanted to protect their home, save innocent people and fix their broken country, and they had the power and charisma to do it. There's no way Jiraiya could have possibly known Yahiko would be killed and it would scar Nagato and Conan enough to make them abandon all their previous convictions and turn into the very tyranical monster they'd overthrown.
Borderline necro-ing this thread, but I decided that it'd be all-right as it's in the ideas section.
Naruto has been shown to utilise some fairly advanced fuinjutsu. He knew how to use the seal's key after receiving Gerotora, and he resealed Kurama after he separated it from it's chakra.
Oh, and there's still "that jutsu," if the characters who spoke of it weren't referring to the Torii seal.
So Jiraiya may have spent a good part of the time-skip filling in the gaps in Naruto's basics, improving his speed and Taijutsu, and teaching him a fair amount of Fuinjutsu.
Naruto has been shown to utilise some fairly advanced fuinjutsu. He knew how to use the seal's key after receiving Gerotora, and he resealed Kurama after he separated it from it's chakra.
Oh, and there's still "that jutsu," if the characters who spoke of it weren't referring to the Torii seal.
So Jiraiya may have spent a good part of the time-skip filling in the gaps in Naruto's basics, improving his speed and Taijutsu, and teaching him a fair amount of Fuinjutsu.