Naruto The Naruto Question Thread

[trevelyan1983]

Yeah, the whole "Sharingan copies stuff" thing?

That just doesn't cut it when compared to eye-contact genjutsu, Bijuu-hypnotism, chakra-sight and minor prescience. Which, hey, all normal Sharingan.

All of that pales in comparison to the Mangekyou. I mean, damn. Geass, Portals, Magic Fire, Super Illusions, Reality Warping, Ninja Mecha. OH HAI THAR RINNEGAN.

Copying? Wut?

 

[Knyght]

It'd be impossible to sympathize with Gai even if he got mad about it.

Gai is the one who taught Lee a bunch of high level forbidden techniques BEFORE he even knew who Lee would go up against in the tournament. It doesn't matter how much discretion he took in letting Lee use the moves, it was still irresponsible teaching.

Kakashi taught Sasuke the Chidori after he fought against an S-class criminal and in preparation to fight against Gaara. And then took Lee's taijutsu because it was the closest thing that would work.

The fact that Kakashi did it AFTER it was clear that Sasuke needed it actually makes Kakashi more responsible in training taijutsu than Gai.

Which is why reading Foxhound is still hilarious to this day.

Whilst I'm not sure whether it makes Gai's approach better or worse, he actually tried to teach the Front Lotus (and thus opening the first Gate) to all his students. Lee was the only one who got it down.

And despite the shitstorm various people make (or did make) about the Sharingan's copying ability, it's probably the ability that's been used the least in the entire manga.

 

[trevelyan1983]

Huh. I just noticed something, during Sasuke's fight with Itachi.

Firstly, Sasuke states and Itachi confirms that you need the Mangekyou Sharingan to control the Kyuubi. So Tobi has them, or the Nakano shrine tablet was bullshit.

Secondly, Madara was "the only person in history to learn the Sharingan's final secret."

We'd pretty much all assumed that this was the Eternal Mangekyou Sharingan. Which, yeah, he was - it takes a particularly sick fuck to pull out your little brother's eyes and wear them yourself. Itachi says as much right afterwards.

However, it now looks like foreshadowing of the Rinnegan, too. I'm not sure if that was luck or skill, but it kind of impressed me.

 

[Lord Raine]

Huh. I just noticed something, during Sasuke's fight with Itachi.

Firstly, Sasuke states and Itachi confirms that you need the Mangekyou Sharingan to control the Kyuubi. So Tobi has them, or the Nakano shrine tablet was bullshit.

Secondly, Madara was "the only person in history to learn the Sharingan's final secret."

We'd pretty much all assumed that this was the Eternal Mangekyou Sharingan. Which, yeah, he was - it takes a particularly sick fuck to pull out your little brother's eyes and wear them yourself. Itachi says as much right afterwards.

However, it now looks like foreshadowing of the Rinnegan, too. I'm not sure if that was luck or skill, but it kind of impressed me.

Kishimoto foreshadowed shit in the first five chapters that has only recently reached resolution, so I'm inclined to go with skill.

 

[Knyght]

So I'm thinking of the Fuuton: Rasen Shuriken and I'm confused by something. When Naruto develops the technique, he goes through the process of making the complete Rasengan and then infusing it with wind chakra. But why does he do it like that?

Wouldn't it make more sense for Naruto to create the wind chakra first and then go through the steps of the Rasengan (rotation, power, compression)?

Also, the Hiraishin. Many fics which feature the Hiraishin make the jutsu-shiki the most important part; that you need to "crack" the "extremely complex" jutsu-shiki to figure out the technique. But is that really true?

In my eyes, Hiraishin itself is a technique that allows the user to move through space-time whilst the jutsu-shiki marks where they can land, acting as an anchor. So the Hiraishin is the helicopter that transports the user whilst the jutsu-shiki is the helipad which tells them where they can land. So, whilst the jutsu-shiki is necessary to the technique, does that make it the main part of technique?

 

[seitora]

Huh.? I just noticed something, during Sasuke's fight with Itachi.

Firstly, Sasuke states and Itachi confirms that you need the Mangekyou Sharingan to control the Kyuubi.? So Tobi has them, or the Nakano shrine tablet was bullshit.

Secondly, Madara was "the only person in history to learn the Sharingan's final secret."

We'd pretty much all assumed that this was the Eternal Mangekyou Sharingan.? Which, yeah, he was - it takes a particularly sick fuck to pull out your little brother's eyes and wear them yourself.? Itachi says as much right afterwards.

However, it now looks like foreshadowing of the Rinnegan, too.? I'm not sure if that was luck or skill, but it kind of impressed me.

Kishimoto foreshadowed shit in the first five chapters that has only recently reached resolution, so I'm inclined to go with skill.

Hell, the cover for volume 1 has Sasuke on a Hawk

 

[Shirotsume]

You know, rereading Naruto 112, Kakashi is kinda being a dick. Naruto is trying to get across that Gaara is about to release his goddamn bijuu without breaking any laws, and Kakashi is all like "Stop being a bother Naruto, watch Sasuke."

 

[Juopunumies]

Lee never complained that Sasuke copied his taijutsu. He was impressed and jealous, but he didn't hate Sasuke for doing it. No one else did either.

Seriously this is one of the biggest things that annoys me when people bitch about it in fanfiction. They're all ninja, stealing jutsu is part of the job description. They fully understand that if they don't want someone to steal their jutsu, they either shouldn't let anyone see it, or make sure no one who sees it survives.

I mean, it'd be one thing if you broke into a comrade's house and stole his family jutsu scrolls, but if someone challenges you to a fight and shows off all their jutsu, or they're battling in front of a crowd of hundreds of people they have no reason to expect that their techniques will remain secret.

People hate the sharingan, so they make up reasons for others to hate it for the same reasons in-story. Really, I'd hate the sharingan as well if I were a ninja and some dude could take what I know just by looking at me doing it once. Sure, everyone just goes "wow, he's so skilled" in canon, but yeah...

You know, rereading Naruto 112, Kakashi is kinda being a dick. Naruto is trying to get across that Gaara is about to release his goddamn bijuu without breaking any laws, and Kakashi is all like "Stop being a bother Naruto, watch Sasuke."

It's probably a case of "the grown-ups are talking." The way I see it is that Kakashi just thinks of Naruto as a kid playing at being a ninja at that point in the story. Remember how he didn't think that Naruto was responsible enough for the rasengan, going as far as berating the motherfucking Jiraiya of the Sannin for teaching it to him?

Hell, the cover for volume 1 has Sasuke on a Hawk

Everyone was on a hawk in that picture. You'd have to squint pretty hard to look at it as foreshadowing.

 

[Altered Nova]

You know, rereading Naruto 112, Kakashi is kinda being a dick. Naruto is trying to get across that Gaara is about to release his goddamn bijuu without breaking any laws, and Kakashi is all like "Stop being a bother Naruto, watch Sasuke."

Is there actually a law against revealing a jinchuuriki from a foreign village? I always wondered why Naruto wasn't more specific with his warning to Kakashi there.

In my eyes, Hiraishin itself is a technique that allows the user to move through space-time whilst the jutsu-shiki marks where they can land, acting as an anchor. So the Hiraishin is the helicopter that transports the user whilst the jutsu-shiki is the helipad which tells them where they can land. So, whilst the jutsu-shiki is necessary to the technique, does that make it the main part of technique?

The Flying Thunder God technique is a ridiculously complicated space-time ninjutsu. Minato made it look so easy that I can understand why someone might think the jutsu-shiki was the key to cracking the jutsu. However, the technique requires so much skill and chakra control that his 3 Special Jounin bodyguards he taught the jutsu to can only perform 1/3 of the technique and have to work together to teleport.

So yeah, even if any enemy ninja cracked the jutsu-shiki I doubt they could reverse-engineer the jutsu from it, or actually perform it even if they could.

 

[Knyght]

Is there actually a law against revealing a jinchuuriki from a foreign village? I always wondered why Naruto wasn't more specific with his warning to Kakashi there.

No, there's not. The only known law is in Konoha which meant that no-one could tell Naruto that he was a jinchuuriki.

 

[Shirotsume]

Is there actually a law against revealing a jinchuuriki from a foreign village? I always wondered why Naruto wasn't more specific with his warning to Kakashi there.

No, there's not. The only known law is in Konoha which meant that no-one could tell Naruto that he was a jinchuuriki.

If Naruto straight up said in front of a bunch of gossipy genin that 'Hey, Gaara is about to release his bijuu,' everyone else would be like 'how do YOU know anything about some as esoteric as jinchuuriki?' and 'How do you know he's a jinchuuriki?' etc etc. Every question that would arise from him straight out saying it have one problem.

The problem is that the answers to which are, of course, that Naruto himself is a jinchuuriki, which is not something Naruto wants to fling around.

Really, he handled it about as subtly as he could there with the time constraints he had- Kakashi just completely blew him off.

 

[Knyght]

Naruto doesn't know anything about jinchuuriki or bijuu; the terms didn't exist until PTS. All he knows is Gaara's a homicidal psycho with a monster inside him, something which Shikamaru was there to hear as well.

For reasons I never understood, Naruto had no problem telling Gaara he had a monster inside him despite having Shikamaru standing right behind.

And I agree Kakashi was a dick right then. There's no good reason he couldn't have at least heard Naruto out.

 

[ankokudaishogun]

Sure, everyone just goes "wow, he's so skilled" in canon, but yeah...

The point being, you can copy whatever you want, but you still need SKILL to use it effectively, and being trained enough so your body can sustain the stress.
Sharingan-learning the Shadow Leaf Dance would have been useless to, for example, Pre-TS Konohamaru, as he did lack both physical prowess and the skill to USE such technique. The same is applied to every jutsu.
Sasuke is hailed as very skilled because he managed to use effectively a technique he did learn 5 days before at his first attempt in a real fighting situation even though his body wasn't specifically trained to deal with the stress of said technique.
Hell, he manages to "complete" it with an original finisher.

A normal person (ie: Sakura) wouldn't have been able to do such thing and would have likely screwed up somewhere.

Remember how he didn't think that Naruto was responsible enough for the rasengan, going as far as berating the motherfucking Jiraiya of the Sannin for teaching it to him?

Naruto just used said Six Grades Above A-Rank Jutsu on Sasuke.
He wasn't acting responsible at the time.

Naruto is trying to get across that Gaara is about to release his goddamn bijuu without breaking any laws, and Kakashi is all like "Stop being a bother Naruto, watch Sasuke."

No, he wasn't.
First, there aren't any laws about Gaara. The only law is about Naruto.
Second, he didn't know what Gaara was exactly doing. He only did know Gaara was a real killer and did fear for Sasuke.
Kakashi's response was pretty much "Naruto, trust your teacher not letting your <s>lover</s><s>friend</s>rival being killed without a fighting chance"

Also, the Hiraishin. Many fics which feature the Hiraishin make the jutsu-shiki the most important part; that you need to "crack" the "extremely complex" jutsu-shiki to figure out the technique. But is that really true?

Must be.
Because with all the kunai Minato did use, were it not super-hard, every village with a remotely competent sealing master would have it.
And while using it in combat requires ultra-fast reflex(which would limit its use to the Raikage and maybe Killer Bee), it would still have a use as long-range fast summon.(see Minato's bodyguards)

For Naruto starting with normal chakra, it was probably a matter of habit. Currently, he seems to have it start as a Rasenshuriken, so I suppose he's now using Wind chakra from the start

Firstly, Sasuke states and Itachi confirms that you need the Mangekyou Sharingan to control the Kyuubi. So Tobi has them, or the Nakano shrine tablet was bullshit.

I think you need the Mangekyo to take control of Kurama, but once you have it, you can make a contract and use a normal Sharingan to contro him\her\it.
Sasuke's normal Sharingan had a limited degree of control on Kurama when sealed, after all.

 

[Shirotsume]

Oh look, it's ankodaishogun Sasuke-wanking again.

Naruto just used said Six Grades Above A-Rank Jutsu on Sasuke.
He wasn't acting responsible at the time.

If you're talking about after the fight on the hospital, I'm going to cockslap you.

 

[Bill Felix]

Sure, everyone just goes "wow, he's so skilled" in canon, but yeah...

The point being, you can copy whatever you want, but you still need SKILL to use it effectively, and being trained enough so your body can sustain the stress.
Sharingan-learning the Shadow Leaf Dance would have been useless to, for example, Pre-TS Konohamaru, as he did lack both physical prowess and the skill to USE such technique. The same is applied to every jutsu.
Sasuke is hailed as very skilled because he managed to use effectively a technique he did learn 5 days before at his first attempt in a real fighting situation even though his body wasn't specifically trained to deal with the stress of said technique.
Hell, he manages to "complete" it with an original finisher.

It's not that impressive, especially since Naruto does the exact same thing with his regular eyes.

Also that was the one thing I couldn't stand about the Chuunin Exam arc. Everyone wouldn't shut up about Sasuke. I know it was a part of the plot and all, but after a while, all of the focus on him during the the first two exams and the preliminaries became annoying.

Thank god for Shikamaru or I probably would have bailed.

 

[Amberion]

Sure, everyone just goes "wow, he's so skilled" in canon, but yeah...

Yup, and when Naruto did his version of it, they just commented on how he copied it. :headbanger:

So there seem to be some bias there.

 

[Knyght]

Must be.
Because with all the kunai Minato did use, were it not super-hard, every village with a remotely competent sealing master would have it.
And while using it in combat requires ultra-fast reflex(which would limit its use to the Raikage and maybe Killer Bee), it would still have a use as long-range fast summon.(see Minato's bodyguards)

Evidently, you didn't see the point of my post. It wasn't about the complexity of the jutsu-shiki itself but whether it was the main part of the Hiraishin.

To clarify, I was suggesting that the jutsu-shiki only acted as an anchor whilst the actual space-time ninjutsu was all down to Minato himself. Thus, even if you managed to crack the jutsu-shiki, it wouldn't be reverse-engineer the Hiraishin since that was only a small part of it.

 

[TC_Hazard]

Oh look, it's ankodaishogun Sasuke-wanking again.

Naruto just used said Six Grades Above A-Rank Jutsu on Sasuke.
He wasn't acting responsible at the time.

If you're talking about after the fight on the hospital, I'm going to cockslap you.

To be fair, neither was acting responsibly at the time. Naruto and Sasuke got into a fight that escalated to the point of them using jutsu meant to kill on each other, and would have probably killed Sakura had Kakashi not butted in right then.

Edit: I am not saying Naruto isn't responsible enough. I am saying that particular fight became personal (and ugly) pretty damn fast.

 

[Shirotsume]

Oh look, it's ankodaishogun Sasuke-wanking again.

Naruto just used said Six Grades Above A-Rank Jutsu on Sasuke.
He wasn't acting responsible at the time.

If you're talking about after the fight on the hospital, I'm going to cockslap you.

To be fair, neither was acting responsibly at the time. Naruto and Sasuke got into a fight that escalated to the point of them using jutsu meant to kill on each other, and would have probably killed Sakura had Kakashi not butted in right then.

Edit: I am not saying Naruto isn't responsible enough. I am saying that particular fight became personal (and ugly) pretty damn fast.

Indeed.

 

[ankokudaishogun]

It's not that impressive, especially since Naruto does the exact same thing with his regular eyes.

The fact what Naruto did was impressive doesn't mean what Sasuke did was less impressive. They both did show being very skilled, though in different ways.

And nobody commented he did steal it from Sasuke. Except Kakashi, nobody commented on it and they did show surprised faces.
Kakashi did comment Naruto was watching Sasuke earlier and did, in fact, used the same name. From this to "He totally did steal Sasuke's move" is an ocean.

To be fair, neither was acting responsibly at the time. Naruto and Sasuke got into a fight that escalated to the point of them using jutsu meant to kill on each other, and would have probably killed Sakura had Kakashi not butted in right then.

This.
Naruto is usually reasonably responsible, but in that instance he did something very stupid and very irresponsible.
Sasuke, too, as he shouldn't have used his A-Rank assassination jutsu on a teammate.

Evidently, you didn't see the point of my post.

Yeah, I did miss it.
I must say you have a point. Sadly we still know shit of how sealing jutsus work

 

[Bill Felix]

It's not that impressive, especially since Naruto does the exact same thing with his regular eyes.

The fact what Naruto did was impressive doesn't mean what Sasuke did was less impressive. They both did show being very skilled, though in different ways.

Uh, yeah. It does make it less impressive. Because it means that someone without Sasuke's genius and Sharingan can do the exact thing in the same amount of time.

 

[ankokudaishogun]

It's not that impressive, especially since Naruto does the exact same thing with his regular eyes.

The fact what Naruto did was impressive doesn't mean what Sasuke did was less impressive. They both did show being very skilled, though in different ways.

Uh, yeah. It does make it less impressive. Because it means that someone without Sasuke's genius and Sharingan can do the exact thing in the same amount of time.

Yeah, but Naruto did something totally different from Sasuke.
Naruto did show a great coordination ability with his clones, not a great profiency with a never-used-before technique

 

[Bill Felix]

It's not that impressive, especially since Naruto does the exact same thing with his regular eyes.

The fact what Naruto did was impressive doesn't mean what Sasuke did was less impressive. They both did show being very skilled, though in different ways.

Uh, yeah. It does make it less impressive. Because it means that someone without Sasuke's genius and Sharingan can do the exact thing in the same amount of time.

Yeah, but Naruto did something totally different from Sasuke.
Naruto did show a great coordination ability with his clones, not a great profiency with a never-used-before technique

Naruto's attack was also a never-before-used technique because it didn't exist before he used it.

If Sasuke's Sharingan is intended to let him copy techniques and Naruto just copied Sasuke on the spot, how are either of them geniuses for doing it? Sasuke was using the Sharingan for its intended purpose. And apparently, what he was doing wasn't difficult enough for Naruto to copy with relative ease.

I'm kind of wondering why everyone presumes that Lee's taijutsu is so hard to learn. I thought the whole point was that his moves were powerful, not amazingly complex.

 

[trevelyan1983]

Martial Arts boil down to physical conditioning and technical repetition. Taijutsu, for all that it's boosted by ninja magical fuckery, is much the same.

If it's hard to learn, the student or the teacher - or both - are doing something wrong.

 

[jyusan]

Naruto's attack was also a never-before-used technique because it didn't exist before he used it.

If Sasuke's Sharingan is intended to let him copy techniques and Naruto just copied Sasuke on the spot, how are either of them geniuses for doing it? Sasuke was using the Sharingan for its intended purpose. And apparently, what he was doing wasn't difficult enough for Naruto to copy with relative ease.

I'm kind of wondering why everyone presumes that Lee's taijutsu is so hard to learn. I thought the whole point was that his moves were powerful, not amazingly complex.

The idea was that Sasuke was a not considered a genius because he copied Shadow Leaf Dance, aka, the move of shadowing your opponent in midair. It was because he made up a taijutsu move that relied on the reactions of the opponent, without his magical Predict-and-Copy-Everything eyes, while suppressing Orochi's mindrape seal, apparently within the span of several seconds, although that gets struck down later when we get Karin's flashback of Sasuke using it on two separate bears.

From the perspective of Kakashi, it's a burst of complete genius on an entirely different level than anyone else.

On the other hand, Naruto's move was preceded by a fart, killing any real buildup for it, then (loudly) verbally given a very similar name to Sasuke's, despite the only similarity being a kick as the final move of the attack. The coordination with clones was easily the best that Naruto had ever used at that point in time, but Sasuke's seemed more impressive to Kakashi, partially based on a lack of information, but also based on Kakashi's favoritism at the time, which is emphasized very often during the Chunin exams.

You have to remember, When Iruka said that Naruto wasn't ready for the exams, Kakashi's response was essentially "Hopefully he'll get the stupid beaten out of him."