Marvel-verse/DC-verse+To Aru Majutsu

[leeyiankun]

I think we're all missing an important thing here. Touma will also be in DC, which means Batman.

Unless Childhood Trauma counts as Supernatural, Touma will come away from Gotham scared witless at the "No Vigilantism in my City' speech.

Yes, and we all know that Batman > GOD.

This has been proven time and time again, against HULK, Superman, Darkseid and the kitchen sink.

The only thng he needs to do is break the 4th wall. Wait, didn't he already do that? :blink:

Seriously, is there any famous comic character with a bigger plot armor than him? :hmm:

Lol, Batman puts Sasuke to shame? Ouch

Well, with the introduction of elseworlds. We saw that no matter what kind of God he takes on, Batman always wins. Sasuke has a long way to go before he can even come close to the level of the dark knight. :sisi:

That, and Sasuke gay-ness lowers his man points. While Bruce channels Kirk's Mojo all the time. So that's another win for him. :snigger:

 

[Aegis]

<a href='http://img718.imageshack.us/img718/9222/toarumajutsunoindex.jpg' target='_blank' rel='nofollow'>http://img718.imageshack.us/img718/9222/to...utsunoindex.jpg</a>

Also, I should probably say this, Index grew bewbies!

 

[trevelyan1983]

Seriously, is there any famous comic character with a bigger plot armor than him? :hmm:

Ranma.

 

[Seed00]

Seriously, is there any famous comic character with a bigger plot armor than him?? :hmm:

Ranma.

I was hoping not to run into Ranma here, but I'm going for the bait:

Why Ranma?

 

[leeyiankun]

Seriously, is there any famous comic character with a bigger plot armor than him?á :hmm:

Ranma.

Huh? you mean Ranma actually faces Superman and WIN? :blink: :jawdrop:

 

[DhampyrX2]

I think we're all missing an important thing here. Touma will also be in DC, which means Batman.

Unless Childhood Trauma counts as Supernatural, Touma will come away from Gotham scared witless at the "No Vigilantism in my City' speech.

Yes, and we all know that Batman > GOD.

This has been proven time and time again, against HULK, Superman, Darkseid and the kitchen sink.

The only thng he needs to do is break the 4th wall. Wait, didn't he already do that? :blink:

Seriously, is there any famous comic character with a bigger plot armor than him? :hmm:

No. Because at the end of the day, Bruce is still human and is supposed to be what humanity can become when driven hard enough to ignore our own limitations. Anyone "given" powers can't compare because they don't have to do the same. Somewhere in the back of people's minds they like to think they could be like Batman if properly motivated. You can't be Superman unless you're Kryptonian to start off.

Well that, and he tends to outsmart many of the people far enough beyond him physically to matter. And frankly, being smarter than most super villans and superheroes isn't exactly hard.

 

[GenocideHeart]

He's got a human version of the ULTIMATE NULLIFIER, nuff' said.

What? No. Aside from how the Ultimate Nullifier is superior by default due to having a range greater than arm's reach (unless it's Reed Richards's arm), it's also been stated to be able to kill ETERNITY ITSELF if used properly - y'know, the incarnation of all that exists in the universe, up to and including different planes of existence such as Belasco's Limbo, Asgard and the Shadow King's Plane of Darkness among others?

Let's not uncontrollably wank Touma now. At most he's got Leech's power on crack, but from there to the Ultimate Nullifier, which instantly obliterates anything, be it a person, a thing or even a concept... yeah, Touma needs to take his vitamins - a few metric fucktons of them for a few centuries - before he can even be called a shitty version of the UN.

 

[Ryuugi]

I think we're all missing an important thing here. Touma will also be in DC, which means Batman.

Unless Childhood Trauma counts as Supernatural, Touma will come away from Gotham scared witless at the "No Vigilantism in my City' speech.

Yes, and we all know that Batman > GOD.

This has been proven time and time again, against HULK, Superman, Darkseid and the kitchen sink.

The only thng he needs to do is break the 4th wall. Wait, didn't he already do that? :blink:

Seriously, is there any famous comic character with a bigger plot armor than him? :hmm:

No. Because at the end of the day, Bruce is still human and is supposed to be what humanity can become when driven hard enough to ignore our own limitations. Anyone "given" powers can't compare because they don't have to do the same. Somewhere in the back of people's minds they like to think they could be like Batman if properly motivated. You can't be Superman unless you're Kryptonian to start off.

Well that, and he tends to outsmart many of the people far enough beyond him physically to matter. And frankly, being smarter than most super villans and superheroes isn't exactly hard.

Yeah, but you see, the thing is? None of that should matter inthe face of shit like 'I run trillions of times the speed of light, cause I'm the Motherfucking Flash', 'I vaporise you with my heat vision from the fucking moon, cause I'm Sperman', 'I crush you with a glowing green duck, bitch; Power Ring, fuck yeah', or, really, any of the usual Superpowers.

Not to mention most of these guys are supposed to be geniuses, too; the Flash probably forgets more thoughts per second then you'll ever ve in you entire life, for example.

And even if Batman had a hand plot devi-er, solution handy? It wouldn't matter. Gl may not even get to the speed of light while on Earth, but he doesn't need to, cause he can just go back in time and kill you. Superman can do that sometimes too, but doesn't need to; he can move at the speed of light.

The Flash, on the other hand, can go trillions times that. No, seriously, that one time when the comics where he saves a population of 532,000 from a nuclear explosion by carrying them one or two at a time to a hill 35 miles away and does this all in 0.00001 microseconds? That's faster then the speed of light. Thirteen trillion times, to be precise.

Those two? They could run off to lunch in France, check out the seven wonders of he World, stop crime (as in, all of it), go back in time, have sex with Batman's mom, come back to the future, snap Bruce's neck, and still do all of that before the message got from his brain to the rest of his body that it's time to start moving.

 

[DhampyrX2]

Sure, if you want logic, every powered human should be able to take down Batman. But, the books are written by unpowered humans and read by unpowered humans. At then end of the day we want the guy like us to prevail, even in our own mythology. That's the importance of his plot armor. He's the best because we want to be the best and we live through him vicariously.

And some Flashes, like Jay Garrick, were geniuses. Wally West and Impulse aren't exactly brain surgeons. Batman also has an unfair advantage over Wally in the form of his son being one of Wally's closest friends since his Kid Flash days. Bruce has more inside information on him and just about anyone.

You have to give Batman his due too. Going from a Marvel perspective, it's like putting someone like Reed Richards or Tony Stark in Captain America's body. Only Bruce got to that level himself without the super soldier formula. That's pretty damned impressive when you think about what any of those guys could do individually. So yeah, you can call Bullshit on his ability to plan ahead. You can also call Bullshit on people like Dr Doom or Lex Luthor being prepared and ready to do the impossible. that doesn't change the nature of the comics or the fact they still do it.

And I will point out that in his own titles Bruce has taken his licks. Up to and including Batman RIP where he only lived basically because Darkseid is a dick and thought it would be more fun to torture him by sending him through time rather than just killing him.

Frankly, if the fan-wankery was as bad as most like to bitch about, Bruce would have been the real source of the Black Lanterns and thrown off the mental conditioning of that state to save everybody and purify the energy. Instead it was a bad clone and he wasn't even there.

 

[trevelyan1983]

Seriously, is there any famous comic character with a bigger plot armor than him?á :hmm:

Ranma.

I was hoping not to run into Ranma here, but I'm going for the bait:

Why Ranma?

I'm just fucking with you. In a Takahashi series, everyone's got plot armor.

 

[Seed00]

Seriously, is there any famous comic character with a bigger plot armor than him?á :hmm:

Ranma.

I was hoping not to run into Ranma here, but I'm going for the bait:

Why Ranma?

I'm just fucking with you. In a Takahashi series, everyone's got plot armor.

Hehe

Good one.

 

[leeyiankun]

He's got a human version of the ULTIMATE NULLIFIER, nuff' said.

What? No. Aside from how the Ultimate Nullifier is superior by default due to having a range greater than arm's reach (unless it's Reed Richards's arm), it's also been stated to be able to kill ETERNITY ITSELF if used properly - y'know, the incarnation of all that exists in the universe, up to and including different planes of existence such as Belasco's Limbo, Asgard and the Shadow King's Plane of Darkness among others?

Let's not uncontrollably wank Touma now. At most he's got Leech's power on crack, but from there to the Ultimate Nullifier, which instantly obliterates anything, be it a person, a thing or even a concept... yeah, Touma needs to take his vitamins - a few metric fucktons of them for a few centuries - before he can even be called a shitty version of the UN.

Well, being the only super in the story of Gods, Angels, Espers, Magicians and Futuristic Tech, to be chained up and imprisoned. It is implied that his 'God/Demon' is supposed to be the baddest of them all.

And being a HUMAN version of the Ultimate Nullifier doesn't have to be all the original does, does it? Since you have to live with it for the rest of your life. Destroying yourself while using it is... STUPID. :huh.:

 

[Aegis]

He's got a human version of the ULTIMATE NULLIFIER, nuff' said.

What? No. Aside from how the Ultimate Nullifier is superior by default due to having a range greater than arm's reach (unless it's Reed Richards's arm), it's also been stated to be able to kill ETERNITY ITSELF if used properly - y'know, the incarnation of all that exists in the universe, up to and including different planes of existence such as Belasco's Limbo, Asgard and the Shadow King's Plane of Darkness among others?

Let's not uncontrollably wank Touma now. At most he's got Leech's power on crack, but from there to the Ultimate Nullifier, which instantly obliterates anything, be it a person, a thing or even a concept... yeah, Touma needs to take his vitamins - a few metric fucktons of them for a few centuries - before he can even be called a shitty version of the UN.

Well, being the only super in the story of Gods, Angels, Espers, Magicians and Futuristic Tech, to be chained up and imprisoned. It is implied that his 'God/Demon' is supposed to be the baddest of them all.

And being a HUMAN version of the Ultimate Nullifier doesn't have to be all the original does, does it? Since you have to live with it for the rest of your life. Destroying yourself while using it is... STUPID. :huh.:

the fact that his power Nullifies things without mercy, going so far as to nullify luck, which btw is also a concept, to me, puts Touma a step above a lot of nullifiers. It's even said that at his current state, Touma's nulling is weaker than it was back when he lived with his parents. I'll remind you that it nullified not just his own luck but the luck of each and every person around him enough so that his dad became obsessive compulsive with good luck charms(the cause behind fucking Angel Fall of all things, a lower end spell apparently) and finally be forced to resort to send him away to Academy City. Apparently from what I remember something happened in between that time to seal up Touma's full strenght. Since he himself can't remember squat, we will never know exactly what happened. Of course the Ultimate Nullifier can do much more because it's not stuck to HUMAN limitations. The only thing holding Touma's power back is most likely this fact, being human that is and nothing more.

 

[GenocideHeart]

The Ultimate Nullifier can do much more because it blatantly ignores any and all rules set in the multiverse. The one time it was fired at full power in canon (thankfully in another universe, not the 616 one) it outright wiped everything in that universe exceot itself out, caused a ripple that severely damaged two neighboring universes and forced the Living Tribunal to show up and run damage control, otherwise the shock from the UN's firing would have spread to all of creation.

That's NOT something supposed to happen unless you're using the Heart of the Universe, which is a direct conduit to The One Above All's power.

Speaking of that, by definition Touma's power won't work on anyone who has the Heart of the Universe, as that artifact makes the wielder functionally omnipotent. And I do mean omnipotent - for all intents and purposes, the one who wields the HotU is TOAA himself. When Thanos got ahold of it, he casually swatted everyone and everything, Living Tribunal included, aside like bugs.

 

[zeebee1]

The Ultimate Nullifier has the word ultimate in it for a reason.

 

[leeyiankun]

Speaking of that, by definition Touma's power won't work on anyone who has the Heart of the Universe , as that artifact makes the wielder functionally omnipotent.

And how can you prove that? For all intent and purpose, Touma's universe has a power called Dark Matter, that f*cks up the universe rules as its power. But even that will fall before the Imagine Breaker. And this isn't even the extent of his powers yet. There's room to grow, and powers to slap down.

The Ultimate Nulifier is written by Marvel, whose very own Sentry's power has been found to yo-yo across the board. And unlike a comic plot device, To Aru Majutsu no Index's is written by one writer, thus more consistent and more reliable.

That's not to say that I think that Imagine Breaker can top UN. Seriously, no. UN is a plot hax. IB is also one, but in the scale of To Aru? It is already overkill, to blow it up to UN power level is illogical. But in all intent and purpose, IB and UN serve in the same role, an artifact that can contain the most powerful being in the story/one that erase all power before it. Marvel universe is larger and more powerful critters.. beings inhabits it. UN power scale is needed to do that.

In To Aru Majutsu no Index, Imagine Breaker does its job adequately. And it's doing its job while containing Touma's unnamed prisoner to boot!

So, how will we know that IB in a marvel universe isn't a version of UN? It could be the same thing, or it could not. A human version might acted differently from a full UN. Once the sandbox size is taken into account, IB might or even cancel UN. Touma can be written as the only being who will survive a UN activation convincingly. Or he could just be erased like the rest of the Gods/Omnipotent Beings in Marvel, that is also realistic.

That's the trouble with plot hax, it is only as powerful as the current writer meant it to be. And with Joe Quesada's Norman Osborn rearranging Marvel's dinner table, I have less confidence in Marvel than To Aru's author.

The Ultimate Nullifier has the word ultimate in it for a reason.

Like in Ultimate Spider-Man? So, the reason is to make more money? :crazy:

 

[Aegis]

Speaking of that, by definition Touma's power won't work on anyone who has the Heart of the Universe , as that artifact makes the wielder functionally omnipotent.

And how can you prove that? For all intent and purpose, Touma's universe has a power called Dark Matter, that f*cks up the universe rules as its power. But even that will fall before the Imagine Breaker. And this isn't even the extent of his powers yet. There's room to grow, and powers to slap down.

The Ultimate Nulifier is written by Marvel, whose very own Sentry's power has been found to yo-yo across the board. And unlike a comic plot device, To Aru Majutsu no Index's is written by one writer, thus more consistent and more reliable.

That's not to say that I think that Imagine Breaker can top UN. Seriously, no. UN is a plot hax. IB is also one, but in the scale of To Aru? It is already overkill, to blow it up to UN power level is illogical. But in all intent and purpose, IB and UN serve in the same role, an artifact that can contain the most powerful being in the story/one that erase all power before it. Marvel universe is larger and more powerful critters.. beings inhabits it. UN power scale is needed to do that.

In To Aru Majutsu no Index, Imagine Breaker does its job adequately. And it's doing its job while containing Touma's unnamed prisoner to boot!

So, how will we know that IB in a marvel universe isn't a version of UN? It could be the same thing, or it could not. A human version might acted differently from a full UN. Once the sandbox size is taken into account, IB might or even cancel UN. Touma can be written as the only being who will survive a UN activation convincingly. Or he could just be erased like the rest of the Gods/Omnipotent Beings in Marvel, that is also realistic.

That's the trouble with plot hax, it is only as powerful as the current writer meant it to be. And with Joe Quesada's Norman Osborn rearranging Marvel's dinner table, I have less confidence in Marvel than To Aru's author.

The Ultimate Nullifier has the word ultimate in it for a reason.

Like in Ultimate Spider-Man? So, the reason is to make more money? :crazy:

There's also the small fact that unlike most other powers anywhere Touma's does this to you when you think about it.

When Accelerator tried to understand the logic behind Touma's powers in Volume 20, he felt extreme pain in his head, as if something was tearing the left and right half of his brain and splitting them apart, wanting to jump out of that gap and then gave up.

We're talking about the guy who can literally hack minds(and change anything inside anyone to his will through electrical impulse signals alone) and process all the information on vectors at a worldwide scale be it wind speed, memories, vectoral and kinetic force. He's easily one of the smartest minds with the ability of calculation intake.

 

[A Curious Stranger]

Meh, Amadeus Cho could probably do the same if he was given the same powers.

 

[leeyiankun]

Meh, Amadeus Cho could probably do the same if he was given the same powers.

The character made by the guy who did the Mary Jane books? No, thanks. :no:

And calculating EVERYTHING, seen or unseen, that Accelerator does constantly. Is in another dimension, compared to what that kid does. Considering that that power of his is a constant calculation of ALL available Vectors in his area. Cho's mind would have blown up in 0.1 sec.

Accelerator mind is so hax that even with an unknown element like Dark Matter(rewriting universe rules), he some how manages to keep up. Heck, he even reads Angels language! How about that?

There is a reason why he is rated the strongest Lvl.5 and closest to ascending in the Tree diagram.

 

[Reimu]

Meh, Amadeus Cho could probably do the same if he was given the same powers.

The character made by the guy who did the Mary Jane books? No, thanks. :no:

And calculating EVERYTHING, seen or unseen, that Accelerator does constantly. Is in another dimension, compared to what that kid does. Considering that that power of his is a constant calculation of ALL available Vectors in his area. Cho's mind would have blown up in 0.1 sec.

Accelerator mind is so hax that even with an unknown element like Dark Matter(rewriting universe rules), he some how manages to keep up.

I stopped taking Cho seriously when he said that the hulk never killed anybody in his rampages with the hulk sub consciously doing super math.

 

[Aegis]

Meh, Amadeus Cho could probably do the same if he was given the same powers.

Nope actually it's impossible. Accelerator's powers don't come from someone granting them to him via magic or special genes. His powers come from the reality and identity of self that he has. Meaning that whatever power he has is a power he's earned and a power he had the capacity to have to begin with, meaning that nobody else could use his powers like Accel does.

 

[Seed00]

leeyiankun vs GH

Ultimate Nullifier vs Imagine Breaker

Winner

Ball breaker

I maintain that Touma cannot nullify a kick to the balls and someone slicing that arm off.

If the samurai chick hadn't wasted time and done so, the iIndex series wouldn't have a protagonist at this point. Why do I remember an episode with a dragon showing up in place of his arm?

 

[leeyiankun]

leeyiankun vs GH

Ultimate Nullifier vs Imagine Breaker

Winner

Ball breaker

I maintain that Touma cannot nullify a kick to the balls and someone slicing that arm off.

If the samurai chick hadn't wasted time and done so, the iIndex series wouldn't have a protagonist at this point. Why do I remember an episode with a dragon showing up in place of his arm?

Because it was a GAR episode? Because It's already said that Touma is protected by Plot(Unknown powers according to Accelerator)? So, no. Even if all you need to drop Touma is a gun, chances are you won't get to use it. Since his luck is 'nullified' by IB all the time, why didn't he died already?

Actually, in every fight, you can say that about him. Why didn't he just die? May be it's one of IB's property. Who knows?

Note: If you need to look it up, the dragon episode is from Himegami's rescue in episode 9. Where Touma's arm was sliced off.

Wha? (Watching the latest episode) :blink: damn, Index is scary.... that teeth of hers.

 

[Seed00]

I am wisely staying out of the major debate, leeyiankun. Since when does plot armor protect your balls?

Note: If you need to look it up, the dragon episode is from Himegami's rescue in episode 9. Where Touma's arm was sliced off.

Wha? (Watching the latest episode) blink.gif damn, Index is scary.... that teeth of hers.

Thanks for the ep. What? You realize that INdex is scary now?

 

[leeyiankun]

Since the 'Certified-Unlucky' guy hasn't got his balls kicked yet. I must reason that it was protected by some plot gimmik.

Yes, And Index-tan is scarier than Normal index. I'm very much looking forward to this season's Index-tan Omake. :snigger: