Harry Potter HP and the Gates Oblivion
- Thread starter mandalorianjedi
- Start date
How would it break the Peryite quest?
I don't remember ever wishing for levitation during that, unlike with some of the other quests...
EDIT: This brings up an interesting question-- can HP wizards levitate themselves? We've seen them levitate inanimate objects and make other people hover, but have we ever seen a wizard make himself fly?
I don't remember ever wishing for levitation during that, unlike with some of the other quests...
EDIT: This brings up an interesting question-- can HP wizards levitate themselves? We've seen them levitate inanimate objects and make other people hover, but have we ever seen a wizard make himself fly?
Almalexia, often thought to be as powerful as a diety, managed to forcibly supress levitation magic across the core section of her namesake city. That said, surely a daedra lord/prince can do the same inside their domains? Mind you, the Dwemer(Dwarves) used something resembling science to accomplish many of their works, and Almalexia has been shown, in canon, to make use of at least one and claim credit for it.
Mind you, the Dwemer went extinct for a VERY GOOD REASON - or so we are lead to believe.
Mind you, the Dwemer went extinct for a VERY GOOD REASON - or so we are lead to believe.
Quidditch Through The Ages is quite clear on the issue of flying. Wizards can charm other objects to fly, and then ride them (broomsticks, carpets, a reclining chair, or whatever), but there is no charm in existence that can make a human fly.
Wizards have been trying to attain unaided freeform flight (or 'true' flight, as they call it) for millennia. They have had no success, to the extent that it is considered impossible.
That's why what Voldemort managed at the end of the series was such a huge-ass deal. Him flying around zapping people would be the equivalent of Russia leveling Paris with an airship powered by a perpetual motion device. It's completely mindblowing.
That's why everyone shat bricks when he did it. No one had ever even gotten close to doing it, and it was considered to be impossible.
Wizards have been trying to attain unaided freeform flight (or 'true' flight, as they call it) for millennia. They have had no success, to the extent that it is considered impossible.
That's why what Voldemort managed at the end of the series was such a huge-ass deal. Him flying around zapping people would be the equivalent of Russia leveling Paris with an airship powered by a perpetual motion device. It's completely mindblowing.
That's why everyone shat bricks when he did it. No one had ever even gotten close to doing it, and it was considered to be impossible.
I saw that too in Quidditch Through the Ages, and to be honest I never understood it. Its not like flying is hard. For crying out loud, even muggles can do it. On the other hand, both Wingardium Leviosa and the other levitation methods in HP do truly horrifying and unspeakable things to Conservation of Momentum (and Energy), and since all muggle heavier than air flight is based on CoM principles, maybe thats why its so hard...
This is magic, not science. Given what else magic can do, it shouldn't be hard to resurrect the dead, but we know for a fact that that's completely impossible.
There are rules and laws for how magic works that are difficult, if not impossible, to overcome. And these rules and laws do not always make perfect sense.
Besides, it's not like there's no canon precedent for it. It's outright stated multiple times that the most difficult transfigurations to preform are human transfigurations. In theory, if you can turn a straw into a needle, and a tortoise into a hare, then you can turn a human into a shark.
However, we know for a fact that they are not the same thing, and that human transfiguration is the highest, most advanced, and most difficult of all the transfiguration arts. I seem to recall it being stated that it isn't even part of the standard curriculum at Hogwarts (it's something like a special advanced class, or something), but I can't remember where I heard that, so don't take my word on it.
It's made very clear throughout the series that the rules and equations change drastically when humans become part of the process. Everything we've ever seen in the series that is meant to directly transform or change the properties of a human is either difficult to do, incredibly risky, extremely complex, or all of the above.
Polyjuice potion is one of the most advanced potions in existence, and incredibly finicky. Strengthening Solution requires several dozen extremely rare ingredients, and is considered (IIRC) a Class B Controlled Substance. And human transfigurations are the hardest transfigurations in existence.
Honestly, I have no problem at all with the idea that you can't simply slap a Levitating or Flight charm on a human, and expect it to work the same way it does for a broom or a floating deckchair.
There are rules and laws for how magic works that are difficult, if not impossible, to overcome. And these rules and laws do not always make perfect sense.
Besides, it's not like there's no canon precedent for it. It's outright stated multiple times that the most difficult transfigurations to preform are human transfigurations. In theory, if you can turn a straw into a needle, and a tortoise into a hare, then you can turn a human into a shark.
However, we know for a fact that they are not the same thing, and that human transfiguration is the highest, most advanced, and most difficult of all the transfiguration arts. I seem to recall it being stated that it isn't even part of the standard curriculum at Hogwarts (it's something like a special advanced class, or something), but I can't remember where I heard that, so don't take my word on it.
It's made very clear throughout the series that the rules and equations change drastically when humans become part of the process. Everything we've ever seen in the series that is meant to directly transform or change the properties of a human is either difficult to do, incredibly risky, extremely complex, or all of the above.
Polyjuice potion is one of the most advanced potions in existence, and incredibly finicky. Strengthening Solution requires several dozen extremely rare ingredients, and is considered (IIRC) a Class B Controlled Substance. And human transfigurations are the hardest transfigurations in existence.
Honestly, I have no problem at all with the idea that you can't simply slap a Levitating or Flight charm on a human, and expect it to work the same way it does for a broom or a floating deckchair.
Of course it doesn't mean it can't be done, just that the results can and most often will be less than desirable and possibly random.
Despite the way some fics portray Voldemort as some sort of evil incompetant, he is a very brilliant and powerful wizard (possibly the absolute best of the age). So it's safe to say that if anyone could create a spell or simply power through the weaknesses of prior attempts at independant flight, it would be Voldemort.
With work, I bet Dumbledore probablly could have too, but he never had the need to show himself in a larger than life image. For Voldemort, independant flight was just another way to make himself look like an unstoppable juggernaut whom no one but the most exceptional of wizards had even the slightest hope of matching, let alone surpass and defeat.
Despite the way some fics portray Voldemort as some sort of evil incompetant, he is a very brilliant and powerful wizard (possibly the absolute best of the age). So it's safe to say that if anyone could create a spell or simply power through the weaknesses of prior attempts at independant flight, it would be Voldemort.
With work, I bet Dumbledore probablly could have too, but he never had the need to show himself in a larger than life image. For Voldemort, independant flight was just another way to make himself look like an unstoppable juggernaut whom no one but the most exceptional of wizards had even the slightest hope of matching, let alone surpass and defeat.
Aye. Dumbledore beat him. Though in all fairness, it was technically a joint-effort, as it could have only been pulled off if Harry was involved as the bait, even if the plan required him to be ignorant of his own role at the time.
Still, though. Majority credit goes to Dumbledore. Dumbledore and Snape. They got Tom's ass but good. I loved how he died in total denial of the whole thing, even after Harry spilled the whole nine yards for him at the very end.
Still, though. Majority credit goes to Dumbledore. Dumbledore and Snape. They got Tom's ass but good. I loved how he died in total denial of the whole thing, even after Harry spilled the whole nine yards for him at the very end.
Personally I'm uncertain why you couldn't build the broom charms into something you have in your clothing. Install some sort of reinforced webbing into your clothes so that they can support your weight well and evenly, and throw a robe over the whole thing so nobody can see.
Presto, I can achieve free-flight.
Presto, I can achieve free-flight.
Still, I don't think that would work... Not without seriously modifying the charms. After all, flight charms for a broom are likely to be different from ones for a flying carpet. I doubt too many people would want to put the effort into modifying the flight charms to make a "flight suit".
Considering it isn't known to us to have been done in the HPverse, either flight charms themselves are rather finicky or humanoid objects, not just humans themselves, are rather difficult to charm- or both.
Considering it isn't known to us to have been done in the HPverse, either flight charms themselves are rather finicky or humanoid objects, not just humans themselves, are rather difficult to charm- or both.
Or it might just be entirely impractical to make a 'flight suit'. IIRC the Firebolt or was it the Nimbus had specialty materials (twigs and wood) that was specially charmed. I doubt just any clothes would accept the materials. More I'm not sure but the broom sounds like, with the hundreds of bristles that the ywould all have pretty 'work of each other' kind of thing going. To get something different I doubt your going to get your jeans and tee-shirt as a flight suit and even if you did it would be incredibly uncomfortable to wear. There would have to be a LOT of stuff just included to make sure YOU didn't fall out of the clothes as they are floating while your just along for the road.
And of course there is the possibility that flight cant DIRECTLY be done simply because in effect your trying to pick yourself up of the ground by the scruff of your own neck. Its the justification that has been used in a lot of stories, that indirectly you can float above the ground (say if you created a platform of hardened air or something) but you cant just make yourself fly because you have no point of reference or such.
And of course there is the possibility that flight cant DIRECTLY be done simply because in effect your trying to pick yourself up of the ground by the scruff of your own neck. Its the justification that has been used in a lot of stories, that indirectly you can float above the ground (say if you created a platform of hardened air or something) but you cant just make yourself fly because you have no point of reference or such.
Does nobody read the parts where I said to include a reinforced webbing in the clothes? We have synthetics now with tensile strength much greater than steel. I don't see why this would be an issue. A couple straps of kevlar in the suit and the suit will survive the person being drawn and quartered.
Seriously making clothes that can hold a person's weight is not a major issue.
Seriously making clothes that can hold a person's weight is not a major issue.
We don't actually know that it is impossible to raise the dead in HP magic. All we know is that certain people in the HP world claim that it is impossible, just like they also claim that it is impossible to apparate in Hogwarts, which is patently false.
Despite the presence of magic, many if not all of the HP cast are far too free with the word "impossible".
"Its impossible to raise the dead." "Its impossible to apparate inside Hogwarts" " Its impossible to fly under your own power." "Its impossible to travel forward in time." "Its impossible to block the AK".
If muggles can fly under their own muscle power, magic should hardly make it harder. Travelling forward in time is probably the easiest thing in the world. I know I do it every day, and I'm fairly certain that you do too. We see the AK get blocked, again and again, yet for some reason they maintain its not possible. And even if you modify the statement about apparition in Hogwarts by adding "while the wards preventing it are active", then I would still bet good money that it isn't impossible, merely difficult.
I don't believe that these things are in any way easy to do )except travelling forward in time), but a moderatly powerful wizard or witch with a good imagination and the willingness to try could almost certainly do most of these things.
After all; Voldemort flew.
Despite the presence of magic, many if not all of the HP cast are far too free with the word "impossible".
"Its impossible to raise the dead." "Its impossible to apparate inside Hogwarts" " Its impossible to fly under your own power." "Its impossible to travel forward in time." "Its impossible to block the AK".
If muggles can fly under their own muscle power, magic should hardly make it harder. Travelling forward in time is probably the easiest thing in the world. I know I do it every day, and I'm fairly certain that you do too. We see the AK get blocked, again and again, yet for some reason they maintain its not possible. And even if you modify the statement about apparition in Hogwarts by adding "while the wards preventing it are active", then I would still bet good money that it isn't impossible, merely difficult.
I don't believe that these things are in any way easy to do )except travelling forward in time), but a moderatly powerful wizard or witch with a good imagination and the willingness to try could almost certainly do most of these things.
After all; Voldemort flew.
Maybe in the muggle world. But wizards have an unhealthy disregard of muggles, so wool and cotton would be about as far as they would go. It's easy to say 'hey they would easily be able to create specifically designed clothing that can hold the weight of a human because of its synthesised patterned weavings'... but a wizard wouldn't know the difference between denim and chorduroy, because they would never have made the machines that could produce either.
Besides all that, I was just joking. Chill.
Besides all that, I was just joking. Chill.