The Wheel Of Time

[Watashiwa]

The Oath Rod also gives the Aes Sedai that ageless look along with shortening their lifespan. Siuan and Leane both look younger once they're stripped of the One Power, and I think Moiraine might have de-aged somehow too.

As for thinking that Rand was only a little stronger than them: that's White Tower propaganda. There's a mention that men and women were of equal strength in the One Power during the Age of Legends, but it's corrected later by saying that men were stronger while women could link.

Egwene's turning point comes when she goes to the Aiel for training. Notice that book 2 is where Rand becomes a badass, book 3 is Mat, book 4 is Egwene, and 5 is Perrin (though he rapidly goes back to fail [HAH] until Towers).

 

[Ashaman]

The Oath Rod also gives the Aes Sedai that ageless look along with shortening their lifespan. Siuan and Leane both look younger once they're stripped of the One Power, and I think Moiraine might have de-aged somehow too.

cough

Oh, and one last thing beofre I get started.á Comment if you want, I'm more than happy to disscuss my feelings on things, but Do Not Talk About Gathering Storm or Towers of Midnightá Not here, not now.

I haven't read them yet, and I don't want to be spoiled.

You're lucky I knew Moraine would be freed from the Finn, or whatever they were called. I Do NOT KNOW HOW, though I have my suspicions that it'll be Mat, and he'll lose an eye somehow doing it. Probably by payment.

Now I'm left wondering if Moraine can still channel or its a result of her being in an alt dimension so long. And NO, I don't want an answer to that question. Or the Mat-eye thing.

I don't want to know.

Don't say I'm right. Don't say I'm wrong.

Just please be more careful from now on.

There's a mention that men and women were of equal strength in the One Power during the Age of Legends, but it's corrected later by saying that men were stronger while women could link.

I remember this, vaguely. I wasn't entirely sure though.


Finished The Great Hunt.

The scene where Mat blows the Horn was as epic as I remember it being. Rand has an excellent moment too, both with the Sheathing the Sword and beating a true Blademaster.

There isn't really much to say, except that they fought to protect what they cared about, and fought well.

And once again we turn to NEE + Min. And they were pretty awesome. Nyneave acted as a good leader, planner and moral compass. She came up with a good plan; she knew when to push, when to pull and how to make others believe in her plan and even while raging, she kept control of herself and actions for justice.

Elayne didn't really do much; no more or less than Min, except Min got to lay with a sleeping Rand to keep him warm and alive.

Egwene - I feel sorry for what they did to her, and her backlash against the Seanchen was both awesome and incredibly foolish.

I don't mind her foolishness though. Because for once, I understand it.

I mentioned it before, but all the girls stubborness and pride is nothing short of annoying when faced with someone their equal or lesser, like RPM, but when used against someone trying to break you, when thrust against your better, especially when the 'better' is unlikable, it becomes a charm point all its own.

And Egwene fought smart, rebelled when possible and through her allies, got free.

I like that the girls managed to save themeslves, more or less at least. Not sure what would have happened without the Horn, but whatever. They pretty much cleaned up their own shit, and I like that.

 

[Ashaman]

And I can't find Dragon Reborn.

Or any of the others for that matter. Even New Spring and the Guide.

Either one of my brothers has them, or I've somehow lost them.

I'll be livid if I have to buy them all again.

 

[Watashiwa]

Torrent them.

Sorry for accidental spoiler, for whatever reason I thought it happened in Knife of Dreams.

 

[grant]

Aren't many safe torrent sites left. Certainly don't know a single ebook site I trust anymore.

As for the Blacks, they're frankly stupid. Like most of the enemies they seem to spend most of their time sitting around and being blandly evil.

 

[Ashaman]

That's not really possible for me. I like to read it on the bus on my way to work, and my phone isn't the type I'd be able to read a book on.

Whatever. I've bought DB and SR. I'll be talking to my scattered brothers about the others soon enough.

Made it to chapter 9.

Ta'veren is pretty fucking weird.

Rand gets within a day of a village. Every girl there decides she wants to marry someone. The men agree, even if they'd sworn it off.

By the time Rand leaves, there is no one of age in a mile radius not hitched.

We also learn that Artur is weak compared to Rand in ta'vereniness. And maybe even Mat and Perrin. Its said that sometimes, if Artur was playing cards or something, they'd fall just as he needed them. Sometimes. Mat has that on 24/7.

I've forgotton if Perrin had a unique Ta'veren power.

People accidentally speaking true has come up with Artur's name, and there's been a couple of instances of that with Perrin, so :huh.:


What else? Perrin's fear of his wolf side is a lot more understandable now that I'm older. It more or less went over my head before, but now I can understand his fears somewhat.

And we've got our first concrete hint that all of RPM are needed. In the Fade's exact words. "Cut one leg of the tripod, and all fall down."

Its something thats been there, but not brought into the forefront til now. Moraine had the right of it. She (and we) spent so much time focused on Rand, and what he is, that its so easy for the other two ta'veren in the story, and their purpose, to slip our minds.

Speaking of Moraine, Perrin standing up to her was bitchin, particularly because Rand was doing the same till he ran off.

Too bad Moraine spends the next week re-establashing her authority over him. It almost seems like she overcompensating.

I get the feeling its not going to do her much good when it comes to the big issues though, which he'll probably fight her on.

@Watashiwa - Its fine.

 

[Estrecca]

Regarding relatively safe places for online reading of missing books:

Go here:

<a href='http://www.e-reading.org.ua/bookbyauthor.php?author=21089' target='_blank' rel='nofollow'>http://www.e-reading.org.ua/bookbyauthor.php?author=21089</a>

It has not given me any trouble so far (and I've been using it for a number of years now). The page purports to be an online archive of literature created to increase the level of literacy in Ukraine.

 

[grant]

I think Perrin's ta'veren thing is being a wolf-guy and the connection to the other two*. The only unusual luck he has is Faile and getting in charge of things and that happens so often to fantasy protagonists that I don't think Jordan actually intended for that to be a luck-altering thing. I don't know, he seemed like the blandest of the three so maybe I just don't like anything to do with him.

*I was somewhat irritated when they suddenly started seeing what the other two were doing in the late books. A connection like that is something you want to explore early, not throw in late enough that it's distracting from important late story plots.

Regarding relatively safe places for online reading of missing books:

Go here:

<a href='http://www.e-reading.org.ua/bookbyauthor.php?author=21089' target='_blank' rel='nofollow'>http://www.e-reading.org.ua/bookbyauthor.php?author=21089</a>

It has not given me any trouble so far (and I've been using it for a number of years now). The page purports to be an online archive of literature created to increase the level of literacy in Ukraine.

Thanks but I'm really more history/politics and the site doesn't seem to let you search in the History section for only English works. Pity about library.nu, guess it was inevitable.

 

[Estrecca]

Thanks but I'm really more history/politics and the site doesn't seem to let you search in the History section for only English works. Pity about library.nu, guess it was inevitable.

*frowns*

Try the links in the page below. Some of it might be deadlinks and some of it will be in Spanish, but there should be something useful for your purposes.

<a href='http://www.antelaley.com/2012/07/new-options-gigapedia-o-librarynu.html' target='_blank' rel='nofollow'>http://www.antelaley.com/2012/07/new-optio...-librarynu.html</a>

 

[grant]

Huh, thanks.

 

[Ashaman]

The only unusual luck he has is Faile and getting in charge of things and that happens so often to fantasy protagonists that I don't think Jordan actually intended for that to be a luck-altering thing. I don't know, he seemed like the blandest of the three so maybe I just don't like anything to do with him.

Considering being Ta'veren is practically synomonous with being a protaganist, I think that might be enough.

I'll keep an eye out for any really weird shit though.


Speaking of Perrin and weird shit.

The World of Dreams. Egwene and Perrin both have a connection to this place, but Perrin is the first to properly experience it.

Unless I'm much mistaken, he keeps running into the Forsaken there.

Ishmael, Lanfear, and two others that I can't readily identify, both male.

The named two both directly speak to him, the former wanting him to go back to his peaceful life as a blacksmith, the latter wanting him to seek glory in the same way she wants Rand to seek it.

That said, considering we are told Rand's projecting his dreams at the time, its hard to say if it isn't just that Rand is dreaming of these conversations and Perrin's mind is filtering them to fit to himself.

And we are also introduced to Dark Hounds and Balefire. Neither are named, but with foreknowledge of the series, its obvious what they are.

Edit: Something I forgot to mention earlier.

the Karaethon cycle was mentioned again.

"He shall slay his people with the sword of justice, and destroy them with the leaf" - refering to the Aiel's history with the Way of the Leaf.

"He shall bind the nine moons to serve him" - Nine moons is a title of the Seanchen Empress IIRC. This will probably be Tuon via Mat.

Healing "Wounds of madness of cutting of hope" - I'm drawing a blank on this one, unless it refers to removing the taint on Saidin.

"He will break chains, and chain others" - This could be anything really.

And could someone do me a favour and name the Forsaken for me. I can only remember 6 of them, and even then they are less names, more this one, that one and that one.

 

[seitora]

Aginor - Gets killed at the end of the first book, gets ressurected, gets balefired at the end of Winter's Heart

Balthamael - Gets killed at the end of the first book, gets rezzed

Demandred - Current identity unknown (as of the end of Knife of Dreams)

Graendal - Said to be somewhere in that country next to Arad Doman

Ishamael - Killed at the end of the third book, gets rezzed

Lanfear - Killed at the end of the fifth book, gets rezzed with possible consequences

Moghedien - Survives, was binded to Ishamael

Sammael - Killed at the end of Crown of Swords by the black mist thing

Rahvin - Killed at the end of Fires of Heaven by balefire, causing Mat and Aviendha to be rezzed

Asmodean - Killed at the end of Fires of Heaven by an unknown (as of the end of Knife of Dreams) assailant

Be'lal - Killed by Moiraine at the end of Dragon Reborn with balefire

Semirhage - Captured at the end of Knife of Dreams (also pronounced 'Sem-ih-raj', which is incredibly stupid)

Mesaana - Current identity unknown, believed to be in the white tower (as of the end of Knife of Dreams)




by the way the crown of laurel swords or something mentioned earlier is the Crown of Swords, Illian's crown

 

[Ashaman]

When I last left you, we had just finished Perrin's segment and moved onto NEE's.

Not much to say on this, really.

NEE have learnt how to use the One Power as a weapon, and even go so far as using it to frighten off some Whitecloaks, which we are told is a very bad thing.

The Three Oaths have come into the forefront for a time.

I sort of disagree. Yeah, they shouldn't have done it to Whitecloaks, but these are dangerous times, and I don't neccessarily like many of the Oaths.

Speak No Word That Is Not True. - Considering how much they twist their words, why they even bother with this one is beyond me.

No Making Weapons With The One Power - Fair enough, I suppose.

No Using The One Power As A Weapon Other Than Against Shadowspawn or in Defense of Your Own Life, Your Sister's Life Or That of Your Warder. - Its this one I really have a problem with, because it means you can't use it to defend Someone Else.

Then again, their are ways of circumnavigating even that last one. Hell, it wouldn't be surprising if the whole Warder system is designed to cover up these holes in the system.

Continuing on, I have a piece of news for you that will startle, maybe even shock you to your core. Brace yourselves.

Aes Sedai are a bunch of scheming Bitches

No wonder everyone hates them.

In my eyes, Nyneave's stock has risen exponentially as she, one after another, spots, calls out and/or plans around their scheming.

Where Elayne and Egwene trust Aes Sedai. More or less. Nyneave doesn't. She hates and distrusts them at the same kind of level as Mat. In her eyes, every word they say is something to be examined and questioned, every action watched and noted.

And I love it.

As the A-Seat considers letting Mat die to free up the Horn, Nyneave has already realised as such and prepares to do the Healing herself.

Then it turns out that they really are going to help Mat, and you get a scale of just how strong Nyneave is. Ten full Sisters and the stongest sa'angreal they have on hand in a circle = 2 Nyneave's.

Beastly.

So to summerize - NEE's come home, Mat is healed, and now NEE are going to try and route out the Black Ajah, because they are the only one's the A-Seat can trust not to be Black. Oh, and they've already had one assination attempt from a Gray Man. It seems the Dark One wants them dead, most likely because of their connection to RMP than their own powers, but you never know.




And a more t: question. Do you know the original plan to seal the Dark One. The one that split men and women. Which side do you think had the right of it?

I think that the women had the better plan, but they held onto it too long when they should have switched to Plan B. The men had a plan right then, but the women were being bloody stubborn, and it cost lives every day until Lews decided - Fuck it boys, let's do this shit.

And then, you know, it all went horribly wrong.

I'm curious what other people think.

 

[grant]

Speaking of Perrin and weird shit.

The World of Dreams. Egwene and Perrin both have a connection to this place, but Perrin is the first to properly experience it.

Unless I'm much mistaken, he keeps running into the Forsaken there.

Ishmael, Lanfear, and two others that I can't readily identify, both male.

The named two both directly speak to him, the former wanting him to go back to his peaceful life as a blacksmith, the latter wanting him to seek glory in the same way she wants Rand to seek it.

That said, considering we are told Rand's projecting his dreams at the time, its hard to say if it isn't just that Rand is dreaming of these conversations and Perrin's mind is filtering them to fit to himself.

I never considered the possibility of Rand projecting dream-conversations. Though considering that Min did warn Perrin to beware the most beautiful woman he would ever see I wonder if originally he was supposed to interact with Lanfear and Jordan dropped the idea.

NEE have learnt how to use the One Power as a weapon, and even go so far as using it to frighten off some Whitecloaks, which we are told is a very bad thing.

The Three Oaths have come into the forefront for a time.

I sort of disagree. Yeah, they shouldn't have done it to Whitecloaks, but these are dangerous times, and I don't neccessarily like many of the Oaths.

Speak No Word That Is Not True. - Considering how much they twist their words, why they even bother with this one is beyond me.

No Making Weapons With The One Power - Fair enough, I suppose.

No Using The One Power As A Weapon Other Than Against Shadowspawn or in Defense of Your Own Life, Your Sister's Life Or That of Your Warder. - Its this one I really have a problem with, because it means you can't use it to defend Someone Else.

Then again, their are ways of circumnavigating even that last one. Hell, it wouldn't be surprising if the whole Warder system is designed to cover up these holes in the system.

Using it around the Whitecloaks was politically unwise (especially since you'll have many men swearing wherever they go on the Light that Aes Sedai used saidar to attack them*). Also they did it on their own instead of allowing their far more experienced and tricky leader Moraine to handle it.

On the word twisting, originally it was supposed to just mean that no Aes Sedai would ever deceive someone. Unfortunately the necessity of life meant that they quickly realized that there were times when they needed to mislead someone and so their Oath became pointless and actually created the problem it was intended to fix.

As for combat, while the 'no killing others to protect Someone Else' is tricky you can still imprison people. The real problem is that it, like the first, ultimately resulted in Aes Sedai being even more distant from most of the population. Might have been smarter if sometime over the centuries they had moved closer to the borderlands.
And the Warder system is meant to cover that problem. Unfortunately Nynaeve, Egwene and Elayne can't seem to remember that little fact for more than five seconds considering how often they need someone (generally Julian, Thom and/or Mat) to save them at least once a book.

*Yes they weren't Aes Sedai and yes they didn't 'attack' them but do you expect prejudiced, poorly educated fanatics to know or care about the difference?


And if by this point you've gotten to the girl being sent to give the NEE that message it raises two very good questions that aren't really answered. Why are they still hunting once they know that cover's been blown and who was stupid enough to just prance around and indirectly let them tell them that their cover was blown?

 

[Ashaman]

I never considered the possibility of Rand projecting dream-conversations. Though considering that Min did warn Perrin to beware the most beautiful woman he would ever see I wonder if originally he was supposed to interact with Lanfear and Jordan dropped the idea.

No, I think that they were entering Perrins dreams to speak to him, but the possiblity exists that he was just getting Rand's dream overflow.

Sort of moot point - Lanfear has appeared in his dreams, though she wasn't happy to see him. IIC, her words were "What are you doing here? You'll ruin everything."

Edit: Point is further mooted - Lanfear visits Mat, mentions that she wanted to see "all of you", and in the same way tries to goad him into seeking glory; she also mentions that 'he' would try to dissuade or kill Mat - It sounds similar to the way Perrin was approached by Ishmael.

And the Warder system is meant to cover that problem. Unfortunately Nynaeve, Egwene and Elayne can't seem to remember that little fact for more than five seconds considering how often they need someone (generally Julian, Thom and/or Mat) to save them at least once a book.

This now makes Egwene's thoughts even more amusing and foolish.

Once or twice, its mentioned that she is trying to throw off the thought that a man with a sword is useful, or something to that effect.

Its something she believes, but the tone/some previous thoughts indicates that some part of her at least thinks they aren't.

"... she couldn't help but think a man with a sword was useful."

I think she's forgetting exactly how useful Warders are.

 

[Ashaman]

Mat has now woken up, been visited by Selene, who thinks he'd be most susceptable to the allure of glory, and the A-Seat, who wants to keep him in the White Tower indefinately, mostly because of the Horn.

As Selene said, they have no fucking clue how important Mat (and Perrin) really are.

Egwene Acepted test was no more or less than expected; what does get me is the whole Else thing. But I'll get 2 that in a minute.

The girls have found information that suggests Tear, and corroberated it with Dreaming, which is actually pretty damn good as far as investigation goes. They also consider the possiblity of a trap and so forth, so they've learned to be careful from what I can see.

On Mat's first walk he meets 'Else', who tells him he should still be in bed and refuses to go within 6 feet of him. Then he beats up both Gawyn and Galad 2 vs 1 and I smile and smile and smile. Gawyn's a pretty cool guy, and takes the loss like a man. Meanwhile, Galad is left moaning on the floor as Aes Sedai and Accepted take this chance to molest him.

All those girls now hate Mat, who doesn't give a fuck because Aes Sedai. Still, I would have thought that at least 1 or 2 of them would be more impressed with Mat for beating them both at once, but apparently Galad is just that pretty.

Speaking of Galad - The first time I read these books, I didn't really like him, but I'm a bit more sympathetic now. He gets on well with his brother, but his sister refuses to aknowledge their relation. And its not like he's done anything malious to her either. The fact that he tried to charm Nyneave and failed probably helps.

And now, back to Else, who is apparently Lanfear in disguise. That explains somethings.

And if by this point you've gotten to the girl being sent to give the NEE that message it raises two very good questions that aren't really answered. Why are they still hunting once they know that cover's been blown and who was stupid enough to just prance around and indirectly let them tell them that their cover was blown?

i'm not sure what you mean by this bit.

Are you referring to Else/Lanfear delivering the message, or something more.

Maybe it'll become clear further on.

 

[Ashaman]

Oh, and I forgot; Egwene has some prophacy dreams.

Rand: reaching for a crystal sword, never seeing the net until it was too late. kneeling in a chamber where a parched wind blew and Dragons floated on the wind before settaling in his skin. Rand walking down a dark mountain into a pit where a red light glows.

Cuellunder, the Aeil city and Shayl Ghul i imagine.

Perrin: Perrin with a falcon and hawk, and the hawk had a leash. A bearded Perrin leading an army of wolves.

Perrin gets into a love triangle, IIRC, and the other one sounds Last Battleish.

Mat: Placing his own eye on a balancing scale, handing from a great tree, and a dream of Mat and the Seanchen, that Egwene dismisses as a nightmare. And Mat speaking the Old Tongue.

I've discussed my theories on the first one before, the second is the Aeil city again, and the third is too vague to say for sure, but most likely to do with his marriage to Tuon.

 

[seitora]

"... she couldn't help but think a man with a sword was useful."

I think she's forgetting exactly how useful Warders are.

That's because she lacks perspective. Anything is more useful than Elayne.

 

[grant]

And if by this point you've gotten to the girl being sent to give the NEE that message it raises two very good questions that aren't really answered. Why are they still hunting once they know that cover's been blown and who was stupid enough to just prance around and indirectly let them tell them that their cover was blown?

i'm not sure what you mean by this bit.

Are you referring to Else/Lanfear delivering the message, or something more.

Maybe it'll become clear further on.

Yes, that. It's stupid for two reasons. The first is that now Siuan and the girls know that they don't have a cover anymore so it's fairly pointless for them to wander around trying to secretly catch the Black Ajah, the second is that it makes little sense for Else (who is probably Lanfear) to tell them any of this. Sure Lanfear likes to push how intelligent and great she is in other people's faces, but that's not the same as randomly warning them.

Hate to say it but Moghedion (the irritating plotting idiot who never shows much of her vaunted cleverness) handled it better than she did.

 

[core_88]

Mat is seriously an expy of Odin a lot of what he goes through can be traced back to Odins myth like the hanging thing to pay for knowledge, the eye thing the spear and so on.

Perrin seems to be Thor what with the Hammer and being close to the people down to earth kind of guy also some other things i don't remember right now.

Don't know who Rand is aside from maybe Jesus...

Just some thoughts i've had for awhile.

 

[Ashaman]

And if by this point you've gotten to the girl being sent to give the NEE that message it raises two very good questions that aren't really answered. Why are they still hunting once they know that cover's been blown and who was stupid enough to just prance around and indirectly let them tell them that their cover was blown?

i'm not sure what you mean by this bit.

Are you referring to Else/Lanfear delivering the message, or something more.

Maybe it'll become clear further on.

Yes, that. It's stupid for two reasons. The first is that now Siuan and the girls know that they don't have a cover anymore so it's fairly pointless for them to wander around trying to secretly catch the Black Ajah, the second is that it makes little sense for Else (who is probably Lanfear) to tell them any of this. Sure Lanfear likes to push how intelligent and great she is in other people's faces, but that's not the same as randomly warning them.

Hate to say it but Moghedion (the irritating plotting idiot who never shows much of her vaunted cleverness) handled it better than she did.

I think you're misunderstanding the situation slightly.

First of all, NEE are hunting Black Ajah, but the point is they know its a trap; they mean to spring the trap, but not get caught. That is why they continue to hunt.

Hell, it doesn't change anything except maybe Liannedrin now knows who is coming for her. They were all a target of the Blacks anyway.

Second; Lanfear is playing both sides. Depending on what the 13 Blacks are doing in Tear, and who ordered it, it might have been in Lanfears best interests to sabatage their efforts; and how better than to send three girls she doesn't even like, all powerful and expecting danger.

Don't know who Rand is aside from maybe Jesus...

Look up King Fisher. Or the Fisher King. Or something like that.

According to some people, Rand has elements of him/it.

I wouldn't know myself.


Where we left off, NEE are asking Mat for a favour, except they go about asking in the worst possible way until Nyneave finally snaps and returns to her usually business like manner.

And yes, I snickered just like Mat when Elayne tried to command him.

"Are you a loyal subject of Andor? Do you not wish to serve the Loin Throne and your Daughter-Heir?"

This was, of course, right after she asked for help with a pretty smile, which Mat ignored, to Elayne's shock. Mat notes she probably gets her way alot with that smile.

Then there is Mat leaving, meeting Thom (which I didn't expect) and winning lots and lots of money via his super luck.

Oh, and Gray Men everywhere.

I've already counted at least 2 after Mat, 1 dead and 1 living, and at least 1 killed by Rand. If Perrin has been attacked by one I either missed the signs or have forgotten about it.

We're back to Perrin for awhile, and he's gone and done some stupid stuff for an Aiel, and got a girl following him in the bargain.

I wonder what her face will be like when she learns that the Horn is already recovered and blown.

I don't remember much of Faile, except that she and Perrin fall in love, and that there is quite some culture clash between them.

Anyway, Perrin has some more interesting dream advantures, spying on Forsaken during some of them.

Egwene is also Dreaming, but nothing of any use or importance.

There was one worrying scene with Rand, where he killed 10 men, and I'm like, are you sure they were DF's? There was no indication I saw that they were, but maybe I missed something?

 

[Steel]

Which book are you on?

 

[Ashaman]

I'm about 3/5 of the way through Dragon Reborn, on chapter 37.

 

[grant]

And if by this point you've gotten to the girl being sent to give the NEE that message it raises two very good questions that aren't really answered. Why are they still hunting once they know that cover's been blown and who was stupid enough to just prance around and indirectly let them tell them that their cover was blown?

i'm not sure what you mean by this bit.

Are you referring to Else/Lanfear delivering the message, or something more.

Maybe it'll become clear further on.

Yes, that. It's stupid for two reasons. The first is that now Siuan and the girls know that they don't have a cover anymore so it's fairly pointless for them to wander around trying to secretly catch the Black Ajah, the second is that it makes little sense for Else (who is probably Lanfear) to tell them any of this. Sure Lanfear likes to push how intelligent and great she is in other people's faces, but that's not the same as randomly warning them.

Hate to say it but Moghedion (the irritating plotting idiot who never shows much of her vaunted cleverness) handled it better than she did.

I think you're misunderstanding the situation slightly.

First of all, NEE are hunting Black Ajah, but the point is they know its a trap; they mean to spring the trap, but not get caught. That is why they continue to hunt.

Hell, it doesn't change anything except maybe Liannedrin now knows who is coming for her. They were all a target of the Blacks anyway.

Second; Lanfear is playing both sides. Depending on what the 13 Blacks are doing in Tear, and who ordered it, it might have been in Lanfears best interests to sabatage their efforts; and how better than to send three girls she doesn't even like, all powerful and expecting danger.

The problem is that the only reasons Siuan was using them was because she only had two Aes Sedai she could trust (why she didn't simply take some of the better Aes Sedai in the Tower, force them to retake the no-lying Oath and say 'I am not Black Ajah' is beyond me) and they could be covert. If their cover is blown it means that the three of them would be fighting experienced Aes Sedai who have no problem killing and access to several powerful artifacts.

And Lanfear doesn't seem the type to do anything to help potential rivals. Send a message to Rand maybe.

 

[Ashaman]

And if by this point you've gotten to the girl being sent to give the NEE that message it raises two very good questions that aren't really answered. Why are they still hunting once they know that cover's been blown and who was stupid enough to just prance around and indirectly let them tell them that their cover was blown?

i'm not sure what you mean by this bit.

Are you referring to Else/Lanfear delivering the message, or something more.

Maybe it'll become clear further on.

Yes, that. It's stupid for two reasons. The first is that now Siuan and the girls know that they don't have a cover anymore so it's fairly pointless for them to wander around trying to secretly catch the Black Ajah, the second is that it makes little sense for Else (who is probably Lanfear) to tell them any of this. Sure Lanfear likes to push how intelligent and great she is in other people's faces, but that's not the same as randomly warning them.

Hate to say it but Moghedion (the irritating plotting idiot who never shows much of her vaunted cleverness) handled it better than she did.

I think you're misunderstanding the situation slightly.

First of all, NEE are hunting Black Ajah, but the point is they know its a trap; they mean to spring the trap, but not get caught. That is why they continue to hunt.

Hell, it doesn't change anything except maybe Liannedrin now knows who is coming for her. They were all a target of the Blacks anyway.

Second; Lanfear is playing both sides. Depending on what the 13 Blacks are doing in Tear, and who ordered it, it might have been in Lanfears best interests to sabatage their efforts; and how better than to send three girls she doesn't even like, all powerful and expecting danger.

The problem is that the only reasons Siuan was using them was because she only had two Aes Sedai she could trust (why she didn't simply take some of the better Aes Sedai in the Tower, force them to retake the no-lying Oath and say 'I am not Black Ajah' is beyond me) and they could be covert. If their cover is blown it means that the three of them would be fighting experienced Aes Sedai who have no problem killing and access to several powerful artifacts.

And Lanfear doesn't seem the type to do anything to help potential rivals. Send a message to Rand maybe.

At this point, does she even know the 3 Oaths no longer effect them?

Cause I don't think they know that yet.


And while its true their cover is blown, they're still the only ones A-Seat can trust. And they're 'prepared' for a trap this time.


Really, you don't think Lanfear would use the 3 girls to save Rand? The way I see it, she doesn't even feel threatened by them, either as an enemy or as a woman.

I think Lanfear is using them to help Rand without having to meddle personally, and well, if 1 or 2 of them die, no skin off her back. In fact, its a plus for her.


Moving on, I'm only a little further along; Egwene and Nyneave are fighting. It seems that Egwene has finally had enough of Nyneave's bossy nature and has started rebelling. Basically, considering that this is how Egwene treats RPM, I have no sympathy for her.

Besides, Nyneave is still older, wiser and more experienced than Egwene, and in my opinion the natural choice of leader for the 3.