One Piece Manga Discussion
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It's not the sea/ocean that saps/supresses the Devil Fruit Powers, it's the Kairouseki within the sea that saps them so if you put Luffy in fresh water(no Kairouseki), he'd still drown (cannot swim) but he could use his rubber powers to get himself out. Evidence that it's the Kairouseki and not the sea? In page 70 of volume 26 there is an explanation.
That doesn't refer to the power of the sea being a result of kairouseki at all! It still implies that kairouseki is distilled essence of the sea. Because when it comes in contact with the clouds it forms a sea. They don't even say the kairouseki is in their sea clouds, they say a certain substance reacts with the clouds to form sea and island clouds.
Besides which Luffy before becoming a hammer was a great swimmer. This is mentioned by Shanks' crew. Why would he drown if his powers weren't being sapped?
Let's not forget all the times when they say kairouseki gives off the same energy as the sea, or other such things which I know is said by the people who use kairouseki at least twice. Why would they say that if it is really the kairouseki giving off all of the sea's energy?
Next how is it that the kairouseki effect is transmitted through the water for thousands of meters, but stops at the surface of the water without radiating even a meter further?
Finally why would Kalifa be bathing in a kairouseki bath tub? Because she admits that while bathing her powers are negated over the submerged area. She was in a bath tub, which is presumably not connected to the sea. Why the hell are they making kairouseki bath tubs?
Besides which Luffy before becoming a hammer was a great swimmer. This is mentioned by Shanks' crew. Why would he drown if his powers weren't being sapped?
Let's not forget all the times when they say kairouseki gives off the same energy as the sea, or other such things which I know is said by the people who use kairouseki at least twice. Why would they say that if it is really the kairouseki giving off all of the sea's energy?
Next how is it that the kairouseki effect is transmitted through the water for thousands of meters, but stops at the surface of the water without radiating even a meter further?
Finally why would Kalifa be bathing in a kairouseki bath tub? Because she admits that while bathing her powers are negated over the submerged area. She was in a bath tub, which is presumably not connected to the sea. Why the hell are they making kairouseki bath tubs?
No, they said that he couldn't be a pirate just because he was a great swimmer. I watched the relevant episodes this weekend.
Edit: Interesting, it is the opposite in the manga. I didn't know that. I just looked it up. In the manga they say he can't swim, in the anime they said he was a great swimmer.
Edit: Interesting, it is the opposite in the manga. I didn't know that. I just looked it up. In the manga they say he can't swim, in the anime they said he was a great swimmer.
Another reason I read/watch whichever came first. In the comic, the called Luffy an 'Iron Hammer' an idiom for people who can't swim. The kairouseki is a mineral that is formed in the earth, expelled into the air and ocean through volcanic activity and used to capture people with DF powers. I think somewhere there is a distinction made between kairouseki and sea stone, a stone that is a distilled essence of the sea. A sea stone is a stone that emits the same energy as the sea so that Navy ships can sail with ease. Also, the sea clouds in skypeia are made by Kairouseki and that's why Luffy drowned instead of using his Gum Gum powers to get himself out.
I'm thinking they didn't know Buggy was a fruit user and so he escaped using his powers.
Luffy's in trouble now. I imagine his way is going to involve something stupid and end in battle, and then the marines will be looking to Hancock for help, and she'll just blame it on the kairouseki handcuffs.
Also there is no distinction between kairouseki and sea stone, one is translated and one is not.
Luffy's in trouble now. I imagine his way is going to involve something stupid and end in battle, and then the marines will be looking to Hancock for help, and she'll just blame it on the kairouseki handcuffs.
Also there is no distinction between kairouseki and sea stone, one is translated and one is not.
Really? I've always thought that Kairouseki and Sea stone are different things because during the Skypeia arc onwards they used the term kairouseki for the clouds and supressor cuffs and post Enies Lobby, Coby mentions that the Navy ships are lined with Sea stone. If Kairouseki and Sea stone are the same, the translator group, and I only stick to one - null scans, would've just stick with one term, be it Kairouseki or sea stone to describe the cuffs and stuff.
I could be wrong though because I'm not fluent enough in Japanese to read the raws myself to confirm but until I am or the groups says so, I'm sticking to my opinion that Kairouseki and sea stone are different things. Maybe more light would be shed on this subject matter when Vegapunk is introduced since he's the lead researcher on DF technology.
I could be wrong though because I'm not fluent enough in Japanese to read the raws myself to confirm but until I am or the groups says so, I'm sticking to my opinion that Kairouseki and sea stone are different things. Maybe more light would be shed on this subject matter when Vegapunk is introduced since he's the lead researcher on DF technology.
kairouseki = kai(sea) + rou(tower) + seki(stone)
So it should actually be "sea tower stone", but that doesn't really make much sense in English so they drop the "tower". I'm very surprised that you thought it two separate things. I seem to remember seeing a translation note about kairouseki before also.
So it should actually be "sea tower stone", but that doesn't really make much sense in English so they drop the "tower". I'm very surprised that you thought it two separate things. I seem to remember seeing a translation note about kairouseki before also.
Huh... the only way I can see Luffy getting past a body check is a feat of stretching the likes of which only Mr. Fantastic himself is capable of. Or using Hancock to her fullest advantage (BODY check. You know what that means). I suppose he might get by if they focus enough on the body while he instead moves inside the cloak or something, but frankly this is going to be tricky no matter what...
Either way this is shaping up to be interesting.
Also, I thought for sure Alvida was going to be an awesome plot point to an epic catfight. Blast.
Either way this is shaping up to be interesting.
Also, I thought for sure Alvida was going to be an awesome plot point to an epic catfight. Blast.
You never know, Alvida could decide to join. She is fickle after all. On the note of Kairouseki, damn! That's what I get for not buying latest tankoubons. I always remembered sea as Umi and forgot that it could also be called kai. Need to brush up more. May need to revise my opinions. Also buy volume 20 onwards, Jap version. I've been putting it off for too long. *mutter* *mutter*
Edit: and find kanji dictionary.
Edit: and find kanji dictionary.
Okay, from reviewing of anime and comparison to manga I can definitely say that kairouseki = sea stone. In the anime when Coby is telling Luffy about the ships being lined with "sea stone" he is actually saying the word kairouseki. You can check this in episode 315. In the manga during the Alabasta arc Smoker explains "sea stone" while using his sea stone weapon to negate Luffy's strength. Look at his explanation on this page and the next one Chapter 169. Smoker's explanation is almost certainly the author's voice on this subject, and he defines it quite explicitly.
Is the equivalence obvious to you yet?
Is the equivalence obvious to you yet?
I don't watch the anime sadly so I didn't know about that. I have to ask around for the anime. I think I have a friend who has it. Checking the manga, I'm surprised that I forgot about smoker's seastone weapon. Dang!
Well, that settles it then. Kairouseki = sea stone. Oh well. Gotta go and find someone who has the anime and watch it. I have a month long vacation and I intend to spend all of it catching up to all my missed manga reading and anime marathons. Been meaning to watch TTGL too so... off I go!
Well, that settles it then. Kairouseki = sea stone. Oh well. Gotta go and find someone who has the anime and watch it. I have a month long vacation and I intend to spend all of it catching up to all my missed manga reading and anime marathons. Been meaning to watch TTGL too so... off I go!
I reread some of the Arabasta arc recently... and suddenly realized why I didn't like it so much... there were so many freaking times they revealed past information via flashbacks to create tension that it wasn't funny. I mean, if you're going to do it that often it's probably wiser to keep things in order.
Luckily this nasty habit isn't as apparent in the Skypedia arc, which is taking a while to get epic... :mellow:
Now the CP9 arc, that's when the real epic came into play.
Luckily this nasty habit isn't as apparent in the Skypedia arc, which is taking a while to get epic... :mellow:
Now the CP9 arc, that's when the real epic came into play.