Mass Effect 3
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Uh, yeah... All of what you just said was explained in ME: Revelation. The guns in ME fire rounds smaller than a grain of sand at hyper accelerated speeds. However, the rounds are specially designed to shatter on contact, sending the energy to the target. Otherwise, they would just punch a micro sized hole through a target.
@Ordo: I just assumed that a Vanguard used biotics to create artificial gravity to propel themselves at high speeds. What is confirmed is that charge negates an enemies mass, so that they are knocked back, no matter how large.
@Ordo: I just assumed that a Vanguard used biotics to create artificial gravity to propel themselves at high speeds. What is confirmed is that charge negates an enemies mass, so that they are knocked back, no matter how large.
I read every bit of Codex in ME, and it's not there. It might be in the ME2 Codex, though. I haven't gotten around to reading that yet.
And I never read it and probably never will, so I don't really care. It's not in ME and I haven't run into it in ME2 yet, so it's a revelation for me.
I don't care a wit for The Book: The Movie: The Game of any series either, so I don't really care. For instance, I cheerfully ignore all Halo novels, because those writers were paid good money to make the SPARTANs as badass as possible, continuity and common sense be damned. If you listen to the novels, a SPARTAN could beat an Ultramarine to death. I'm serious. There's shit in there like people dodging sustained minigun fire at point-blank range. You should read some of it sometime just for laughs. We're talking stuff that a Jedi Space Marine couldn't pull off.
It's considerably more complicated than that. Vanguards can also phase through solid objects while Charging. That's part of the fluff, and not a game mechanic. Vanguards can officially, canonically, charge through cover, obstacles, walls, and other people like the Ghost of Christmas Fuck You to deliver a headbutt like a freight train that is also a lightning bolt and a professional boxer.
I consider that a game mechanic, as it makes no sense for a single point of armor to stop a biotic wrecking ball from throwing you back twenty feet. The shield I'm willing to accept, seeing how shields in Mass Effect are designed to absorb and dissipate kinetic energy. As long as there's shield left, it makes sense for Charge to not throw someone. But armor? Yeah, that shouldn't stop Charge for shit.
And I never read it and probably never will, so I don't really care. It's not in ME and I haven't run into it in ME2 yet, so it's a revelation for me.
I don't care a wit for The Book: The Movie: The Game of any series either, so I don't really care. For instance, I cheerfully ignore all Halo novels, because those writers were paid good money to make the SPARTANs as badass as possible, continuity and common sense be damned. If you listen to the novels, a SPARTAN could beat an Ultramarine to death. I'm serious. There's shit in there like people dodging sustained minigun fire at point-blank range. You should read some of it sometime just for laughs. We're talking stuff that a Jedi Space Marine couldn't pull off.
It's considerably more complicated than that. Vanguards can also phase through solid objects while Charging. That's part of the fluff, and not a game mechanic. Vanguards can officially, canonically, charge through cover, obstacles, walls, and other people like the Ghost of Christmas Fuck You to deliver a headbutt like a freight train that is also a lightning bolt and a professional boxer.
I consider that a game mechanic, as it makes no sense for a single point of armor to stop a biotic wrecking ball from throwing you back twenty feet. The shield I'm willing to accept, seeing how shields in Mass Effect are designed to absorb and dissipate kinetic energy. As long as there's shield left, it makes sense for Charge to not throw someone. But armor? Yeah, that shouldn't stop Charge for shit.
The part I do not understand is the limited ammo in the form of the heat dissipation things. It really really sucks as an explanation because unless the heat dissipation system is removed completely, it should still occur allowing the weapon to fire eventually. With the heat sinks removed and replaced only in the event when additional firepower is needed at the moment.
Bah.
Bah.
Armor protects you against all biotics. The only ones that will affect enemies with armor are the ones specifically designed to take down armor, like Warp. I feel supremely confident in classifying this as a game mechanic. Part of the mission statement for ME2 was to make biotics less-broken than they were in Mass Effect, where Lift and Singularity alone turned vicious firefights into hilarious carnivals of ass-beating. Badass enemies get ground up in a blender of gravity, and dangerous mooks with lethal weapons suddenly become drifting pinatas just waiting to be filled full of holes. You could damn near solo the game as an Adapt.
I see armor as an addition purely for game-balancing purposes. Especially seeing how even things that wear no clothes are armored in Insanity. Mercs? Criminals? Geth? Okay, yeah, I can buy them all having armor. Vorcha, who run around completely naked except for a bandoleer? Varren, who are wild fucking animals? Yeah. Not so much.
I see armor as an addition purely for game-balancing purposes. Especially seeing how even things that wear no clothes are armored in Insanity. Mercs? Criminals? Geth? Okay, yeah, I can buy them all having armor. Vorcha, who run around completely naked except for a bandoleer? Varren, who are wild fucking animals? Yeah. Not so much.
My best guess about the armor thing is that Armor in ME2 is designed to absorb kinetics too. Seeing as it's such a big deal in that universe, it makes sense.
Actually, they probably just have ME generators in the armor upping the mass of it whenever sufficiently large acceleration takes place, or sensors pop off or something.
Would explain why concussive blast doesn't work against armor too, and might explain why it works against barriers (since they aren't anti kinetics, as much as armor seems to be anyways)
Actually, they probably just have ME generators in the armor upping the mass of it whenever sufficiently large acceleration takes place, or sensors pop off or something.
Would explain why concussive blast doesn't work against armor too, and might explain why it works against barriers (since they aren't anti kinetics, as much as armor seems to be anyways)
I look at it this way, for example the mattock has 16 shots before overheating and needs a change of sinks, because it fires its projectile at a much greater velocity and/or it fires a bigger grain of metal compare to the rest of the guns, that causes the gun to overheat faster thus only capable of generating 16 shots per sink.
It can't really be like that, though, because the Relays keep 'tunnels' of low-mass 'clean' of debris and obstruction between each-other, which is half the reason the Relay system works. If it worked like a Relay, then the Vanguard would vaporize and/or push away everything in their immediate path, as opposed to just ghosting through it.
From the codex and the wiki, it said that relays 'theoretically' create mass-less corridors for instantaneous ( or near instantaneous) travel. Nothing about debris. Meaning that a ship goes from point A to Point B because they're going threw a wormhole. Debris doesn't matter because you're in a sub-reality so to speak. Before a ship can relay jump, a pilot must give the relay it mass and where it wants to go- so the relay can do it's job.
Vanguards probably do the same thing- lock on to a target, take their own mass into account, than create a corridor free of any mass for instantaneous impact. So it's a combination: Gravity to propel them at high speeds for kinetic impact, and the mass-less corridor for an instant, clean hit.
Vanguards probably do the same thing- lock on to a target, take their own mass into account, than create a corridor free of any mass for instantaneous impact. So it's a combination: Gravity to propel them at high speeds for kinetic impact, and the mass-less corridor for an instant, clean hit.
Mass Effect on ships create a sort of 'bubble' that allow them to achieve FTL- inside the bubble, the ships speed, the speed of light, etc., are raised. They still are part of the universe, as the ME bubble has fields to push away debris.
Relays are different in that they subvert time and space completely by creating a hole through reality for instantaneous movement. For a relay, debris doesn't matter, you're in a sub-reality.
Thats part of the reason no one knows how relays work: the races of ME can create a partial effect of this (FTL) in that they can ignore the rules of the universe in terms of speed, but not things like solid objects in the way.
Debris matters for FTL, not Relays.
Relays are different in that they subvert time and space completely by creating a hole through reality for instantaneous movement. For a relay, debris doesn't matter, you're in a sub-reality.
Thats part of the reason no one knows how relays work: the races of ME can create a partial effect of this (FTL) in that they can ignore the rules of the universe in terms of speed, but not things like solid objects in the way.
Debris matters for FTL, not Relays.
The Geth used their battle data to determine that those most tended towards victory were those who fired the most shots in any given conflict. There was a direct, strong correlation between shots fired and success. With this in mind, they redesigned all of their weapons away from the standard galactic idea of passive cooling systems and venting, and towards a new kind of design that used active, disposable heat sinks. Their reasoning was that the passive cooling systems forced you to slow your rate of fire in order to properly vent the heat, whereas actively sinking the heat in disposable cartridges allows you to fire as fast as the gun physically can, with only the occasional extremely short pause where you switch out heat sinks.
And it worked. It worked so well, in fact, that the entire galaxy shamelessly cribbed the design from the Geth.
No. There's no wormhole involved, and I demand citation stating there is.
Also, you just defeated your own point. If they can't replicate it, then how the fuck are the L5 implants doing it?
And it worked. It worked so well, in fact, that the entire galaxy shamelessly cribbed the design from the Geth.
No. There's no wormhole involved, and I demand citation stating there is.
Also, you just defeated your own point. If they can't replicate it, then how the fuck are the L5 implants doing it?
On the ME novel thing, the author of the novels is the same person who writes the story of the game. Also the same person who worked on Kotor and Jade Empire I believe. So the lore is actually more coherent in this case.
Edit: In the case of the Halo novels, yes they were just cashing in on the franchise. They're also part of the reason I hate everything about Halo. With Mass Effect and Bioware games in general, they usually have an Author actually writing for the game and the extended media.
To be more specific, the author of the novels was the lead writer in ME1 and still a writer for ME2 though not listed as lead. The comics are written by the lead writer of ME2.
Edit: In the case of the Halo novels, yes they were just cashing in on the franchise. They're also part of the reason I hate everything about Halo. With Mass Effect and Bioware games in general, they usually have an Author actually writing for the game and the extended media.
To be more specific, the author of the novels was the lead writer in ME1 and still a writer for ME2 though not listed as lead. The comics are written by the lead writer of ME2.
And promptly ignored in Halo: Reach. 
Edit: In the game the Covenant are found by a team of SPARTANS on Reach then the attack began. In the book the Covenant cruised in with a fucking massive fleet and got into a crazy battle in orbit. They were only fought off because of the orbital defenses and they managed suicided some ships to drop ground forces to destroy the defense ground side power stations.
Edit: In the game the Covenant are found by a team of SPARTANS on Reach then the attack began. In the book the Covenant cruised in with a fucking massive fleet and got into a crazy battle in orbit. They were only fought off because of the orbital defenses and they managed suicided some ships to drop ground forces to destroy the defense ground side power stations.
Yeah, I did an an edit to the previous post after your last post... but look at it this way. The writer for most of the Halo novels isn't listed as writing for any of the games. He's actually listed as a writer for the first Gears of War game which sets really low standards for the quality of his work.
As for Reach retcons... well its not like the Spartans really had a good showing in that game. The entire game was like an interactive snuff film for Spartans where they were being killed by any thing possible. Out of Noble Squad, Kat got it the worst since she didn't even get a badass moment to die to.
Duke Nukem would've saved Reach by himself and gotten laid several times during the adventure.
As for Reach retcons... well its not like the Spartans really had a good showing in that game. The entire game was like an interactive snuff film for Spartans where they were being killed by any thing possible. Out of Noble Squad, Kat got it the worst since she didn't even get a badass moment to die to.
Duke Nukem would've saved Reach by himself and gotten laid several times during the adventure.
I am using wormhole as an example of what is happening. The mass-free corridor is ME's version of the wormhole. Two relays activate at the same time, and a ship appears between them instantly via mass-less corridor.
Also, the reason relays are beyond current science is partly because the Council (mostly the Asari, as told by our favorite Matriarch) refuse to study them. Kind of understandable, given how important they are to galactic society, economics, etc. This was also stated as of twenty years before 2185.
Th L5 implant is cutting edge tech. We know that given time and study, lesser species than the Reapers can create relays (Protheans). It could be that recent study allowed humans (and Asari, given Tela Vasir) to replicate what relays do on a small scale, using their own bodies. That doesn't mean that they are able to do such a thing large scale.
For instance, recent DLC reveals that relays have by far the most powerful mass effect engines in the galaxy. Exponentially more powerful than the Normandy's core, which cost several dozen- if not hundreds- of billions of credits to develop. Also required is taking into account being able to transport various objects of varying mass and size. Vanguards only have to take their own mass into account- relays have a near infinite amount of variables to take into account. So it's still beyond what ME races are capable of as of today.
They can't replicate relays perfectly, but it would appear they can do it small scale using biotics.
Also, the reason relays are beyond current science is partly because the Council (mostly the Asari, as told by our favorite Matriarch) refuse to study them. Kind of understandable, given how important they are to galactic society, economics, etc. This was also stated as of twenty years before 2185.
Th L5 implant is cutting edge tech. We know that given time and study, lesser species than the Reapers can create relays (Protheans). It could be that recent study allowed humans (and Asari, given Tela Vasir) to replicate what relays do on a small scale, using their own bodies. That doesn't mean that they are able to do such a thing large scale.
For instance, recent DLC reveals that relays have by far the most powerful mass effect engines in the galaxy. Exponentially more powerful than the Normandy's core, which cost several dozen- if not hundreds- of billions of credits to develop. Also required is taking into account being able to transport various objects of varying mass and size. Vanguards only have to take their own mass into account- relays have a near infinite amount of variables to take into account. So it's still beyond what ME races are capable of as of today.
They can't replicate relays perfectly, but it would appear they can do it small scale using biotics.
It took the Protheans centuries of frenzied study specifically on that subject to even begin to replicate the Relays. No way in fuck am I buying that some random asshole managed to pull it off with a freaking amp.
Whether by accident or on purpose, it would have been mentioned in the Codex if they had managed to even partially replicate a Relay. It's not mentioned anywhere. So no, that's not how it works, and no, that's not what they did. I'm sorry, but as it stands, your argument is basically "Vanguards move in straight lines and so do Mass Relays, so they must be using the same principle."
Whether by accident or on purpose, it would have been mentioned in the Codex if they had managed to even partially replicate a Relay. It's not mentioned anywhere. So no, that's not how it works, and no, that's not what they did. I'm sorry, but as it stands, your argument is basically "Vanguards move in straight lines and so do Mass Relays, so they must be using the same principle."
I said that they could replicate it on a very small scale.
The Protheans didn't take centuries, they where just in cryo-stasis during the Reaper invasion. We don't know how long it took them. Also, they came a lot farther than we did-they moved something over a much greater distance, all the while using a outside power source. We don't know what gives the relays their perpetual immense power, but the Protheans did it on a smaller scale.
Humans can do it- over very short disatnces, using their own biotics to power it. Also, Relays are stated to be Omnidirectional, while a Vanguard can only move forward.
What I'm saying is that Charge is a very early, bastardized form of a relay jump. Same idea, just on a much smaller scale.
The Protheans didn't take centuries, they where just in cryo-stasis during the Reaper invasion. We don't know how long it took them. Also, they came a lot farther than we did-they moved something over a much greater distance, all the while using a outside power source. We don't know what gives the relays their perpetual immense power, but the Protheans did it on a smaller scale.
Humans can do it- over very short disatnces, using their own biotics to power it. Also, Relays are stated to be Omnidirectional, while a Vanguard can only move forward.
What I'm saying is that Charge is a very early, bastardized form of a relay jump. Same idea, just on a much smaller scale.
Wrong. Vigil told us. They were in stasis for centuries, and then after they woke up, it took them centuries MORE to figure out the damn thing. And do note that they were already working on replicating the Relays when the Reapers showed up, so it's not like they were starting from scratch, either. They had a significant amount of knowledge and research already to work with.
I'm not arguing this with you anymore. You don't seem to have any actual evidence, just a lot of conjecture. And I don't really care much about conjecture. There is zero evidence that it's even the same sort of process, and your own knowledge of how the Relays function is suspect anyway. I've scoured the Codex, and seen nothing that even suggests that wormholes are involved. Until you can start citing things to back up your conjecture, it's not any more valid than random guessing.
I'm not arguing this with you anymore. You don't seem to have any actual evidence, just a lot of conjecture. And I don't really care much about conjecture. There is zero evidence that it's even the same sort of process, and your own knowledge of how the Relays function is suspect anyway. I've scoured the Codex, and seen nothing that even suggests that wormholes are involved. Until you can start citing things to back up your conjecture, it's not any more valid than random guessing.
Where does Vrigil say it took centuries of study? It just said that the Reaper extermination of the Protheans took centuries. There is no definite stated time afterwards. We don't know how long the relay project took. Besides, even if it where decades, they got a lot farther than what humans have now.
You keep taking wormholes in the literal sense. I'm using them as a reference- to explain what is going on in layman's terms. Relay A and relay B power up at the same time and a ship jumps from one to the other instantly, using a mass-less corridor of time-space (this is from the codex).
Given that a Vanguard moves to point A to point B instantly (you even see time dilation when you come out), moves through objects using Dark Energy propulsion, its easy to see a connection, especially when no explanation of Charge is given.
You keep taking wormholes in the literal sense. I'm using them as a reference- to explain what is going on in layman's terms. Relay A and relay B power up at the same time and a ship jumps from one to the other instantly, using a mass-less corridor of time-space (this is from the codex).
Given that a Vanguard moves to point A to point B instantly (you even see time dilation when you come out), moves through objects using Dark Energy propulsion, its easy to see a connection, especially when no explanation of Charge is given.