What do you think of the Dark Icon Writers?
- Thread starter GenocideHeart
- Start date
As runestar said, chill.
You should look up the word 'pretentious', nowhere in this topic did anyone say that DIW or Phoenix Soul thought themselves to be all high and mighty. The point is, from what I can see, is that it falls flat of its supposed purpose. Apparently (I can't say for myself, since I've never read anything by a member of DIW or PS), the fanfiction is usually low quality, not because of ideas but because of poor execution, and that leaves a feeling of pretentiousness.
I realize you feel like you're being insulted, (and maybe you are, I don't presume to know the feelings of the board members here) but from what I can see, that wasn't the intention, so don't get so defensive.
You should look up the word 'pretentious', nowhere in this topic did anyone say that DIW or Phoenix Soul thought themselves to be all high and mighty. The point is, from what I can see, is that it falls flat of its supposed purpose. Apparently (I can't say for myself, since I've never read anything by a member of DIW or PS), the fanfiction is usually low quality, not because of ideas but because of poor execution, and that leaves a feeling of pretentiousness.
I realize you feel like you're being insulted, (and maybe you are, I don't presume to know the feelings of the board members here) but from what I can see, that wasn't the intention, so don't get so defensive.
To be completely fair, BZ, the ideas your group(s) had/have are novel enough. It's just the overall quality of them that's a bit on the low side.
Of course, whether or not the members of the DIW and PS are longtime writers plays a large part in the judgment.
If they are mostly newcomers to the fanfic scene, then it's understandable they are still rough around the edges - but if they are 'veterans', so to speak, then it becomes a lot harder to excuse. One tends to expect high quality from a longtime writer, and if that quality fails to be delivered, it usually leads to harsh judgment. That is probably wy the name 'Dark Icon Writers' feels rather pretentious to most - the fics published by authors under that name aren't bad per se, but they need a whole lot more polishing before they are anywhere worthy of such a grandiose-sounding name.
See what I'm talking about?
Anyway, peace.
Of course, whether or not the members of the DIW and PS are longtime writers plays a large part in the judgment.
If they are mostly newcomers to the fanfic scene, then it's understandable they are still rough around the edges - but if they are 'veterans', so to speak, then it becomes a lot harder to excuse. One tends to expect high quality from a longtime writer, and if that quality fails to be delivered, it usually leads to harsh judgment. That is probably wy the name 'Dark Icon Writers' feels rather pretentious to most - the fics published by authors under that name aren't bad per se, but they need a whole lot more polishing before they are anywhere worthy of such a grandiose-sounding name.
See what I'm talking about?
Anyway, peace.
Despite being from the Phoenix Souls, I'll play a neutral party.
I must admit, a large majority of the work submitted by our party is rather lackluster. But as you've stated, many ARE in fact new to the FF community at large, and their skills are rather undeveloped.
Most of us who actually have some experience, have recently been infected with a common virus known as Real Life, and are unable to produce a whole lot, if not anything, to the viewing of others.
At the same time, we didn't really need to bring this thread back up, as this happened many months ago, and is rather old news.
PLEASE let this thread die.
-Da Plague
I must admit, a large majority of the work submitted by our party is rather lackluster. But as you've stated, many ARE in fact new to the FF community at large, and their skills are rather undeveloped.
Most of us who actually have some experience, have recently been infected with a common virus known as Real Life, and are unable to produce a whole lot, if not anything, to the viewing of others.
At the same time, we didn't really need to bring this thread back up, as this happened many months ago, and is rather old news.
PLEASE let this thread die.
-Da Plague
I had just joined the BZ fanfiction studio out of curiosity but I had no idea it was the Phoenix Souls' new headquarters. Wait, is it? Nice forum though. And I was quite surprised to finally find BigFics again. He sort of dissapeared for a bit.
I've read a few Dark Icon and Phoenix Soul fics, though I can't remember the titles anymore. I do remember that they often do SI fics and that they sometimes insert other members of their group in. Some of the comedies they made were really well done and there was one LH/HP fic I found quite interesting.
As for quality...well....I'll let my fellow TFF members judge that. I'm not good enough a fanfic writer to even start judging my own fic properly, let alone judging others'. But since you're a league of writers, you could at least proofread each other's fics, right? Grammar and typos alone are enough to ruin a well planned-out fic.
Me and my siblings almost formed our own league of writers, hahaha. We're all (less than) mediocre writers anyway, so there wasn't much of a point Thanks to GH's advice, we saved ourselves the shame :lol:
Edit: Sorry for this post as I posted just a few seconds after your last post. I won't continue the thread if it irks you. Zeni.
Wait, is it? Nice forum though. And I was quite surprised to finally find BigFics again. He sort of dissapeared for a bit. I've read a few Dark Icon and Phoenix Soul fics, though I can't remember the titles anymore. I do remember that they often do SI fics and that they sometimes insert other members of their group in. Some of the comedies they made were really well done and there was one LH/HP fic I found quite interesting.
As for quality...well....I'll let my fellow TFF members judge that. I'm not good enough a fanfic writer to even start judging my own fic properly, let alone judging others'. But since you're a league of writers, you could at least proofread each other's fics, right? Grammar and typos alone are enough to ruin a well planned-out fic.
Me and my siblings almost formed our own league of writers, hahaha. We're all (less than) mediocre writers anyway, so there wasn't much of a point
Thanks to GH's advice, we saved ourselves the shame :lol:Edit: Sorry for this post as I posted just a few seconds after your last post. I won't continue the thread if it irks you. Zeni.
My personal suggestion is to get a proofreader from OUTSIDE the group, possibly a big name who is known for high quality in their writing like Hawker, Random or heck, even Hawk.
I realize that getting a big name to actually proofread for you is a feat in itself, but it's worth the hassle. Without Random proofing my own lemon fic, it'd probably have been a huge stinker and I'd have forever been marked in infamy. :lol:
That said, as long as it's just lack of experience, I'm more than fine with it. We all were newbies at one point.
That is all.
And Zeni, making a group itself is not BAD per se, in fact it can be very useful as a pool of ideas. It's making a group and then letting it go to your head that's bad. That's why it's almost always best to work alone...
I realize that getting a big name to actually proofread for you is a feat in itself, but it's worth the hassle. Without Random proofing my own lemon fic, it'd probably have been a huge stinker and I'd have forever been marked in infamy. :lol:
That said, as long as it's just lack of experience, I'm more than fine with it. We all were newbies at one point.
That is all.
And Zeni, making a group itself is not BAD per se, in fact it can be very useful as a pool of ideas. It's making a group and then letting it go to your head that's bad. That's why it's almost always best to work alone...
Wow. Been a while since I've seen this thread. :unsure!:
And first, I wasn't trying to insult you personally BZ. I was talking about the group in general (which, if you took that personally since you founded the group, I apologize). The reason why I made that comment was, IMO, the quality of the fics that came from either group, weren't exactly of the highest standard here.\
And I have read fics that came from both groups. And... again, I felt they weren't exactly of the highest quality in which these two groups were founded to 'fix'.
NOT saying that these groups didn't start with good ideas. After all, everyone who actively seeks help to improve their writing, should get it. But as it stands, both groups still have a long way to go from the fics I have read.
And first, I wasn't trying to insult you personally BZ. I was talking about the group in general (which, if you took that personally since you founded the group, I apologize). The reason why I made that comment was, IMO, the quality of the fics that came from either group, weren't exactly of the highest standard here.\
And I have read fics that came from both groups. And... again, I felt they weren't exactly of the highest quality in which these two groups were founded to 'fix'.
NOT saying that these groups didn't start with good ideas. After all, everyone who actively seeks help to improve their writing, should get it. But as it stands, both groups still have a long way to go from the fics I have read.
Forgive me for posting again, Dark Plague. Oh, and I just noticed you're new here, so a very warm welcome to you.
I was wondering though, how come TFF doesn't have a welcome thread? Or...I may have missed it on my way in *shrugs*.
I wasn't implying that making a group is bad. I was just saying that making a group of really crappy writers (i.e. the group we were going to start) beats the purpose Besides, it's inevitable that we'd let the group go to our heads, being the n00bs we are :snigger:
I was wondering though, how come TFF doesn't have a welcome thread? Or...I may have missed it on my way in *shrugs*.
I wasn't implying that making a group is bad. I was just saying that making a group of really crappy writers (i.e. the group we were going to start) beats the purpose
Besides, it's inevitable that we'd let the group go to our heads, being the n00bs we are :snigger:it's cool as it was more of not wanting people going around saying things that weren't true and I felt it necessary to clear up a few things. that's all.
though I am surrpised that such talk would end up here as I always wonder if my advertising of the group and the forum was doing any good but it seems it is working.
well it is the headquarters of the group but it goes far beyond that as it was originally built as a place where writers can post their work and get reviews and not get flamed as many have had their fair share of flames. and to talk with other writers about anything that one wished to talk about which is what TFF is or at least I think it is about.
unlike ff.net I like to think that flamers shoudl get punished for their flames( responses meant to hurt people and not help in any way is what I am referring to) not like I had any of them as those sorts tend to stay away I guess.
the group was designed to help out other writers and not be a group that gets all of the best in which to talk about how they great they are as such a group isn't needed so yeah much of our group may not be the best but at least I could say they are making an attempt to become better writers which was the whole purpose of the group.
as for the DIW well turns out there was another person who claimed ownership of the name and this person did threaten some of the members of the DIW. I am not quite so sure if the name can be used by dimitri plabato anymore without getting into trouble with this person.
but yeah this is OLD news and no big deal to me anymore as it used to be back when this was still going on.
though I am surrpised that such talk would end up here as I always wonder if my advertising of the group and the forum was doing any good but it seems it is working.
well it is the headquarters of the group but it goes far beyond that as it was originally built as a place where writers can post their work and get reviews and not get flamed as many have had their fair share of flames. and to talk with other writers about anything that one wished to talk about which is what TFF is or at least I think it is about.
unlike ff.net I like to think that flamers shoudl get punished for their flames( responses meant to hurt people and not help in any way is what I am referring to) not like I had any of them as those sorts tend to stay away I guess.
the group was designed to help out other writers and not be a group that gets all of the best in which to talk about how they great they are as such a group isn't needed so yeah much of our group may not be the best but at least I could say they are making an attempt to become better writers which was the whole purpose of the group.
as for the DIW well turns out there was another person who claimed ownership of the name and this person did threaten some of the members of the DIW. I am not quite so sure if the name can be used by dimitri plabato anymore without getting into trouble with this person.
but yeah this is OLD news and no big deal to me anymore as it used to be back when this was still going on.
For the most part I agree with you on this, but I also think that there are some fics that DESERVE to be flamed, due to them being so incredibly shitty and useless, they are nothing but a zit on the backside of the Internet.
Case in point:
http://www.fanfiction.net/s/1017864/1/ (WARNING: Can make you sick from excessive shittiness)
You can't read this 'fic' (and I use the word very loosely) and tell me it doesn't deserve a good flaming. There's literally nothing to save in it - it's just crap, and why it hasn't been removed for its violence upon the English language is beyond me.
Case in point:
http://www.fanfiction.net/s/1017864/1/ (WARNING: Can make you sick from excessive shittiness)
You can't read this 'fic' (and I use the word very loosely) and tell me it doesn't deserve a good flaming. There's literally nothing to save in it - it's just crap, and why it hasn't been removed for its violence upon the English language is beyond me.
For a minute there, I thought it was one of those "Stretches the page to be 20 times longer than it should be Fics".. Still, just looking at that was a painful experience. :blink:
I believe! That anyone wishing to join FFnet must take a language efficiency course for the region that they wish to write for!
I believe! That anyone wishing to join FFnet must take a language efficiency course for the region that they wish to write for!
For the record, that one isn't half as bad as some of the stuff I found linked in the 'horrors of fiction' thread in GH's rants section.
Those Yu Gi Oh yaoi fics....man, they still give me the shivers....the fact that later on we found out that it was actually a 15 year old guy passing himself off as a 12 year old girl didn't help either. I'm amazed he hasn't been banned. Believe it or not, that fic is STILL on FF.net, while some of the best fics of all time (ok, they did contain R material, but still THE BEST) got taken off at the drop of a hat. Where's the justice in that?
Those Yu Gi Oh yaoi fics....man, they still give me the shivers....the fact that later on we found out that it was actually a 15 year old guy passing himself off as a 12 year old girl didn't help either. I'm amazed he hasn't been banned. Believe it or not, that fic is STILL on FF.net, while some of the best fics of all time (ok, they did contain R material, but still THE BEST) got taken off at the drop of a hat. Where's the justice in that?
Basically, FFN has some crappy mods. My guess? They only go to certain fandoms and mod them. Those that are just plain huge, like the Naruto fandom, they simply give up.
Of course, there is also the possibility that they are all yaoi fanboys/girls. I know typically they are fangirls. But some guys... <_<
Of course, there is also the possibility that they are all yaoi fanboys/girls. I know typically they are fangirls. But some guys... <_<
I would probably just ignore it as it is apparent to me that they just want attention and what better way to get attention then to write some sort of shit like that and post it on ff.net
if you ignore them maybe they will go away to some other place to post their garbage.
There should be a SPAF button that you can press when reporting a fic.
what does SPAF stand for?
Stupid
Pointlles
Aggravating
Fic
or for thsoe who do it all time there is the SIAW button.
which stands for
Stupid
Ignorant
Annoying
Writers
But sadly FF.net has a high standing policy that in no way shoudl trash ever get removed from their site as then it might increase the quality of the site which is firmly against their rules and is a no no over there. lol
it's our job as decent writers and readers to flush out the trash and promote the works of good writers or those who are trying to become good writers.
if you ignore them maybe they will go away to some other place to post their garbage.
There should be a SPAF button that you can press when reporting a fic.
what does SPAF stand for?
Stupid
Pointlles
Aggravating
Fic
or for thsoe who do it all time there is the SIAW button.
which stands for
Stupid
Ignorant
Annoying
Writers
But sadly FF.net has a high standing policy that in no way shoudl trash ever get removed from their site as then it might increase the quality of the site which is firmly against their rules and is a no no over there. lol
it's our job as decent writers and readers to flush out the trash and promote the works of good writers or those who are trying to become good writers.
Huh!
Harsh words were written here...
And I read all postings...some of the members do seemed to be a bit High and Mighty on the postings...sorry, just expressing my opinion over what was written.
Indeed criticizing anything without knowing it in full may be problematic at best.
I do remember reading stories from DIW which were very good, and we have on Phoenix Souls very good authors as well.
Ah, of course we are not perfect (alas, my own case...far from perfection, and by choosing a languange not my own I added a lot to the difficulty...) but I feel the overall production is very good, even though updates may be not that frequent on my MOVING FORWARD (Well, I am not one to critisize delays on updates, as my last update took over 5 months...)
Well, I am no critic nor a professional writer (I read some postings here which made me think some are already pros...) so I tend to avoid critisizing too much. I just express my opinion as a reader when reviewing
By the way I do like SimmyC's and Hawk's work, just for the note.
Humm, I hope Phoenix Souls may be seen in a better light in the future, and I do want to know you people more, if possible at all, for this very posting may put you all against me...
I just wanted to express my opinion, after reading the postings up to now.
As for flamings, I think no one deserves a flame...
I did my share once, and I am ashamed of such. From a long time now, if I dislike a story entirely I just keep myself far from it...and if I see a good concept but with poor execution I may try to give my opinion, if it is of any value. If we give enough attention to write a review it means we do care for the story or plot
My opinion though...
Well, my Greetings to all, and Best of Wishes ^_^
Harsh words were written here...
And I read all postings...some of the members do seemed to be a bit High and Mighty on the postings...sorry, just expressing my opinion over what was written.
Indeed criticizing anything without knowing it in full may be problematic at best.
I do remember reading stories from DIW which were very good, and we have on Phoenix Souls very good authors as well.
Ah, of course we are not perfect (alas, my own case...far from perfection, and by choosing a languange not my own I added a lot to the difficulty...) but I feel the overall production is very good, even though updates may be not that frequent on my MOVING FORWARD (Well, I am not one to critisize delays on updates, as my last update took over 5 months...)
Well, I am no critic nor a professional writer (I read some postings here which made me think some are already pros...) so I tend to avoid critisizing too much. I just express my opinion as a reader when reviewing
By the way I do like SimmyC's and Hawk's work, just for the note.
Humm, I hope Phoenix Souls may be seen in a better light in the future, and I do want to know you people more, if possible at all, for this very posting may put you all against me...
I just wanted to express my opinion, after reading the postings up to now.
As for flamings, I think no one deserves a flame...
I did my share once, and I am ashamed of such. From a long time now, if I dislike a story entirely I just keep myself far from it...and if I see a good concept but with poor execution I may try to give my opinion, if it is of any value. If we give enough attention to write a review it means we do care for the story or plot
My opinion though...
Well, my Greetings to all, and Best of Wishes ^_^
I got a huge laugh that people actually pass judgement on groups... lol
As long as they don't proclaim they're better than anyone, why is there even a reason for a thread like this? Cause their name makes them sound epical?
Who cares >_>
Passing judgement always brings bad blood and who really decides who is good or who is bad? The few elite or the mass.
Always the majority. :yay:
As long as they don't proclaim they're better than anyone, why is there even a reason for a thread like this? Cause their name makes them sound epical?
Who cares >_>
Passing judgement always brings bad blood and who really decides who is good or who is bad? The few elite or the mass.
Always the majority. :yay: